What a change with Maud! Loving with someone with a substance abuse problem presents it's own new set of issues and obstacles. I am convinced that Clive knows, but is in denial, or is at a point where he doesn't want to deal with it and leaves it to Ginny (how sad, but she is his assistant after all). When Clive tells Ginny to board up the north wing and says "it wasn't worth maintaining a wing that would never be used again"(133), I immediately thought this must also be his view of Maud. A deteriorating part of the house that should be left alone to crumble into nothingness. I think Maud has always been a social drinker, and once Vivi left, and Clive and Ginny retreated to the attic, she gradually poured more and more, until she had a real problem. It certainly explained her bizarre behavior on Clive and Ginny's return from the entomology conference. The loneliness was too much for Maud to handle. When they find her in the library, after ignoring her for 2 days, Clive just "tutted and walked out"(111). Clearly he is aware how bad the situation is, but does not have the emotional fortitude to deal with it. On page 108, Ginny describes how to prepare the moths for Bernard's challenge, and it reminded me of Maud, "we'd need to extract the compound, a fairly simple process of emulsifying the animal with a pestle and mortar and put the resulting slurry through a series of alcoholic distillations." I saw this as a metaphor for Maud being so emotionally beat up (mortar and pestle), and then trying to fill up the emotional void with alcohol.
I also found it a sad piece of irony that Maud reads "The Ideal Home" magazine (110). I'm sure nothing in that publication can even come close to repairing the damage done in this "home". When Ginny says "A sick thrust of guilt and love and shame and overbearing failure churned through me"(111) I felt so bad. I am always saddened when children, even adult children, feel as though their parents happiness or well-being is somehow their responsibility. This is one of those things, Ginny previously spoke of, that a person learns, sometimes through only action and insinuation, when they are young, and never leaves you. That is too much responsibility for a small child, and it only grows as the child grows. Ginny feels she has to keep Maud's secret, because it was her fault to begin with, what a burden.
Maud and Ginny's "secret" hinges on Ginny's guilt. No matter how aggressive Maud gets, Ginny continues in her role. She has been groomed to be this way from childhood. Maud's aggression hurls emotional, and sometimes physical, abuse upon the guilt and secret-keeping (that she won't break 50 years later) Ginny already must deal with. It becomes clear that Maud's substance abuse will not be overcome.
I also found it a sad piece of irony that Maud reads "The Ideal Home" magazine (110). I'm sure nothing in that publication can even come close to repairing the damage done in this "home". When Ginny says "A sick thrust of guilt and love and shame and overbearing failure churned through me"(111) I felt so bad. I am always saddened when children, even adult children, feel as though their parents happiness or well-being is somehow their responsibility. This is one of those things, Ginny previously spoke of, that a person learns, sometimes through only action and insinuation, when they are young, and never leaves you. That is too much responsibility for a small child, and it only grows as the child grows. Ginny feels she has to keep Maud's secret, because it was her fault to begin with, what a burden.
Maud and Ginny's "secret" hinges on Ginny's guilt. No matter how aggressive Maud gets, Ginny continues in her role. She has been groomed to be this way from childhood. Maud's aggression hurls emotional, and sometimes physical, abuse upon the guilt and secret-keeping (that she won't break 50 years later) Ginny already must deal with. It becomes clear that Maud's substance abuse will not be overcome.
pigwidgeon wrote:I find it strange that, after all the discussion of the girls calling their parents by their first names, no one has yet mentioned that, on page 111, Ginny calls them Mummy and Daddy.You beat me to it. I did notice, but had to think about how I would interpret it.
What a change with Maud! Loving with someone with a substance abuse problem presents it's own new set of issues and obstacles. I am convinced that Clive knows, but is in denial, or is at a point where he doesn't want to deal with it and leaves it to Ginny (how sad, but she is his assistant after all). When Clive tells Ginny to board up the north wing and says "it wasn't worth maintaining a wing that would never be used again"(133), I immediately thought this must also be his view of Maud. A deteriorating part of the house that should be left alone to crumble into nothingness. I think Maud has always been a social drinker, and once Vivi left, and Clive and Ginny retreated to the attic, she gradually poured more and more, until she had a real problem. It certainly explained her bizarre behavior on Clive and Ginny's return from the entomology conference. The loneliness was too much for Maud to handle. When they find her in the library, after ignoring her for 2 days, Clive just "tutted and walked out"(111). Clearly he is aware how bad the situation is, but does not have the emotional fortitude to deal with it. On page 108, Ginny describes how to prepare the moths for Bernard's challenge, and it reminded me of Maud, "we'd need to extract the compound, a fairly simple process of emulsifying the animal with a pestle and mortar and put the resulting slurry through a series of alcoholic distillations." I saw this as a metaphor for Maud being so emotionally beat up (mortar and pestle), and then trying to fill up the emotional void with alcohol.Yes. And isn't it ironic that the Brimstone treacle that Clive concocts is heavily laced with wine and rum. (Do fermented bananas contain alcohol?)
I also found it a sad piece of irony that Maud reads "The Ideal Home" magazine (110). I'm sure nothing in that publication can even come close to repairing the damage done in this "home".Fellow posters, think what you will about Maud, but I really felt for her, even though she became abusive.When Ginny says "A sick thrust of guilt and love and shame and overbearing failure churned through me"(111) I felt so bad. I am always saddened when children, even adult children, feel as though their parents happiness or well-being is somehow their responsibility.Or that they have somehow disappointed or fallen below the expectations of a parent. This is how I interpret Ginny's use of "Mummy" in this chapter. I had to make the idea personal to figure it out. Don't underestimate the power of that moment when a child is pierced by the realization that they haven't measured up, and want to take it all back and start over with "Mummy".This is one of those things, Ginny previously spoke of, that a person learns, sometimes through only action and insinuation, when they are young, and never leaves you. That is too much responsibility for a small child, and it only grows as the child grows. Ginny feels she has to keep Maud's secret, because it was her fault to begin with, what a burden.And not one she should have claimed exclusively. That is the shame of it, that she should try to restore "order" and "save" Clive and Vivien from the realization of it.
Maud and Ginny's "secret" hinges on Ginny's guilt. No matter how aggressive Maud gets, Ginny continues in her role. She has been groomed to be this way from childhood. Maud's aggression hurls emotional, and sometimes physical, abuse upon the guilt and secret-keeping (that she won't break 50 years later) Ginny already must deal with. It becomes clear that Maud's substance abuse will not be overcome.Absolutely.
KxBurns wrote:
Chapter 11: Arthur and the Cannibals
-how different Ginny's preparations for Vivi's arrival are in this chapter!…
-it is worth noting that Ginny views loyalty as centered around the house rather than around "the external bonds of love and friendship" (p. 115).
-what is your take on Vivi and Arthur's relationship? How do you think the rest of the family feels? Are they going to eat him alive, as the chapter's title suggests?
The Ginny we see in this chapter is a different Ginny than we are used to. She certainly makes short work of scrubbing the house down for Vivi's visit, and is almost cheery at times. I like how she says that she is protecting everyone from each other (a huge undertaking). She's like the family translator. I also enjoyed that the dinner, and following moth lesson, was almost like a functional family interaction. It lifted my spirits for a moment.
I found the shift of Vivi becoming a visitor interesting. I personally think that family members are family members, not visitors, but I have visited the family homes of others, where they are treated like a visitor (or guest) rather than a family member. It's very strange to me, but it helps me to understand some of Ginny's later decisions (like selling off the furniture, her sister had abandoned the family unit).
KxBurns wrote:Chapter 12: I Spy
-Ginny and Vivi finally discuss Maud's death and it comes as no surprise that Vivi seems to question Ginny's account. Is Vivi's skepticism really because she doesn't know about Maud's drinking and therefore doesn't grasp the likelihood of her falling down the stairs? Ginny decides that it is "wouldn’t be fair to destroy her perceptions of the past" (p. 131) and I believe this sentiment will become central, regardless of which sister is deluded about what.
I don't think that Vivi knows the extent of Maud's addiction. She wasn't around the home very much (as far as we know), and Maud didn't seem to act too differently in the presence of Vivi and Arthur (apart from the book throwing, which they didn't really see). I don't know if I agree with Ginny not telling Vivi the truth, especially after all this time, but I can understand her reasoning. It is never easy to be the bearer of bad news, and I have a suspicion she might tell Vivi before the book is through. I'd like to believe that this is why Vivi is wary about the story of Maud's death. I love that Ginny stands up for herself here, "She (Vivi) is clearly stunned that I'm fighting back... she stares at me for longer than I like-as if, for the first time ever, she's lost for words". I have been waiting to see this side of Ginny.
KxBurns wrote:Chapter 13: The Ridge Walk
-please discuss this statement by Ginny (it caps off the entire Fox Moth passage on pages 134-135, which I found fascinating!): "If you were born unaware, at least you'd be blissfully ignorant. It's not as if you're going to wake up one day and suddenly discover yourself."
-is Vivi's request a selfish one? I think it depends on what she knows about Ginny. Maybe we have magnified Ginny's oddness and how obvious it is to the world. One thing that is clear to me from this chapter is that Ginny thrives on the suffering of those around her. Feel free to disagree with this, but she feels "invigorated, revitalised and valuable" in the face of her sister's suffering! I know she's specifically talking about the expulsion when she uses those words, but she recalls it now.
Haven't we all felt, at least once, that life is just overwhelming. What if we could have that blissful ignorance, just for a day. To worry about nothing more than just existing. It's also interesting, that here, Vivi brings up the absence thing (a mild dissociative state). How frustrating for Vivi, but necessary for Ginny's ability to cope with life. I don't think that Ginny necessarily "thrives on the suffering of those around her", but relishes the chance to be a rock for someone else. She has some problems reaching out and showing love and fondness, making the first move. It is easier for her to reach out when someone is clearly in need, because their need has already made the first move. She is reactionary only, in all aspects of her life.
