Peppermill wrote:
It astounds me that it would not be among the responsible right -- given the hard-working, honest, moral superiority the right so often seems to want to represent itself as having.
Pepper, don't forget that the left has its fair share of "moral superiority" in the tug-of-war of who's right and who's wrong.
Peppermill also wrote:
The Economist (Outlook 2010) has an interesting article predicting a tough year ahead for Obama, as he gets "blamed" for an on-going recession, rather than credited with avoiding a depression, and takes on his own shoulders military action decisions, in a period before benefits from health care and other reforms become visible.
This is a very real phenomenon that has affected both republican and democratic presidents. It makes for more colorful disagreements during the elections, even this past one. Republicans argued that it was the policies of Bill Clinton that led to the economic crisis. Greenspan and others from as far back as the Reagan era have been blamed for the housing meltdown.
The reality is that politicians are judged on short-term results, but the fact remains that we're dealing with issues with roots that can be traced all the way back to the industrial revolution. Likewise, solutions may take DECADES to show a result. Look at the FDIC, as an example. Did the creation of the FDIC immediately renew faith in the banking system and make all things good and simple again? After being a child of the Great Depression, my grandmother still has a stash of cash in a box somewhere for the day the banking system collapses. After the bailouts over this past year, I'm thinkin' she might be on to something. Although, if things went that way, how much would her cash be worth anyhow?
Pepper, don't forget that the left has its fair share of "moral superiority" in the tug-of-war of who's right and who's wrong.
Ruth -- I notice you left "hard-working and honest" off your description of the left???
basson_mommy12 wrote:
Peppermill wrote:
It astounds me that it would not be among the responsible right -- given the hard-working, honest, moral superiority the right so often seems to want to represent itself as having.
Pepper, don't forget that the left has its fair share of "moral superiority" in the tug-of-war of who's right and who's wrong.
Peppermill also wrote:
The Economist (Outlook 2010) has an interesting article predicting a tough year ahead for Obama, as he gets "blamed" for an on-going recession, rather than credited with avoiding a depression, and takes on his own shoulders military action decisions, in a period before benefits from health care and other reforms become visible.
This is a very real phenomenon that has affected both republican and democratic presidents. It makes for more colorful disagreements during the elections, even this past one. Republicans argued that it was the policies of Bill Clinton that led to the economic crisis. Greenspan and others from as far back as the Reagan era have been blamed for the housing meltdown.
The reality is that politicians are judged on short-term results, but the fact remains that we're dealing with issues with roots that can be traced all the way back to the industrial revolution. Likewise, solutions may take DECADES to show a result. Look at the FDIC, as an example. Did the creation of the FDIC immediately renew faith in the banking system and make all things good and simple again? After being a child of the Great Depression, my grandmother still has a stash of cash in a box somewhere for the day the banking system collapses. After the bailouts over this past year, I'm thinkin' she might be on to something. Although, if things went that way, how much would her cash be worth anyhow?
basson_mommy12 wrote:Pepper: Ah, but see all AMERICANS by definition are hard-working and honest, right? Moral superiority is certainly not a trait that either side would claim, even if they believe it to be true.
Oh, your right leaning friends are definitely different than mine then! Mine don't hesitate to claim moral superiority. 
(Nor do all of them seem to believe all Americans are hard working and honest. 
)
I do think that those differences in values or views about morality are part of what makes it difficult at times for different parts of the political spectrum to speak respectfully to each other. I have been struggling with Reinhold Niebuhr this morning. One of his lines that may apply here is: "Their {people's} difficulty is usually that they cannot imagine any but a social norm to which the self {they themselves} pretends to conform."
Jon_B wrote:I'd find it a bit silly to believe all (insert any nationality here) are hardworking and honest! A great many are of course, but there are plenty of lazy and dishonest people among every population, America is no exception.
Of course!
Ruth and I are jostling each other on how the right and the left view themselves. I was audacious (or foolish) enough to describe the right as viewing themselves as "hardworking, honest and morally superior." I didn't intend to get into a discussion of how the left view themselves!
But, Ruth, I believe, has questioned whether either the right or the left would self describe as "morally superior." At the same time, she has suggested that "hardworking and honest" are much more palatable self descriptions.
