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Contributor
Star_Gazer
Posts: 24
Registered: ‎03-18-2009

Re: Books on Lost

Ok, I started reading the book again.  Here is something that really struck me:  "It isn't a matter of forgetting.  What one has to learn is how to remember and yet be free of the past.  How to be there with the dead and yet still be here, on the spot, with the living."..."It isn't easy."

 

Is this the struggle the 815ers have to go through.  They have to remember their flaws, learn from them, to be free of the past, and walk amongst the dead(Christian, Charlie, Black Horse, Richard?) also walking amongst the dead by going back in time (Ethan, little ben, Charolette) and exisit in the present (time of the crash)...interesting.  If they can't do that (Ecco) the time/course corrector comes out Smokey.

Contributor
Star_Gazer
Posts: 24
Registered: ‎03-18-2009

Re: Books on Lost

SPOILER AlERT

 

I don't know why I expected more from last nights episode.  Maybe I was too distracted while watching it.  I will watch it again tonight.  I always watch each episode twice.  I understand why Ben didn't shoot Penny.  It was too much like what happened when he took Alex from Danielle. 

 

We got to see the inside of the temple and where Smokey actually resides.  I do suspect he has other exit points, but that must have been the main one.  Now, I have to research Egyptian history to find out if that was RA or Annubis or it could be some totally different God that they showed summoning the monster in the drawings.

 

We still don't know what the rules are, but I guess they were all made by Jacob.  Who is Jacob?  It isn't Richard, and it isn't Christian.  Is it smokey manifested as a different person?

 

So, was Alex supposed to die all along????  Like Charles said if the island wants her dead, she will die. 

 

That was so freaky in the temple.  I knew Alex was going to show up like Echo's brother did. The monster manifested itself.  I have a question.  I am rewatching old episodes, and I am just about to watch the one where John's Dad shows up and he gets Sawyer to kill him.

 

The box that Ben said makes whatever you want is that Smokey?  Did they really kill his dad, or was that the monster manifested, and if so, was that Sawyer and Locke getting over there past.  Was that the island trying to help them?  Sawyer changed after that episode. 

Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost

Okay so who liked last night's show? It was interesting to say the least but I was expecting more. I think that the reason Ben was allowed to live was that he (at least to me) appeared to be sorry for his "sins" (allowing Alex to be killed & trying to kill Penny (but we still don't know if she's dead more on that later). SO sort of like saying his act of contrition Ben was sorry for his past bad deeds so he was forgiven.

 

Did like how they went into better detail of smokey & how he presents your past to you (sort of like defending your life) they did it in a smaller way w/Eco (only if you freeze-framed it did you see anything in his smoke).

 

Interesting how Widmore said of Alex if the island wants her dead she will die. I do want to know why he was taken off the island in handcuffs.

 

Now just because we saw Des beat up Ben & toss him into the drink we didn't see how he got out of the water. It didn't look like he got his arm hurt when Des beat him up so there is still more to the story. I think Penny is dead or at the very least got seriously hurt which is why Ben told Sun to apologize to Des if she ever gets off the island.

 

Also what did the hieroglyphics mean on the wall in Ben's house? Looked Egyptian didn't they?

 

Oh & that woman who brought Sayid to the island her & a couple of other guys took charge okay so who are they w/Widmore, Dharma some other group we don't even know of & what's in that big steel crate (I think it's Widmore come back to the island).

Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


Star_Gazer wrote:

SPOILER AlERT

 

I don't know why I expected more from last nights episode.  Maybe I was too distracted while watching it.  I will watch it again tonight.  I always watch each episode twice.  I understand why Ben didn't shoot Penny.  It was too much like what happened when he took Alex from Danielle. 

 

We got to see the inside of the temple and where Smokey actually resides.  I do suspect he has other exit points, but that must have been the main one.  Now, I have to research Egyptian history to find out if that was RA or Annubis or it could be some totally different God that they showed summoning the monster in the drawings.

 

We still don't know what the rules are, but I guess they were all made by Jacob.  Who is Jacob?  It isn't Richard, and it isn't Christian.  Is it smokey manifested as a different person?

 

So, was Alex supposed to die all along????  Like Charles said if the island wants her dead, she will die. 

 

That was so freaky in the temple.  I knew Alex was going to show up like Echo's brother did. The monster manifested itself.  I have a question.  I am rewatching old episodes, and I am just about to watch the one where John's Dad shows up and he gets Sawyer to kill him.

 

The box that Ben said makes whatever you want is that Smokey?  Did they really kill his dad, or was that the monster manifested, and if so, was that Sawyer and Locke getting over there past.  Was that the island trying to help them?  Sawyer changed after that episode. 


I do think that for some the island is their chance to atone for their sins or get retribution for past injustices. Like you said for Sawyer once he killed the man from Tallahassee (or Locke's Father Tom Sawyer) he was able to shed his past life & be the man he was should have been allowed to be if his parents didn't die due to Locke's father. Sawyer is now a man w/power & respect two things he never had before & also someone who loves him for him something he also never had.

 

Anyone else get an Indy Jones thought when smokey wrapped up around Ben in the temple basement?

 

Also I loved when Locke says to Sun I'm the same man I always was guess he was trying to let her know that even though he died it was still the same old Johnny:smileywink:. Also loved how he put Ben in his place by saying hey it's no fun being a follower now is it well that's what you did to me sucks huh?:smileyvery-happy:

 

 

Contributor
TVGAL242
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎03-19-2009

Re: Books on Lost

Like the previous posters said, I too was expecting something a little more OMG last night. Something along the lines of Ben vs. The Smoke Monster, perhaps, and loses. But that's silly because they can't kill off Ben...or can they?

 

Dead is dead, Ben tells Locke. This just happens to be the title of the ep, but clearly that's not true b/c Locke came back to life; Ben was brought back from near death by the smoke monster; Christian, whom we assume is dead, could be like Locke -- very much alive. And have we seen the last of Ceasar even though Ben put a big ol' bullet in his chest? Not to mention Richard -- there must be some heavy-duty Botox on The Island because the man has not a wrinkle or crow's foot.

 

Jacob was mentioned several times last night, but we're still not sure who he is. And my favorite, and maybe later on important line, was when Richard said, The Island chooses who The Island chooses. Okay, so I'm thinking Jacob may be the conduit through which The Island speaks or is it just that The Island corrects itself. Alex, it seems, was supposed to die either way. Prolly the latter.

 

Now we have to wonder what Ilana and her peeps are doing with that huge container? ("What lies in the shadow of the statue?") Was there a tribal council meeting and Charles Widmore was voted off? Why he can't go back?

 

----------------------

 

And here's a little message for the fans of J.J.'s other show, Fringe! I spotted The Observer in the audience on American Idol on Tuesday night!! Very cool!

Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost

Oh & yeah who believed Ben when he told Locke that he killed him because it was the only way to get them all back on the island? Yeah right Alex, ghost Alex, Smokey Alex whoever it was nailed Ben on his still trying to get Locke out as the leader because Ben wants Locke gone to resume his role as the leader but can you do that once you've been deposed as leader can you come back again? Will the island allow it?  

 

Oh & next week looks good we get to know about he who talks to dead people or Miles J more of the Miles & Hurley show so that should be good. I’d like to know who that was in the body bag too.

 

I also read that Jacob has been cast so hopefully we will see him before the end of the season. Is he the one who stops Miles next week. Can't wait to see how Miles plays into this all. Is he the Dr.'s kid like I've read on other boards?

Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


TVGAL242 wrote:

Like the previous posters said, I too was expecting something a little more OMG last night. Something along the lines of Ben vs. The Smoke Monster, perhaps, and loses. But that's silly because they can't kill off Ben...or can they?

 

Dead is dead, Ben tells Locke. This just happens to be the title of the ep, but clearly that's not true b/c Locke came back to life; Ben was brought back from near death by the smoke monster; Christian, whom we assume is dead, could be like Locke -- very much alive. And have we seen the last of Ceasar even though Ben put a big ol' bullet in his chest? Not to mention Richard -- there must be some heavy-duty Botox on The Island because the man has not a wrinkle or crow's foot.

 

Jacob was mentioned several times last night, but we're still not sure who he is. And my favorite, and maybe later on important line, was when Richard said, The Island chooses who The Island chooses. Okay, so I'm thinking Jacob may be the conduit through which The Island speaks or is it just that The Island corrects itself. Alex, it seems, was supposed to die either way. Prolly the latter.

 

Now we have to wonder what Ilana and her peeps are doing with that huge container? ("What lies in the shadow of the statue?") Was there a tribal council meeting and Charles Widmore was voted off? Why he can't go back?

 

----------------------

 

And here's a little message for the fans of J.J.'s other show, Fringe! I spotted The Observer in the audience on American Idol on Tuesday night!! Very cool!


Yeah poor Frank getting smacked in the head cause he didn't know the answer t What lies in the shaow of the statue? I really wonder if that is Widmore in the big case/coffin? Is that how he get's back to the island & will this be the war that he said to Locke when he left the island?

 

Guess we're going back to that statue maybe we'll get to see the front of it or is all that is left the 4 toes?

 

Oh another point. Locke had the broken leg but he's now walking around fine on the island guess death fixes that huh?:smileywink:

 

 

Contributor
TVGAL242
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎03-19-2009

Re: Books on Lost

Hey, I used a Tribal Council reference, too! Think Doc Jensen is reading out posts? :smileytongue:
Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


TVGAL242 wrote:
Hey, I used a Tribal Council reference, too! Think Doc Jensen is reading out posts? :smileytongue:

Yeah just read that as well pretty funny I was waiting for him to make a connection w/Probst & Richard or Locke :smileyvery-happy:

 

What was interesting that he said was that the question that Ilana said to Lapidus - What lies in the shadow of the statue? - Jughead - well hey that's a good thought that would explain why (if it's by the temple) they built the wall around it so anyone but the others can get to it (or even know of it).

 

One thing that just came to me we've seen Eloise & Widmore have aged since they left the island & Ben has aged from what child why does Richard not age? They really need to address that.

 

Also the two shootings from last night (Des & Caesar) we see them go down but Des got up & it didn't look like he had any blood on him so was the bullet stopped by a magic can of corn? or was he wearing a bullet proof vest knowing that he may be in danger?

 

As for Caesar we see him go down but again NO BLOOD so is it the island intervening and not allowing someone to die (Jack, Michael, Ben, Locke) unless it's their time & maybe it was not his time? Like Widmore told Ben just cause he didn't kill Alex doesn't mean she's not going to die it was her time & he stopped it. (Did that cause the baby problem was she not suppose to live?).

 

Funny how most people on the island have Daddy issues but Ben as tough as he is has a soft spot for mommies. Really these guys who write this really seem to have mommy/daddy issues :smileyhappy:what's that all about.

Frequent Contributor
Lmfwhite
Posts: 185
Registered: ‎07-07-2008

Re: Books on Lost


Diane32 wrote:

 

Now just because we saw Des beat up Ben & toss him into the drink we didn't see how he got out of the water. It didn't look like he got his arm hurt when Des beat him up so there is still more to the story. I think Penny is dead or at the very least got seriously hurt which is why Ben told Sun to apologize to Des if she ever gets off the island.


 

My take on this was that the writers wanted us to believe that Penny was dead when Ben said "Tell Desmond I'm sorry".  But after seeing the "fight" scene, a bullet was never fired at Penny and I just assumed that Ben was apologizing because he felt he was forced to kill Penny to avenge Alex's death even though he didn't want to.

 

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Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


Lmfwhite wrote:

Diane32 wrote:

 

Now just because we saw Des beat up Ben & toss him into the drink we didn't see how he got out of the water. It didn't look like he got his arm hurt when Des beat him up so there is still more to the story. I think Penny is dead or at the very least got seriously hurt which is why Ben told Sun to apologize to Des if she ever gets off the island.


 

My take on this was that the writers wanted us to believe that Penny was dead when Ben said "Tell Desmond I'm sorry".  But after seeing the "fight" scene, a bullet was never fired at Penny and I just assumed that Ben was apologizing because he felt he was forced to kill Penny to avenge Alex's death even though he didn't want to.

 


 

Yeah there's got to be more to it Des has to come back to the island that can't be the end of his story (at least I hope it's not the end he's too cute not to have back :womanwink:) so that along with how did Ben's arm wind up needing a sling there's more to this story whether it was Widmore's people who gave Ben an additional beat down or he comes back & gets rid of Penny or Des goes after him to make sure he's dead & something goes wrong something caused him to need that sling. Guess we'll just have to wait & see.
Inspired Contributor
gegarland
Posts: 191
Registered: ‎01-27-2008

Re: Books on Lost


Diane32 wrote:
[...]so that along with how did Ben's arm wind up needing a sling there's more to this story whether it was Widmore's people who gave Ben an additional beat down or he comes back & gets rid of Penny or Des goes after him to make sure he's dead & something goes wrong something caused him to need that sling. Guess we'll just have to wait & see.

My guess is there was nothing wrong with his arm; he was just hoping for sympathy and maybe some tlc from Sun and Kate. I hear chicks really dig that bug-eyed sociopath vibe.

};->

 

Alive, occupying space, and exerting gravitational force
Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


gegarland wrote:

Diane32 wrote:
[...]so that along with how did Ben's arm wind up needing a sling there's more to this story whether it was Widmore's people who gave Ben an additional beat down or he comes back & gets rid of Penny or Des goes after him to make sure he's dead & something goes wrong something caused him to need that sling. Guess we'll just have to wait & see.

My guess is there was nothing wrong with his arm; he was just hoping for sympathy and maybe some tlc from Sun and Kate. I hear chicks really dig that bug-eyed sociopath vibe.

};->

 


 

Okay that also makes sense just hoping that we get Des back soon since we finally found out what happened to Daniel (yeah he showed up last night & was w/the people from MN)
Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost

Okay so let's get into last night's show. Interesting to find out what Miles' "powers" are. I did like how Hurley was like yeah so me too. How funny was he when he said guess my powers are better (since he can play chess w/his dead people :smileyvery-happy:). Okay so I'm guessing they were at the hatch (not sure if that was where Jughead was as well but it is where the electro-magnetic field was remember when Jack showed Sayid I believe how there was the magnetic field by how the key around it neck went towards the wall?) so that's how the guy's tooth got pulled out of his head :womansurprised: ouch on that one) Now did I miss it any idea why Miles & his mom left the island and was she really mad at hubby or just trying to save her kid?

 

I wish that Jack & Kate would just shut UP!! they are making more trouble for themselves every time they open their mouths. Kate is going to be the death of them all. She means well:smileymad: (yeah right) but is going to get them all killed & then Jack literally following behind to clean up for her (guess that's why he's the janitor) he's not helping either.

 

Okay & who didn't give a cheer when Sawyer knocked out that guy the jerky one (notice this guy seems to play jerks all the time well he did on Mad Men). But now what are they going to do w/him? I'd send him over to Richard & the others but that's just me.

 

SO what did we learn w/this episode last night did it move the story along at all or just give us another reason why someone has daddy issues? I did like what Hurley had to say maybe that's what they all have to work out and learn how to forgive?

Frequent Contributor
Lmfwhite
Posts: 185
Registered: ‎07-07-2008

Re: Books on Lost


Diane32 wrote:

Okay so let's get into last night's show. Interesting to find out what Miles' "powers" are. I did like how Hurley was like yeah so me too. How funny was he when he said guess my powers are better (since he can play chess w/his dead people :smileyvery-happy:). Okay so I'm guessing they were at the hatch (not sure if that was where Jughead was as well but it is where the electro-magnetic field was remember when Jack showed Sayid I believe how there was the magnetic field by how the key around it neck went towards the wall?) so that's how the guy's tooth got pulled out of his head :womansurprised: ouch on that one) Now did I miss it any idea why Miles & his mom left the island and was she really mad at hubby or just trying to save her kid?

 


At least we have a glimpse as to why Miles has these powers....has to have something to do with being born on the island. We didn't find out why Mom left the island but I'm assuming Miles must have "talked" to his mom after she died to find out where his father was.  When Naomi offered him the job with Widmore, Miles didn't know at the time that he would be going to the island where his father had lived.  (or did he?) 

 

I agree that watching Miles and Hurley is so much fun.  I loved it when Hurley said "Hey, maybe you can hold your baby self or change your own diapers....how cool is that???"

 

And there's that statement again that was asked of Miles "Do you know what lies in the shadow of the statue?"  Illana had asked Lapidus, didn't she? 

Contributor
Star_Gazer
Posts: 24
Registered: ‎03-18-2009

Re: Books on Lost

Well, we always knew Miles could talk to dead people.  We just want to know why, or a little more about the how.

 

When you go back to the beginning of this season you see Dr. Candle/Chang saying that if we are seeing this video than they are dead, and he started the episode taking care of his son while his wife slept. He seemed to know the purge was coming (Did Faraday clue him in?)  I think he got his wife and son out on the last sub before the purge and he told her if she ever came back, or the son they would die.  I think she was telling him lies to keep Miles away, and that was proven by Miles watching his dad read to him.  He did care/love him.

 

We all know the hatch was important, but we don't know why.  Did the button really have to be pushed.  I think it did because of the electromagnetic field that was evidently getting stronger and stronger (pulled the tooth through the skull)  So, Dr. Chang came up with an "experiment" with two stations, one to watch and log them pushing, and one to do the pushing.  Desmond missed pushing the button and flight 815 came down.  The second time it blew after Desmond turned the control key.

 

I wonder what the long time affects of the electromagnet are?  I wonder if they will explain that in the end, if that has anything to do with anything.

 

The temple and the hatch are far away from each other.  Can anyone tell me if the statue and the hatch are in close proximity?  If they are then I think Smokey lies at the foot of the statue, or Jacob.  Jacob could be the key word, and those that know Jacob have power.  Widmore, Ben, and Richard would know how to answer the question.

Correspondent
Diane32
Posts: 89
Registered: ‎03-18-2009
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Re: Books on Lost


Lmfwhite wrote:

Diane32 wrote:

Okay so let's get into last night's show. Interesting to find out what Miles' "powers" are. I did like how Hurley was like yeah so me too. How funny was he when he said guess my powers are better (since he can play chess w/his dead people :smileyvery-happy:). Okay so I'm guessing they were at the hatch (not sure if that was where Jughead was as well but it is where the electro-magnetic field was remember when Jack showed Sayid I believe how there was the magnetic field by how the key around it neck went towards the wall?) so that's how the guy's tooth got pulled out of his head :womansurprised: ouch on that one) Now did I miss it any idea why Miles & his mom left the island and was she really mad at hubby or just trying to save her kid?

 


At least we have a glimpse as to why Miles has these powers....has to have something to do with being born on the island. We didn't find out why Mom left the island but I'm assuming Miles must have "talked" to his mom after she died to find out where his father was.  When Naomi offered him the job with Widmore, Miles didn't know at the time that he would be going to the island where his father had lived.  (or did he?) 

 

I agree that watching Miles and Hurley is so much fun.  I loved it when Hurley said "Hey, maybe you can hold your baby self or change your own diapers....how cool is that???"

 

And there's that statement again that was asked of Miles "Do you know what lies in the shadow of the statue?"  Illana had asked Lapidus, didn't she? 


 

Yeah she did & the guy who grabbed Miles off the street (& owes him the fish taco:womanhappy:) is the guy who was on the island with them. I wonder how many other people could not get on the plane w/them but were suppose to but Hurley bought all the tickets.

 

That must be the password for being in the group. But if they don't work for Widmore who do they work for? Ben? Dharma? Someone else that we don't know yet? Are they the others??????

Contributor
TVGAL242
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎03-19-2009
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Re: Books on Lost

Good morning my Literally Lost brethren!

 

I will read and post after my meeting this morning.

 

Yeah, I know! How dare work intrude on my Lost time!

Inspired Contributor
gegarland
Posts: 191
Registered: ‎01-27-2008

Re: Books on Lost


Diane32 wrote:

 

That must be the password for being in the group. But if they don't work for Widmore who do they work for? Ben? Dharma? Someone else that we don't know yet? Are they the others??????


Remember when Ben said "We're the good guys" way back when? I had been assuming that Charles Widmore or Eloise Hawking were the leaders of the "bad guys", but now that they seem to be exiled members of the Others, I'm thinking the bad guys are former members of the Dharma Intiative trying to get back to the Island. Maybe the reason the Others originally wiped out the Dharma operatives on the Island was that the "bad guys" had infiltrated the D.I. and were going to seek to manipulate the Island towards their own ends. Wipe out the D.I., move the Island, and they are shut out. They can't find the Island again because the Orchid station the D.I. is building now controls the anomolous energy source that originally allowed them to find the Island. Recall that when Desmond had to resort to the failsafe that led to a massive energy release, Penny Widmore's team detected it and it led her there in time to rescue the Oceanic 6. Unfortunately Charles Widmore's group of mercenaries got there first; he was obviously looking for it, too. Now that the Orchid station is no more, the energy anomaly is free to randomly release small amounts of energy; e.g., just enough to rip one man's tooth from his skull without harming anyone else. The Dharma members who weren't on the Island at the time of the massacre also know how to detect and track those fluctuations back to the Island using a big pendulum thing like the one Eloise Hawking was using.

 

 

 

Alive, occupying space, and exerting gravitational force
Inspired Contributor
gegarland
Posts: 191
Registered: ‎01-27-2008

Re: Literarily Lost TV Show

Some more physics geekiness about the nature of time... without going into hard core details (which I don't really understand, either) there is this idea in physics that time does not exist as a fundamental property of the universe. It is what is called an emergent property of the underlying reality; our perception of time and its bizarre separation of "past" and "future" (at least from the perspective of our current understanding of the fundamental nature of physical forces which make no distinction between past and future) makes at least some physicists grumble and mutter and say there is something that is just _missing_ here. Let's bring in the fundamental dichotomy between Jack's science and Locke's mysticism now. What determines what "time" emerges from all the possible times? What if intelligence, or a consciousness of some kind, is what imposes the order of time onto the fundamentally chaotic laws of physics? Every remotely consciouse entity "percieves" the universe and tries to impose its sense of order upon it; history as we know it just the amalgam of all these "times" averaged into some sort of coherent whole. The Island is a nexus of times where intelligent actors can exert massive influence upon which "time"'s get the heaviest influence on the actual time amalgam. Ben was saved because the Island judged his actions (however heinous they have might seem) to be better for achieving the "right" time amalgam. Maybe the "good guys" are those who support ensuring the Island's view of how the future should develop for all of mankind; maybe the "bad guys" are those who want to use the Island's capabilities for their own ends.

 

Alive, occupying space, and exerting gravitational force