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LizzieAnn
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North & South - Writing

I have to comment on how much I love the writing .. the style .. the words themselves. So many rich lines about the emotions of both Margaret & John. The following passages so illustrate John's deep love and passion.


"In the first place, there was selfishness enough in him to have taken pleasure in the idea that his great love might come in to comfort and console her; much the same kind of strange passionate pleasure which comes stinging through a mother's heart, when her drooping infant nestles close to her, and is dependent upon her for everything."

"Yes! he knew how she would love. He had not loved her without gaining that instinctive knowledge of what capabilities were in her. Her soul would walk in glorious sunlight if any man was worthy, by his power to loving, to win back her love."
Liz ♥ ♥


Some books are to be tasted, others to be swallowed, and some few to be chewed and digested. ~ Francis Bacon
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Choisya
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Re: North & South - Writing

Yes, she is a very poetic writer isn't she Lizzie-Ann - a lovely passage. Thanks.




LizzieAnn wrote:
I have to comment on how much I love the writing .. the style .. the words themselves. So many rich lines about the emotions of both Margaret & John. The following passages so illustrate John's deep love and passion.


"In the first place, there was selfishness enough in him to have taken pleasure in the idea that his great love might come in to comfort and console her; much the same kind of strange passionate pleasure which comes stinging through a mother's heart, when her drooping infant nestles close to her, and is dependent upon her for everything."

"Yes! he knew how she would love. He had not loved her without gaining that instinctive knowledge of what capabilities were in her. Her soul would walk in glorious sunlight if any man was worthy, by his power to loving, to win back her love."



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NORTH AND SOUTH, Ch. XXXIII (Vol. II, Ch. VIII): John

[ Edited ]
Do we know if EG's portrayal of John, as a man in love, is credible? Does anyone know if male literary critics have commented on this?


Choisya wrote:
Yes, she is a very poetic writer isn't she Lizzie-Ann - a lovely passage. Thanks.

LizzieAnn wrote:
I have to comment on how much I love the writing .. the style .. the words themselves. So many rich lines about the emotions of both Margaret & John. The following passages so illustrate John's deep love and passion.


"In the first place, there was selfishness enough in him to have taken pleasure in the idea that his great love might come in to comfort and console her; much the same kind of strange passionate pleasure which comes stinging through a mother's heart, when her drooping infant nestles close to her, and is dependent upon her for everything."

"Yes! he knew how she would love. He had not loved her without gaining that instinctive knowledge of what capabilities were in her. Her soul would walk in glorious sunlight if any man was worthy, by his power to loving, to win back her love."


Message Edited by pmath on 01-19-200711:34 AM

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Choisya
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Re: NORTH AND SOUTH, Chapter XXXIII: John & B&N Norton Critical edition.

[ Edited ]
Apparently the B&N Norton Critical Edition of N&S contains Notes etc by a prominent Gaskell scholar, Alan Shelston. If anyone here has this edition perhaps they could quote one or two of his comments on Thornton? (Or maybe Ilana could?) As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/BookSearch/isbnInquiry.asp?EAN=9780393979084




pmath wrote:
Do we know if EG's portrayal of John, as a man in love, is credible? Does anyone know if male literary critics have commented on this?


Choisya wrote:
Yes, she is a very poetic writer isn't she Lizzie-Ann - a lovely passage. Thanks.

LizzieAnn wrote:
I have to comment on how much I love the writing .. the style .. the words themselves. So many rich lines about the emotions of both Margaret & John. The following passages so illustrate John's deep love and passion.


"In the first place, there was selfishness enough in him to have taken pleasure in the idea that his great love might come in to comfort and console her; much the same kind of strange passionate pleasure which comes stinging through a mother's heart, when her drooping infant nestles close to her, and is dependent upon her for everything."

"Yes! he knew how she would love. He had not loved her without gaining that instinctive knowledge of what capabilities were in her. Her soul would walk in glorious sunlight if any man was worthy, by his power to loving, to win back her love."




Message Edited by Choisya on 01-18-200711:11 PM

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NORTH AND SOUTH, through Ch. XXXIII (Vol. II, Ch. VIII): EG scholar Alan Shelston

[ Edited ]
Here's a link with more information about AS:

http://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~matsuoka/EG-Shelston.html


Choisya wrote:
Apparently the B&N Norton Critical Edition of N&S contains Notes etc by a prominent Gaskell scholar, Alan Shelston. If anyone here has this edition perhaps they could quote one or two of his comments on Thornton? (Or maybe Ilana could?) As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/BookSearch/isbnInquiry.asp?EAN=9780393979084

pmath wrote:
Do we know if EG's portrayal of John, as a man in love, is credible? Does anyone know if male literary critics have commented on this?

Message Edited by pmath on 01-19-200711:35 AM

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For Choisya: Cheer

I thought you wanted something cheerful (as you mentioned here)!


Choisya wrote:
As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:
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Choisya
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Re: For Choisya: Cheer

I don't find 'lurv' cheerful - it is too complicated and fraught with problems!:smileysurprised:




pmath wrote:
I thought you wanted something cheerful (as you mentioned here)!


Choisya wrote:
As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:



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Choisya
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Re: NORTH AND SOUTH: Video of Prof Alan Shelston, Gaskell scholar, re EG, Dickens & N&S

[ Edited ]
That is a superb link pmath - thanks a lot. The video of the lecture by Alan Shelston is very interesting indeed and he devotes a lot of it to telling his audience about the relationship between Dickens and Gaskell. Cranford was the first novel serialised in Dicken's new journal Household Words and is considered a prime example of serialisation. North & South caused more problems however, both because it was long and because it contained the 'dangerous doubts' of Mr Hale and the Dissenters. Dickens chose the title 'North & South' because he expected and wanted it to be another industrial novel like Mary Barton and his own Hard Times. Towards the end Gaskell changed the novel to dwell more on the life and psychology of Margaret herself and Dickens disapproved of this. Their relationship deteriorated over the writing of North & South, both because she became 'dazed and crazed' by writing the weekly instalments of N&S for Household Words and because of Dicken's interference, which was mainly due to his position as editor and publisher of Household words. He had different priorities and had to think of his 'ratings', says Shelston. Their relationship deteriorated further after Dickens left his wife and as her own career blossomed.

I commend this video clip to everyone reading Cranford & North & South - it is both interesting and enlightening for readers of British Classics and mentions several other authors with whom Dickens had dealings.




pmath wrote:
Here's a link with more information about AS:

http://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~matsuoka/EG-Shelston.html


Choisya wrote:
Apparently the B&N Norton Critical Edition of N&S contains Notes etc by a prominent Gaskell scholar, Alan Shelston. If anyone here has this edition perhaps they could quote one or two of his comments on Thornton? (Or maybe Ilana could?) As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/BookSearch/isbnInquiry.asp?EAN=9780393979084

pmath wrote:
Do we know if EG's portrayal of John, as a man in love, is credible? Does anyone know if male literary critics have commented on this?

Message Edited by pmath on 01-19-200711:35 AM



Message Edited by Choisya on 01-20-200705:25 PM

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More on Cheer

Yes, I suppose it's only cheerful if lovers are truly compatible. Which British classics, or which typical BC themes, do you find uplifting?


Choisya wrote:
I don't find 'lurv' cheerful - it is too complicated and fraught with problems!:smileysurprised:

pmath wrote:
I thought you wanted something cheerful (as you mentioned here)!

Choisya wrote:
As an old cynic I find all this Victorian love stuff OTT:smileyvery-happy:


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N&S: Title

I'm very glad to hear you found it interesting, Choisya: I think the title is appropriate anyway!


Choisya wrote:
That is a superb link pmath - thanks a lot. ... Dickens chose the title 'North & South' because he expected and wanted it to be another industrial novel like Mary Barton and his own Hard Times.

pmath wrote:
Here's a link with more information about AS:

http://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~matsuoka/EG-Shelston.html

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Laurel
Posts: 5,747
Registered: ‎10-29-2006
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Re: N&S: Title

Okay! I bit. Let me finish my Russian and then I'll start on Japanese!



pmath wrote:
I'm very glad to hear you found it interesting, Choisya: I think the title is appropriate anyway!


Choisya wrote:
That is a superb link pmath - thanks a lot. ... Dickens chose the title 'North & South' because he expected and wanted it to be another industrial novel like Mary Barton and his own Hard Times.

pmath wrote:
Here's a link with more information about AS:

http://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~matsuoka/EG-Shelston.html




"Truth must of necessity be stranger than fiction, for fiction is the creation of the human mind, and therefore is congenial to it." ~~G.K. Chesterton
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Choisya
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Re: N&S: Title

You will find this video interesting I am sure Laurel - see my explanation of it below. Not just because of the change of title but because he goes into the writing of North and South and its theme in quite some depth. No love interest there though:smileyvery-happy:




Laurel wrote:
Okay! I bit. Let me finish my Russian and then I'll start on Japanese!



pmath wrote:
I'm very glad to hear you found it interesting, Choisya: I think the title is appropriate anyway!


Choisya wrote:
That is a superb link pmath - thanks a lot. ... Dickens chose the title 'North & South' because he expected and wanted it to be another industrial novel like Mary Barton and his own Hard Times.

pmath wrote:
Here's a link with more information about AS:

http://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~matsuoka/EG-Shelston.html







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Laurel
Posts: 5,747
Registered: ‎10-29-2006
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Re: N&S: Title


Choisya wrote:
You will find this video interesting I am sure Laurel - see my explanation of it below. Not just because of the change of title but because he goes into the writing of North and South and its theme in quite some depth. No love interest there though:smileyvery-happy:


Got it! I was trying to watch something in Japanese.
"Truth must of necessity be stranger than fiction, for fiction is the creation of the human mind, and therefore is congenial to it." ~~G.K. Chesterton
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