PART ONE: The Nursery

[CaitC]

Hello all,

I think this third chapter really hooked me in more than the first two chapters had. I really began to feel more aligned with Grace; this chapter got me on her side completely! What others have already brought up about her being plucked from her mother's home and made to live and work in a new and different environment made me feel such sympathy for her situation. Plus, she's a reader (we found out this from those stashed books!), so how could I not like her?

Morton's descriptions of the nursery were very detailed and clear; I had a complete picture in my mind of the room. Great descriptive writing.

And of course, in this chapter, David, Emmeline, and Hannah are introduced. I loved that like Grace, the reader gets to eavesdrop (so to speak) on their conversation that day in the nursery. It really gave a sense of their three distinct personalities. I can't wait to discover how close Grace becomes to these children. And it will be interesting to see how the relationships between both Hannah and Emmeline, and David and Grace (did I detect a hint of a crush forming??) are developed as the characters age.

CaitC

[kiakar]

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ploabhawes wrote:

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KathyS wrote:
Sorry...can't help laughing at this odd situation. Where in the world did Nanny Brown come from? And how in the world did Grace come to be dusting her? The 'absent of mind' end up on page 34?

Kathy

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Kathy~

I swear I literally went back and read the Nanny Brown part at least 5 or 6 times. At first I thought this "Nanny Brown" thing was a ghost. Doesn't she say something about minding Raverly (the dead stuffed dog?!?!)? She would have been at home and unbothered in that darn drab room! Then I reread it again and even considered that maybe when the children were playing that they pretended to be talking to a "Nanny Brown" so Grace joined in their game by talking back. Finally, I got that it was a real person but what a strange passage, eh?? I swear I was not drinking either.......

Lisa

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I think I read correctly, this Nanny Brown was everybody's nanny and she spent her time napping behind the curtain. Again I can't find this now. So she had to be very very old so I would be anappin too if I had been everybody's nanny.

[kiakar]

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CathyB wrote:
Yes, the hiding of the books shows a little rebelliousness in Grace.

Where did this come from?

-CathyB

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She was fourteen, aren't all teenagers rebellious.??

[kiakar]

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KxBurns wrote:

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krenea1 wrote:

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ploabhawes wrote:
As for the nursery, I think something terrible has happened in there or some baby may have died that used it etc. Morton went out of her way to make it a horribly dreary place. Once again, I definitely could feel the mood of the room.


Lisa

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My thoughts exactly!! PG 26 - It slept the sleep of a hundred-year curse. I wonder what was meant by that. And further down - It smelled musty, of ghostly children and long-settled dust. Ghostly could mean the the loss of childhood in the house, as if empty of childen due to adulthood until the next come alone but sine she has made the other comments it seems as though there is a deeper meaning.

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There was also the book inscribed to Timothy Hartford, which does not match the names of any of the current children of the house (nor the older generation)...

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I wondered if this has any connection to Jonathan's two sons dying. Does it say where they died? I hope I am not dreaming this up.

[psujulie]

I think there is a lot to discuss in this chapter. We have very few questions answered in this chapter, yet many more questions and secrets raised!

The deer picture seems to be very symbolic to me. The impaled deer could represent a dying animal that was hunted down -- that takes me back to Robert's last name HUNTER. Is there a tie between that picture and him? Grace mentions on page 21 that she tries not to look at the picture of the deer frozen in its moment of final horror. Is this symbolic of an horror that she sees, but tries not to?

I also found it interesting that her mother insisted that she apply for the position at Riverton. Grace mentions that her mother wouldn't tell her how she knew about the position. Her mother refused to be swayed by any of Grace's arguments. Why all the secrecy surrounding how her mother knew about the job? Is it a lack of communication between Grace and her mother or something more? I also thought when Grace's mother said on page 20 "Don't you go forgetting your place. There's too many young girls get themselves into trouble that way". Is Grace's mother talking about herself and her past? Or, is this foreshadowing of something Grace gets involved with?

I just love the sentences on page 22: "It is an uncanny feeling, that rare occasion when one catches a glimpse of oneself in repose. An unguarded moment, stripped of artiface, when one forgets to fool even oneself." Is this a reference from Grace about living with lies or hiding things?

On page 27, Grace mentions that the stuffed foxhound had been injured having his leg caught in a trap. Could the trapped part be symbolic of the dead foxhound in the dream?

Finally, I wanted to comment on Grace covering for the kids at the end of the chapter. I think it's because Grace always wanted a sibling and she wanted to be part of a "normal" family situation. I also think she was just a little girl of 14 and wanted to belong and be liked by "the cool kids".

[KathyS]

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KxBurns wrote:

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KathyS wrote:
Poor Grace, her finding a place of seclusion within this nursery - to be alone with books she finds comfort in. This place of decay was not of concern for her, was it? She looked beyond it. Her three volumes, now this find! But the intrusion of these children - they seemed to be outsiders...at first. The question ends with, why did she lie for them? What prompted it?

......anxious to find myself once more in the safety of the servants' hall, away from these strange, exotic child-adults and the odd feelings they aroused in me.

Kathy

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I think this is tied to your earlier post about Grace's desire for siblings, which I believe will play a powerful role in her relationship with the Hartford children. What do you think?

Karen

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Yes, definately.
The interesting part that I saw with Grace wanting siblings, was the fact that she only had the one child, Ruth. I wondered why, and where did her own desires leave off.
I love the fact that Grace was 'wanting' an excuse to go into the nursery, to see what was going on.

[kiakar]

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psujulie wrote:
Finally, I wanted to comment on Grace covering for the kids at the end of the chapter. I think it's because Grace always wanted a sibling and she wanted to be part of a "normal" family situation. I also think she was just a little girl of 14 and wanted to belong and be liked by "the cool kids".

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Great thoughts psujulie. Yes, that I realized too. She was a child working for a living and yearning to be a kid playing and romping with the three of them. And one child always covers for the other hoping they get to play next time.

[kiakar]

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psujulie wrote:
I think there is a lot to discuss in this chapter. We have very few questions answered in this chapter, yet many more questions and secrets raised!

The deer picture seems to be very symbolic to me. The impaled deer could represent a dying animal that was hunted down -- that takes me back to Robert's last name HUNTER. Is there a tie between that picture and him? Grace mentions on page 21 that she tries not to look at the picture of the deer frozen in its moment of final horror.

Its alot of talk about animals in these chapters. Are they metaphors maybe the coming of death to the human beings in the house?

[KathyS]

Pepper, nits? Are you a 'nit-picker'? I love these facts, although I wouldn't go to that trouble over a beeswax, but interesting if you find out. Are you a history fact-purest? How important it is to the story, I don't know. .....
Kathy

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Peppermill wrote:

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KxBurns wrote {excerpt}:...I do love Grace's servant's-eye-view descriptions of the house. The way even the lighting changes as she moves from the living quarters to the servant's quarters...

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Yes! -- and a detail like elm is used for the back stairs (whereas a more expensive wood would have been used for the front stairs). Morton seems to have done some good research, although I am not certain she takes full advantage of the setting and period.

I haven't been able to find Stubbins & Co. beeswax. An antique dealer in Britain couldn't tell me if it was ever a real product, but I am betting it was. Does anyone know? (p. 15 and elsewhere)

And, yes, these are "nits", unlike themes like changes wrought by wars or Hannah and David wrangling over suffrage.

Message Edited by Peppermill on 01-04-2008 10:05 AM

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[Ophelia123]

I loved the way that we were introduced to the children. The entire description of the nursery play practice really drew me into the story and the characters. I loved how immediately you had a sense of who each of the Hartford children were. It was also very intriguing (as mentioned in many of the responses to the thread) the connection that Grace has with the Hartfords and covering for them. I love all the characters already and Riverton house too!
Love it so far!
Happy reading.
Ophelia

[vivico1]

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KxBurns wrote:
I think the connection someone made between the stuffed foxhound Raverly, the dream, and Robbie Hunter is a good one. I hadn't thought of that!

I'm also wondering if anyone else thinks the suffrage issue might become important as the story develops? Right now it seems significant primarily because Hannah mentions their father will not allow her and Emmeline to attend school -- and Grace herself has been removed from school and sent to work at Riverton because her teacher had started putting ideas in her head that were beyond her station. I found this to be a nice parallel. Even a woman of the upper classes was constrained by her station in life.

But Hannah certainly does seem headstrong!

Message Edited by KxBurns on 01-04-2008 11:18 AM

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I think it may be important in the sense of how it affects all these girls view of the world and themselves. This is set during that particular time and so the choices they make will most certainly be affected by the social mores of the times, you see it in them now. I think, the character of the girls that you see now, are to give you insight into who they become as young women. The suffrage issue is kind of the backdrop for that.

[lamorgan]

Perhaps she's talking about the movie set?

[maude40]

I love that Grace is a reader. Page 21....."but to live without Holmes and Watson was unthinkable." Along with this book I'm right in the middle of "The Dante Club", so this line was great as Oliver Wendell Holmes is one of the main characters in Matthew Pearl's book.
Yvonne

[lamorgan]

I don't know a lot about old English, but I believe "form" is probably similar to our semester, term, school year, etc.

[lamorgan]

I thought it was interesting how Grace was so in love with the room until she found someone else was there ... similar to having her space invaded. Has anyone had a similar experience? I used to have a particular spot at a local park where I enjoyed reading until I found someone else in that same spot. It turns a very private space into something less personal!

[maude40]

Can you believe what chores the servants had to do? Page 24 found Mr. Hamilton ironing "The Times". My mother used to iron socks and underwear but never the newspaper.
Yvonne

[IBIS]

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maude40 wrote:
I love that Grace is a reader. Page 21....."but to live without Holmes and Watson was unthinkable." Along with this book I'm right in the middle of "The Dante Club", so this line was great as Oliver Wendell Holmes is one of the main characters in Matthew Pearl's book.
Yvonne

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It is interesting that Grace reads detective fiction, in light of how observant she is. For a 14-year old girl, nothing escapes her observation of both "downstairs" and "upstairs" characters.

What's even more interesting is that the "upstairs" people are so used to living in close quarters with the staff that the staff has become "invisible" to them. So unlike our contemporary lifestyles... I think we'd all be very conscious of a housemaid dusting the furniture in our midst.

IBIS

[seattle07]

Such an interesting chapter, a good blend of spooky (Nanny Brown, Raverly, the mysterious Timothy Hartford) and comedy- the siblings discussing their play made me laugh.

Also, I thought it was interesting the children are described as having distinct Ashbury colouring (p.28) and that Hannah thought Grace looked familiar (p.35. Foreshadowing?

Message Edited by seattle07 on 01-04-2008 02:32 PM

[Noelle22]

I enjoyed this chapter a lot more than the first two. I thought about how the story works well with Grace as a servant and not an equal. It gives her a different perspective, different duties, and sets her even further apart from the siblings.

I also liked the references to other works. The Bible is mentioned. The story the kids are working on describes the plight of three siblings where one is favored above the other two and of the other two one gets a lighter punishment than the other. Also, Holmes is brought to the house by Grace which is an obvious sign that Grace loves mysteries which may mean that she will have to solve a few mysteries herself or just shows the reader that she wouldn't shy away from intrigue. Also, the books she reads from her teacher...Jan Eyre (a servant with a mystery to solve and a romantic interest that spans social classes), Frankenstein (a suspenseful tale of being an outsider, revenge, and ultimately death), and The castle of Otranto (involving supernatural elements. It was the first Gothic novel, with lots of drama). Also, the children's tutor was obsessed with The Lady of Shalott (death, unrequited love, isolation). It will be interesting to see if/how some of the themes from these works manifest themselves in Grace's life at Riverton.

Finally, I notice the spark that Grace felt for David on the middle of p. 36. It'll be interesting to see how/if that develops.

Noelle

[Kauai-Guy]

Raverley died from being trapped and was put on display. Our young Grace at age 14 shows an independent nature, but feels trapped when she puts on the maid uniform for the first time. She wants to be free like the moth that flies by. Hannah feels trapped by the expectations of society at the time. The doll house seemed symbolic....everything neat and orderly....but without life. I found it interesting when the grandchildren and Grace connect from two different worlds. Perhaps a sign of the world changing.