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5ivedom
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Re: Website Complaint

I'll add two things.

 

1) Very critical to find a career you love. The difference is often stark. So, usually there will be

 

1 or 2 lines of work that are perfect for you.

 

3 to 10 that are good

 

rest are terrible.

 

Make sure you find the 1 or 2 that are perfect IF you have the option. Else at least find the 3 to 10 that are very good.

 

 

2) Within the career that you love there will be

 

Painful work

 

Amazing work.

 

Most of the work that you consider 'painful' can be weeded out and/or handed off to someone else. Within every career there are specialists and divisions of lavor and such.

 

So if you find an area you love, you STILL have to weed out the stuff that's a gumption trap (kills your enthusiasm and energy) and focus on the PURE part that your TRULY LOVE.

 

That second part is even more critical than the first. There's nothing quite as awkward as being in a line of work you love but being stuck doing the parts of it that are not your PLEASURE centers.

 

*****

If your dream job is working as a pastry chef then you want to make sure you get that job AND ALSO that you don't get assigned making only eclairs.

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keriflur
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Re: Website Complaint


5ivedom wrote:

If your dream job is working as a pastry chef then you want to make sure you get that job AND ALSO that you don't get assigned making only eclairs.


And unless you are wealthy enough to start your own bakery right out of culinary school, you may have to accept that your first handful of jobs are going to be making eclairs day after day, until you work your way up or find a backer for your dream.

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Ya_Ya
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Re: Website Complaint


keriflur wrote:

And unless you are wealthy enough to start your own bakery right out of culinary school, you may have to accept that your first handful of jobs are going to be making eclairs day after day, until you work your way up or find a backer for your dream.


Which is extremely unlikely to happen.  Most culinary (savory or pastry) grads never own their own restaurant/bakery, many never even run someone else's.  

 

And the Liberal Arts College grad in me has to take issue with sparky's comment that college is about getting a career.  College has nothing to do with getting a job.  College is about learning to think and determining who you are.  Grad school is about getting a job.  :smileywink:

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bobstro
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Re: Website Complaint

[ Edited ]

Unless you've got the cash to pay for it in your back pocket, I hope anybody  attending a college is thinking college is all about getting a career. Anybody incurring significant debt had better be thinking about repaying it upon graduation. Going deeper into debt isn't a smart move unless you've got good odds of earning enough to cover that gap with an increased salary.

 

I hate to think like this, but college has become a major moneymaker. From the moment you first apply, you are under a microscope to determine just how much money can be extracted from you (or your parents). Not surprisingly, that's always how much it will cost. A college education is the worst bargain you'll (hopefully) strike in your life.

 

I'm a true believer in the value of education, but the idea that there's a magic ticket that you just need to get punched is dangerous. Anybody thinking of it as four years to figure yourself out may be in for a very expensive awakening. For many people, attending a college or university a one-shot opportunity, and wasting it is an expensive mistake.

 

 

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keriflur
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Re: Website Complaint


bobstro wrote:

 

I'm a true believer in the value of education, but the idea that there's a magic ticket that you just need to get punched is dangerous. Anybody thinking of it as four years to figure yourself out may be in for a very expensive awakening. For many people, attending a college or university a one-shot opportunity, and wasting it is an expensive mistake.

 


Anybody who expects their kid to have their whole life figured out at 17 (when it's time to pick a college) is in for a very expensive awakening also.  You put that much pressure on a kid, they'll chose a career path because they have to.  And they're likely to be wrong.

 

IMO no one should put the pressure on a 17 year old to plan their life like that.  I had that pressure, and I chose how I did because I was scared, had no real guidance, and didn't know who I was yet.  I went liberal arts because I didn't know what I wanted, and I went into finance because I was afraid of being poor.  And yeah, I got out of school and made more than my friends.  But 14 years later, after 14 years of dealing with depression and wishing I could have a do-over career choice, I can tell you very solidly - IT WASN'T WORTH IT.

 

It's one thing if you know what you want at 17.  That's great.  That's wonderful, in fact.  But that doesn't mean everyone does, and sometimes the best thing you can do for yourself is to take four years to try different things, meet new people and go to new places, and figure out who you are.

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doncr
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Registered: ‎12-29-2010

Re: Website Complaint

Wow, I must be the odd man out then.  I knew what I wanted to do when I was 10 years old and have made a pretty good living doing it.  I put myself through college working construction jobs during the summer and retail during the school year.

 

I have no problem with young people spending some time to decide what they want to do with their life as long as they're paying for it.  Work part-time, take some community college courses, save your money, volunteer in your town and make up your mind.

 

What I have a problem with is someone that takes out huge student loans to get a degree in something that has no marketplace value.  It's a tough sell to ask me to pay for social programs to support someone who is $100K+ in debt who can't get a job with their BA in something lke Ethnic Women's Studies. 

 

One of my favorite Dave Ramsey moments (FF to 5:00).

 

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keriflur
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Re: Website Complaint

[ Edited ]

Christopher Reeve on figuring out what to do with your life:

 

http://www.chrisreevehomepage.com/sp-wc1999.html

 

He gave this speech at a number of schools that year, it seems, and mine was one of them (I did not attend Williams).  He was an amazing public speaker and an amazing person.  I remember how much his words meant to me that day when I heard him speak, with one year post-college under my belt, and I still can't read this speech without tearing up.

DeanGibson
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"Get an education, and you will be happy."

[ Edited ]

bobstro wrote:

Unless you've got the cash to pay for it in your back pocket, I hope anybody  attending a college is thinking college is all about getting a career. ... good odds of earning enough to cover that gap with an increased salary.

 

...

 

I'm a true believer in the value of education, but the idea that there's a magic ticket that you just need to get punched is dangerous.

 


The title was what my parents told me, and I believed it.  Unfortunately, it isn't true in general, and certainly not necessarily true in a job..  Happiness comes from within, and from doing something you enjoy.  Interestingly, it's not related to money:  http://business.time.com/2012/11/08/why-suicides-are-more-common-in-richer-neighborhoods/ (there are apparently lots of studies like this).

 

So, you need to find happiness elsewhere.  I'm not going to digress down that philosophical path in this message ....

 

On the other hand, getting a college education should teach you how to think.  GIven the level of critical thinking remaining in our society today, it's clear that our educational system is failing here.  Secondary schools have become PC-thought-dispensation platforms for years, so most colleges have to build critical thinking from the ground up.  I have two friends that left college after three years, and they are the most opinionated persons I know (ah, the complete knowledge of a 21-year old).  That's not the fault of the educational system, but the point is, regardless of cause and effect, those who finish college at a decent educational institution have a better track record of being not only able to think at least somewhat critically, but also are the most adaptable.  It used to be said that the average person would change careers twice in his/her lifetime;  now, it is apparently seven: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704206804575468162805877990.html

 

Even within a career, most employers (at least those with higher-paying jobs) are looking for non-job-specific skills:  http://academics.umw.edu/careerservices/internships/what-skills-and-abilities-do-employers-want/

 

As a result, getting an education in a specific skill-set may help you fresh out of college, but it won't matter much in the long run.  Being able to think and adapt is the key, in my opinion, and normally the best way to get that is in an education.

 

I would recommend staying out of extra-curricular political organizations;  I think that's a poor way to learn critical thinking.  If you find yourself being opinionated and obstinate, go take more classes.

 

Notes:

 

1. When I taught a course in networking at the University of Washington, one of the (pre-established) prerequisites was calculus.  Some of my students had taken "Business Calculus" (faintly related) because it was easier.  When I placed simple calculus equations on the board, they were completely lost.  I didn't care.  Don't try to skimp by and graduate by the easiest curriculum;  take courses where you will learn something.  This is especially important in the humanities.

 

2. At the UW, students wer asked to grade their classes and teachers at the end of each quarter.  The head of the "Computer Systems and Software" department  that I taught in, warned me that the grades that instructors in his department received, varied a bit, and I shouldn't be too disappointed.  He said that in the other (non-technical) departments, most instructors received "almost all A's" because that's what they gave as class grades.

 

3. I paid for 1/2 of my education at Caltech out of a college job, and my father (a US Army Major at the time) paid the other half.  I had humanities instructors that graded fairly, and you received a poor grade if you did poorly (I had to repeat one US History class ...).

 

4. My parents both had college degrees (1938).

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AlanNJ
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Re: "Get an education, and you will be happy."

For the record my job did not exist when I was 17 so it would have been pretty difficult for me to make this career choice.  I graduated college with a BA in 1977.  Then retail management followed by Insurance Sales.  Went back to school at 35 and got an AA in Telecommunications Management.  Was a telcom field engineer in NYC for 11 years and then got promoted to being a Project Manager (which a truly enjoy). Whoda thunk it?

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flyingtoastr
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Re: Website Complaint


doncr wrote:

 

What I have a problem with is someone that takes out huge student loans to get a degree in something that has no marketplace value.  It's a tough sell to ask me to pay for social programs to support someone who is $100K+ in debt who can't get a job with their BA in something lke Ethnic Women's Studies. 

 


I have a tough time paying for bailouts for the people who went for "markatable" banking degrees and royally screwed the world's economy 5 years ago.