Since 1997, you’ve been coming to BarnesandNoble.com to discuss everything from Stephen King to writing to Harry Potter. You’ve made our site more than a place to discover your next book: you’ve made it a community. But like all things internet, BN.com is growing and changing. We've said goodbye to our community message boards—but that doesn’t mean we won’t still be a place for adventurous readers to connect and discover.

Now, you can explore the most exciting new titles (and remember the classics) at the Barnes & Noble Book Blog. Check out conversations with authors like Jeff VanderMeer and Gary Shteyngart at the B&N Review, and browse write-ups of the best in literary fiction. Come to our Facebook page to weigh in on what it means to be a book nerd. Browse digital deals on the NOOK blog, tweet about books with us,or self-publish your latest novella with NOOK Press. And for those of you looking for support for your NOOK, the NOOK Support Forums will still be here.

We will continue to provide you with books that make you turn pages well past midnight, discover new worlds, and reunite with old friends. And we hope that you’ll continue to tell us how you’re doing, what you’re reading, and what books mean to you.

Reply
Author
BearMountainBooks-Maria
Posts: 366
Registered: ‎10-25-2009
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

That's a good point.

Maria Schneider - My Nook Books
Inspired Contributor
MrBanballow
Posts: 294
Registered: ‎08-03-2010
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

On a related note, I noticed that both of the Pride and Prejudice and Zombies books are no longer Lendable.

Currently reading: The Complete Sherlock Holmes Vol 1, Grimm's Fairy Tales
Contributor
DavidDerrico
Posts: 11
Registered: ‎07-21-2010
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

In this new age of digital reading, readers DO have the power to help shape the new rules of the game. Readers control all the money spent on books, and that's always been the case. Publishers will try to raise prices (agency model and $14.99 e-books), window releases (delaying e-books), block text-to-speech, block lending, institute DRM, and their new frontier will be trying to get us all to read online in the "cloud," which just allows them to lock down the content more effectively by preventing us from downloading a file.

 

But the thing to remember is that publishers can only get away with what readers allow them to get away with. Not all publishers are on the agency model (5 of the Big 6 are, but Random House and smaller publishers are not). If readers refuse to buy books over a certain price, or with certain features blocked, or whatever, then publishers will have to cave in and give readers what they want. We've already seen that readers generally wouldn't pay $14.99 for new releases, and publishers lowered them to $12.99, which enough people seem to be paying.

 

Readers DO have choices. There are a million books a year published in the U.S. alone, and most of them don't go through large publishers. Many books are sold for much lower prices, enable lending and text-to-speech, and don't have DRM attached. True, you might have to take a chance in finding some new authors and you might not love all the new authors you find, but it is a choice, and the choices that readers make now will shape the way e-books are read for decades to come.

David Derrico, author of:
Right Ascension and Declination: thought-provoking space opera sci-fi
The Twiller: a humorous romp across the galaxy
Bibliophile
bklvr896
Posts: 4,807
Registered: ‎12-31-2009

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 


DavidDerrico wrote:

 

But the thing to remember is that publishers can only get away with what readers allow them to get away with. Not all publishers are on the agency model (5 of the Big 6 are, but Random House and smaller publishers are not). If readers refuse to buy books over a certain price, or with certain features blocked, or whatever, then publishers will have to cave in and give readers what they want. We've already seen that readers generally wouldn't pay $14.99 for new releases, and publishers lowered them to $12.99, which enough people seem to be paying.

 

Readers DO have choices. There are a million books a year published in the U.S. alone, and most of them don't go through large publishers. Many books are sold for much lower prices, enable lending and text-to-speech, and don't have DRM attached. True, you might have to take a chance in finding some new authors and you might not love all the new authors you find, but it is a choice, and the choices that readers make now will shape the way e-books are read for decades to come.


 

The problem is, that people are paying the prices.  If you watch the B&N and Amazon top 100 selling eBooks there are typically a number of books at $14.99 in the top 20 and some more at $12.99.  The price doesn't seem to be stopping most readers.  The publishers seem to price the books at $14.99 for the first couple of weeks and then drop it to $12.99.  Right now, with the recent $5.00 sale, a lot of those books are in the top 100.  But, Tick Tock by James Patterson is #48 at $14.99.  Don't Blink by James Patterson is #67 at $14.99 and it's been out since September.  American Assassin by Vince Flynn is #71 at $14.99, it's been out since October. Fall of Giants is finally out of the top 100 but it was there for months at $19.99.

 

The majority of eBook purchases do not frequent message boards, to the folks here are a very small, non representative sample of eBook buyers.  I know from my own experience, I have about 10 friends/coworkers with some type of eReader and none of them hesitate to purchase a book they want to read, price simply doesn't factor into for them.  I'm the only one who frequents message boards, and I'll pay $12.99 for an eBook, I won't pay $14.99 but then, with few exceptions, I wouldn't pay $15.00 for a HC when it first came out either.

 

My determining factor on what I'll pay for the book is the book itself, the content, not the format.  There are some authors that I will most likely pay $14.99 if that's what the book is when it first comes out, not many, probably less than 3 authors, but $12.99, for me, is doable.

 

Most people are not all that willing to give up their favorite authors in favor of new, unknown authors.  And most of the popular authors are published by one of the 5 publishers.  As long as Agency pricing is in effect and there is no competition, prices probably aren't going to change.

 

And on the other side of the argument, I do wonder if the agency pricing actually helped B&N and the other eReaders/stores sales.  Amazon, at $9.99 for best sellers was basically loss leading the books, taking about a $3.00 loss on each book.  Amazon can afford to do that, they can make it up on frying pans and bedding and what not.  B&N, Sony, Kobo, etc really couldn't have afforded to continually match that price and I wonder if the price difference would have sent more people to the Kindle camp?  Just a random thought here.

Distinguished Bibliophile
Peppermill
Posts: 6,768
Registered: ‎04-04-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 Amazon, at $9.99 for best sellers was basically loss leading the books, taking about a $3.00 loss on each book.  Amazon can afford to do that, they can make it up on frying pans and bedding and what not.

 

The evidence that the above holds true?

"Seize the moments of happiness, love and be loved! That is the only reality in the world, all else is folly. It is the one thing we are interested in here." -- Leo Tolstoy
Author
BearMountainBooks-Maria
Posts: 366
Registered: ‎10-25-2009
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

Even if they were taking a loss, they aren't allowed to anymore.  And there was always a question of whether they were taking a loss if any.  It seems that no one wanted to admit what Amazon was paying for the books in the first place...

 

I think what they did prove was that lower prices sell more books.  A LOT more books.  Sure people are still buyiing the higher priced books from their favorite authors, but let's be real.  My books sell because people are willing to take a chance on a book that costs 2 or 3 dollars.   That price-point didn't exist before Amazon experimented with price (and they do not lose any money on sales of my books--they get their share and so does B&N for that matter.) 

 

There's a huge market of used-book buyers and library-goers that are willing to spend at the lower price-points.  I don't begrudge people who are willing to spend 12 or 20 dollars on a book.  The way it is now, there's a couple of new price-points.  And I'm very glad.

Maria Schneider - My Nook Books
Bibliophile
bklvr896
Posts: 4,807
Registered: ‎12-31-2009
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 


Peppermill wrote:

 Amazon, at $9.99 for best sellers was basically loss leading the books, taking about a $3.00 loss on each book.  Amazon can afford to do that, they can make it up on frying pans and bedding and what not.

 

The evidence that the above holds true?


 

Well, I didn't bookmark all the locations, but this NY times article discusses Amazon subsidizing the best sellers.  There have been numerous discussion on this and many articles pointed out over the course of the last year.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/weekinreview/17rich.html

Bibliophile
bklvr896
Posts: 4,807
Registered: ‎12-31-2009
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 


BearMountainBooks wrote:

Even if they were taking a loss, they aren't allowed to anymore.  And there was always a question of whether they were taking a loss if any.  It seems that no one wanted to admit what Amazon was paying for the books in the first place...

 

I think what they did prove was that lower prices sell more books.  A LOT more books.  Sure people are still buyiing the higher priced books from their favorite authors, but let's be real.  My books sell because people are willing to take a chance on a book that costs 2 or 3 dollars.   That price-point didn't exist before Amazon experimented with price (and they do not lose any money on sales of my books--they get their share and so does B&N for that matter.) 

 

There's a huge market of used-book buyers and library-goers that are willing to spend at the lower price-points.  I don't begrudge people who are willing to spend 12 or 20 dollars on a book.  The way it is now, there's a couple of new price-points.  And I'm very glad.


 

eBook sales increased 130% in November over the previous year.  People are buying them regardless of the price.  There's a post over in the Nook forums from someone who works for a publisher stating they did an experiment and found they sold less books at the lower price and more when they raised it.  I didn't bookmark that post, but was a interesting report.

 

And I generally won't take a chance on a new author at $2-3 unless someone recommends the book or author to me.  

 

But the point is, the large publishers currently have no real incentive to lower prices.  And, they have a lot more overhead than you do to cover in the price of the book.

 

 

Distinguished Bibliophile
Peppermill
Posts: 6,768
Registered: ‎04-04-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 


bklvr896 wrote:

 


Peppermill wrote:

 Amazon, at $9.99 for best sellers was basically loss leading the books, taking about a $3.00 loss on each book.  Amazon can afford to do that, they can make it up on frying pans and bedding and what not.

 

The evidence that the above holds true?


 

Well, I didn't bookmark all the locations, but this NY times article discusses Amazon subsidizing the best sellers.  There have been numerous discussion on this and many articles pointed out over the course of the last year.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/weekinreview/17rich.html


Good article!  Thanks!  But it implies that losses were being offset more by Kindle sales and increased ebook sales (those with margins, of course) than necessarily other business lines.  It also raises questions about exactly what prices had Amazon been able to negotiate with publishers/suppliers, at least early in the game.

 

"Seize the moments of happiness, love and be loved! That is the only reality in the world, all else is folly. It is the one thing we are interested in here." -- Leo Tolstoy
Bibliophile
bklvr896
Posts: 4,807
Registered: ‎12-31-2009
0 Kudos

Re: Penguin Publishing & Soho Publishing Groups are no longer Nook friendly

 


Peppermill wrote:

 


bklvr896 wrote:

 


Peppermill wrote:

 Amazon, at $9.99 for best sellers was basically loss leading the books, taking about a $3.00 loss on each book.  Amazon can afford to do that, they can make it up on frying pans and bedding and what not.

 

The evidence that the above holds true?


 

Well, I didn't bookmark all the locations, but this NY times article discusses Amazon subsidizing the best sellers.  There have been numerous discussion on this and many articles pointed out over the course of the last year.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/17/weekinreview/17rich.html


Good article!  Thanks!  But it implies that losses were being offset more by Kindle sales and increased ebook sales (those with margins, of course) than necessarily other business lines.  It also raises questions about exactly what prices had Amazon been able to negotiate with publishers/suppliers, at least early in the game.

 


That could be, but it was basically a point that Amazon was selling the books at a loss and making up the price somewhere.  Whether it be books or other items and I doubt Amazon would readily admit they added a dollar or two to some other item to make up for.  The point is, Amazon sells just about everything, so they have resources to make up losses on loss leaders.  Most other eBook retailers are simply that, booksellers.