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Melhay
Posts: 2,062
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264


Melhay wrote:

This metal man in the cave that works with Ria has Emerald eyes. I am thinking this could be a clue to the possession of the mechanicals. Well, we found our Watcher from the end of Lamentation. J And the one who is writing the gospels for Ria.

 

 


 Dalnewt Wrote:

 

If by possession of the metal men you mean the infectious Canticle dream which is motivating the 'first generation' mechos originally sent to create Sanctorum Lux and Isaak, the arch engineer Charles more-or-less explains his take on what happened as regards these 'first generation' mechos as follows:

 

"Something had happened to his mechoservitors. He had resisted Introspect's order to send them alone and unsupervised into the Churning Wastes on the Sanctorum Lux project, but in the end, Holy Unction compelled his compliance. He had trained them to maintain themselves, had scripted them each for scheduled visits to the Keeper's Gate for a clandestine escort to his offices in Windwir for routine checkups. And something had happened. Somehow they had stumbled across the data coded into that song and had create a new script for themselves based upon it.

  And it changed them. As it was now changing Isaak. (See Antiphon p. 189.)  

_________________________________________________________________

 


Melhay wrote:

 

It seems very, very likely to me after reading pages 259-259 we have two different KIND of metal men. We have the ones that are from the Younger Gods times, which are Isaak and his cousins. But then we have another kind in which Rau Y’Zir had ~ his silver army. I am wondering if the Watcher is one of the Y’Zir metal men. I also wonder if this second group may have more spread out in other places.


 

Dalnewt wrote:

 

I totally agree. I think there's a number of mechos, perhaps numbering more than the library 'second generation' mechos and the 'first generation' mechos originally sent to Santorum Lux. And I think they're totally dedicated to serving/worshipping the Y'Zir wizards. As Charles notes on page 259, thousands of mechos comprised the silver army of Raj Y'Zir when he descended to earth and instituted the Wizard Wars. And, some of these undoubtably sang the Seven Cacophonic Deaths for Xhum Y'Zir. And, it's a pretty good bet that the Watcher as well as other Y'Zir mechos are still serving the Y'Zir memory and/or an existing member of the Y'Zir family. 

_________________________________________________________________

 

Sorry about that I was thinking of the eyes and the possession being of Y'Zir's servitors or the Younger Gods servitors.

 

I am for some reason really stuck on the color of the eyes.  Usually they are amber like Isaak.  But this Watcher and that one silver bird have Emerald color.  AND the bird is of this different metal - silver!  Could these be an indication of Y'Zir servers?  I am thinking it is possible. :smileyhappy:

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Bibliophile
Melhay
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264


dalnewt wrote:

 


Melhay wrote:

Okay, it's been a crazy week here for me with kid starting football and all.  But I finally got through the section.  This is definitely one of those reads that I have to do when I can give my utmost attention to it.

 

I skimmed through the posts and I know some of what I am going to touch on has been mentioned, but I am going to bring it up again. :smileyhappy: Don't yell at me, okay...

 

Where do I start at?  there is just so much going on here!

 

......

 

What is up with the island Vlad is now at, the one with this ladder? Is there some sort of magnetic barrier that causes the fire stones to burn out? None of the mechaicals would be able to visit this island. That shows that Y’Zir didn’t want metal mechanicals in his area. So are there any mechanicals able to enter? And what else does this share with us?

 

Just a note as well, the Metal man Vlad found has a name just like Isaak! And he acknowledges it!

 

So what is Vlad to do with or at this ladder?

 

There are sooooo many d’jinn in the waters when Vlad gets to the island. It is amazing there are so many. But they too can not cross the barrier to the island. What are these d’jinn? I was wondering if they where the gods, but it almost seems like lost souls trying to get home. They are attracted here wanting to cross the ladder but can’t get there.


 

 

Apparently the Ladder burns out sun stones, but we don't know why yet. Further, the piers or columns of stone that make up the ladder rise directly out of the ocean, there is no island. Also, leagues of seawater separate each pier/column. Note each of the piers/columns gradually slope inward and, eventually, join at the top giving the entire structure, when viewed from a distance, the appearance of a giant cage. Further, some reflective sliver globe sits atop this cage. (I imagined a giant round Stonehenge rising from the sea with each stone gradually sloping inward to form a giant cage.)

 

The mecho Obadiah tells Vlad he will meet Behemoth who will take him into the basements of the Ladder, so presumably there's some sort of underwater base to the piers with a behemoth in residence.

 

I think the djinn are the spirits of the Younger Gods from the moon. When they were attacked by plauge and poison on the moon, they escaped via the bargaining pools. And, just like Amal, their bodies could not survive the swim but their spirits did and reside in the Ghosting Crests along with the spirit of Amal.  

 


 

Thank you for this description!! I would give you double laurels for this if I could. For some reason I was having a hard time visualizing this.

 

I am curious as to why these Younger Gods spirits seem to congrigate here.  It seems like they are waiting for something, or waiting to go home.  

 

Really looking forward to finding out more here.  And gives a whole new meaning to Ghosting Crests. :smileyhappy:

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
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DSaff
Posts: 2,048
Registered: ‎10-19-2006
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

Two kinds of "metal men" makes a lot of sense.

 


Melhay wrote:

This metal man in the cave that works with Ria has Emerald eyes. I am thinking this could be a clue to the possession of the mechanicals. Well, we found our Watcher from the end of Lamentation. J And the one who is writing the gospels for Ria.

 

This metal man mentions he has 13% of the Y’Zir’s library so he is able to prepare for the Crimson Empress and write the gospels. But, is it possible for him to be wrong about the prophecy? 13% isn’t very much to work off of.

 

The Watcher is suspicious to me. He makes expressions that are more human than mecroservitor. And he helps with the blood magics for Ria. Is he scrolled by Y’Zir or a son?

 

 

 

It seems very, very likely to me after reading pages 259-259 we have two different KIND of metal men. We have the ones that are from the Younger Gods times, which are Isaak and his cousins. But then we have another kind in which Rau Y’Zir had ~ his silver army. I am wondering if the Watcher is one of the Y’Zir metal men. I also wonder if this second group may have more spread out in other places.


 

 

DonnaS =) " Reading is a means of thinking with another person's mind; it forces you to stretch your own." Charles Scribner
"A book is like a garden carried in the pocket." Chinese Proverb
My blog: http://bookworm56.blogspot.com
Distinguished Correspondent
flouncyninja
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎09-14-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

Wow, so much happened in this section I have no idea where to begin.  I had to start keeping notes to keep my thoughts and theories straight.  So many things were confirmed - the moon is the homeland that Neb seeks, the Watcher is a mech on the side of Ria and the Crimson Empress, the quicksilver lake is within the Waste Lands and Hebda knew about the destruction of Windwir, allowing him to escape certain death ahead of time.

Everyone is so distraught at this point.  It's both incredibly depressing and fascinating.  Rudolfo is becoming a drunk as he spreads him and his troops to thin.  He's trying to do everything - search for the blood huts and Y'Zirite sympathizers in his own lands, map the tunnels, protect the mechs, form an army, figure out who tried to blow up his family... Is he ever going to catch a break?

But the influence of the Y'Zirites in the Nine Fold Forest makes complete since if Jakob and Vlad's father both took the symbol.  Perhaps secretly Jakob converted people in his homelands - including his faithful Steward - but why keep it such a secret so that Rudolfo still doesn't know about it?  This is a virus that's had a much longer time to spread than previously thought, which means it's embedded much more deeply, but why?  Why did they convert, why is it important that Rudolfo did not?  Can the Sacred Mother and Child not be of the Y'Zirite faith according to the gospel?

Also, Ria has the Watcher on her land, and he talked as though Ria knows of him and works with him in the manipulation of messages.  The Blood Guard (and thus the Crimson Empress) despise mechs and want them all destroyed to prevent the creation of the antiphon.  Perhaps the creation of the antiphon will prove that the Crimson Empress is a fake, that the entire gospel is manipulative claptrap, but Ria doesn't know that.  She doesn't seem concerned by the mechs, just the dreams that she purposely tries to prevent.

My favorite part at the end of this section was the reaction of Hebda, Renard and the Gray Guards when Neb took a step back and his feet went into the quicksilver lake.  This is obviously a sacred, dangerous location.  What did Hebda bargain with?  What are the "workers" he referred to when he told Neb to stay still?  Is the quicksilver alive, another sort of d'jin?

Rafe is awesome.  He captures two Blood Guards when they were slaughtering everyone else.  I don't even care if they explain why.  He is just awesome.

I think there are still just two sides at work here - the side of the light (Hebda, Patronus, Neb, the mechs who want to build the antiphon) and the side of the Crimson Empress (the Watcher, Ria, the Matchvolk) - but within those two sides, there are multiple factions, each acting as a cog in a larger machine.  I don't think we've met the leader of either side.  Perhaps the Crimson Empress is the reincarnation of Amal, looking to avenge her destruction through the Y'Zirite movement or maybe the old Watcher mech has pulled the strings from behind the scenes since the fall of the Wizard Kings.  Maybe the leader of the "light side" is another old mech working against the Watcher or a descendant of P'andro Whym who didn't die during the Cacophonic Deaths.  Hebda says, "I argued against it, but he told us it had to be that way.  He swore that you would -" before being cut off.  The leader behind the light (or the "light bearer" that Obediah keeps refering to) knows the future or is capable of accurately manipulating the future in very specific ways.

Some random questions:

- If the quicksilver lake is the bargaining pool and it's closer to the Keeper's Gate, how did Amal become a d'jin in the ocean?  Is there more than one pool?

- Does the tunnel system encompass the entire continent?  Is that how Hebda and the Grey Guards reached safety?

- Meirov hired the bomber (supposedly) and Lysias knew Jarvis.  If Jarvis was the bomb maker, was he also the strange man in the crowd at the library or was a third player brought in as delivery boy?  If it was Jarvis, why didn't Lysias say something?

- Why were the Named Lands empty during the time of the Wizard Kings?  What was the purpose of the wall during that time?

- What purpose are the tear ducts in the mechs?  Why would their creator include such an essentially useless component into a robot?


And a random observation - the Watcher reminds me of a Cylon and therefore gives me the creeps.  Also noticed that he has different colored eyes than the rest - emerald instead of amber.

Also a Behemoth sounds like a scary monster, and considering it's supposed to drag Vlad to the entrance of the Moon Ladder, I don't think it will be all together friendly.

 

And I think that's plenty as a first response.  Now I will dive into everyone else's thoughts and hope you haven't all moved on to the last section yet.  :smileyhappy:

 

Leslie

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dalnewt
Posts: 2,725
Registered: ‎06-16-2009
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


Flouncing wrote:


But the influence of the Y'Zirites in the Nine Fold Forest makes complete since if Jakob and Vlad's father both took the symbol.  Perhaps secretly Jakob converted people in his homelands - including his faithful Steward - but why keep it such a secret so that Rudolfo still doesn't know about it?  This is a virus that's had a much longer time to spread than previously thought, which means it's embedded much more deeply, but why?  Why did they convert, why is it important that Rudolfo did not?  Can the Sacred Mother and Child not be of the Y'Zirite faith according to the gospel?

-----------------------------------------------------------

It doesn't make any sense for Lord Jakob not to somehow make sure that his son, Rudolfo, was secretly raised in the Y'Zirite faith if he was a true believer. Earlier in the thread it's been suggested that perhaps Lord Jacob was somehow forced to take the mark of Y'Zir but actually resisted it in some way. Perhaps this is the same case with the Tam grandfather? Perhaps the Tam grandfather actually placed his 42nd daughter with the Y'Zirites to somehow try to disrupt their plans?

-------------------------------------------------------------


floucyninja wrote:

I think there are still just two sides at work here - the side of the light (Hebda, Patronus, Neb, the mechs who want to build the antiphon) and the side of the Crimson Empress (the Watcher, Ria, the Machtvolk) - but within those two sides, there are multiple factions, each acting as a cog in a larger machine.  I don't think we've met the leader of either side.  Perhaps the Crimson Empress is the reincarnation of Amal, looking to avenge her destruction through the Y'Zirite movement or maybe the old Watcher mech has pulled the strings from behind the scenes since the fall of the Wizard Kings.  Maybe the leader of the "light side" is another old mech working against the Watcher or a descendant of P'andro Whym who didn't die during the Cacophonic Deaths.  Hebda says, "I argued against it, but he told us it had to be that way.  He swore that you would -" before being cut off.  The leader behind the light (or the "light bearer" that Obediah keeps referring to) knows the future or is capable of accurately manipulating the future in very specific ways.

----------------------------------------------------------

I agree that there appear to be two conflicting forces, one is dedicated to the Y'Zir memory and worships the wizards as gods. The other seems to be dedicated to the homecoming dream and/or the advancement of human knowledge. Each side however is composed of parts. The Y'Zirites are broken into the Machtvolk and the Blood Guards and 'Watcher' mecho. The 'Light' side seems to be broken into those hiding in the beneath places, including Hebda and members of the Androfrancine Grey Guard, and others like Rudolfo who seek to preserve human knowledge and encourage human advancement. We don't yet know who leads the 'Lighters' in the beneath places.

 


 

   
flouncyninja wrote: 


Some random questions:

- If the quicksilver lake is the bargaining pool and it's closer to the Keeper's Gate, how did Amal become a d'jin in the ocean?  Is there more than one pool?
---------------------------------------------

There was a bargaining pool under the Moon Wizards Tower in the Weeping Czar material. 

There is a bargaining pool in the Beneath Places that healed Neb. There also appears to have been a bargaining pool in the basement of the island Blood Temple in Canticle. In other words it appears that there were/are multiple bargaining pools, and as the Younger Gods resided on the Moon, there were probably multiple bargaining pools there too.

----------------------------------------------

 

flouncyninja wrote:

 
- Does the tunnel system encompass the entire continent?  Is that how Hebda and the Grey Guards reached safety?

------------------------------------------------

These tunnels seem extensive but we don't know yet how far they go or whether they all connect up underground. Charles explains that the Beneath Places are the basements of those who lived under the wizards in the Old World and sub-basements created at the time of Younger Gods.

-------------------------------------------------

 

flouncyninga wrote:

 

- Meirov hired the bomber (supposedly) and Lysias knew Jarvis.  If Jarvis was the bomb maker, was he also the strange man in the crowd at the library or was a third player brought in as delivery boy?  If it was Jarvis, why didn't Lysias say something?

--------------------------------------------------

Jarvis' identity as a mercenary Androfrancine arch-engineer with knowledge of both explosives and magick implies that he was indeed the man in the crowd, but there's no concrete confirmation of that fact.

---------------------------------------------------

 

flouncyninja wrote: 

- Why were the Named Lands empty during the time of the Wizard Kings?  What was the purpose of the wall during that time?

---------------------------------------------------

All we know is that the Named Lands were beyond the Keeper's Gate. I prefer to think of the Named Lands as some sort of private preserve for the Wizard Kings that Xhum Y'zir opened up to the Machtvolk and his gypsies prior to unleashing his mecho choirs to reek destruction in the then settled lands by singing the Seven Cacophonic Deaths. 

------------------------------------------------------

 

Floucyninja wrote:

- What purpose are the tear ducts in the mechs?  Why would their creator include such an essentially useless component into a robot?

--------------------------------------------------------

I've go no clue other the vague thought that perhaps the Younger Gods might have preferred that their mechanical men be able to express emotion.

---------------------------------------------------------- 


flouncyninja (continued)

And a random observation - the Watcher reminds me of a Cylon and therefore gives me the creeps.  Also noticed that he has different colored eyes than the rest - emerald instead of amber.

Also a Behemoth sounds like a scary monster, and considering it's supposed to drag Vlad to the entrance of the Moon Ladder, I don't think it will be all together friendly.

 

And I think that's plenty as a first response.  Now I will dive into everyone else's thoughts and hope you haven't all moved on to the last section yet.  :smileyhappy:

 

Leslie


 

 

dalnewt wrote:


I going to start reading the last section so I won't be posting in this thread again unless I know that my response won't touch upon any of the knowledge I gain from that last section. I can't wait to start.:smileyhappy:     

Distinguished Bibliophile
dalnewt
Posts: 2,725
Registered: ‎06-16-2009
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

[ Edited ]

 


Melhay wrote:

Melhay wrote:

This metal man in the cave that works with Ria has Emerald eyes. I am thinking this could be a clue to the possession of the mechanicals. Well, we found our Watcher from the end of Lamentation. J And the one who is writing the gospels for Ria.

 

 


 Dalnewt Wrote:

 

If by possession of the metal men you mean the infectious Canticle dream which is motivating the 'first generation' mechos originally sent to create Sanctorum Lux and Isaak, the arch engineer Charles more-or-less explains his take on what happened as regards these 'first generation' mechos as follows:

 

"Something had happened to his mechoservitors. He had resisted Introspect's order to send them alone and unsupervised into the Churning Wastes on the Sanctorum Lux project, but in the end, Holy Unction compelled his compliance. He had trained them to maintain themselves, had scripted them each for scheduled visits to the Keeper's Gate for a clandestine escort to his offices in Windwir for routine checkups. And something had happened. Somehow they had stumbled across the data coded into that song and had create a new script for themselves based upon it.

  And it changed them. As it was now changing Isaak. (See Antiphon p. 189.)  

_________________________________________________________________

 


Melhay wrote:

 

It seems very, very likely to me after reading pages 259-259 we have two different KIND of metal men. We have the ones that are from the Younger Gods times, which are Isaak and his cousins. But then we have another kind in which Rau Y’Zir had ~ his silver army. I am wondering if the Watcher is one of the Y’Zir metal men. I also wonder if this second group may have more spread out in other places.


 

Dalnewt wrote:

 

I totally agree. I think there's a number of mechos, perhaps numbering more than the library 'second generation' mechos and the 'first generation' mechos originally sent to Santorum Lux. And I think they're totally dedicated to serving/worshipping the Y'Zir wizards. As Charles notes on page 259, thousands of mechos comprised the silver army of Raj Y'Zir when he descended to earth and instituted the Wizard Wars. And, some of these undoubtably sang the Seven Cacophonic Deaths for Xhum Y'Zir. And, it's a pretty good bet that the Watcher as well as other Y'Zir mechos are still serving the Y'Zir memory and/or an existing member of the Y'Zir family. 

_________________________________________________________________

 

Sorry about that I was thinking of the eyes and the possession being of Y'Zir's servitors or the Younger Gods servitors.

 

I am for some reason really stuck on the color of the eyes.  Usually they are amber like Isaak.  But this Watcher and that one silver bird have Emerald color.  AND the bird is of this different metal - silver!  Could these be an indication of Y'Zir servers?  I am thinking it is possible. :smileyhappy:-


 

 

 

The 'first generation Sanctorum Lux mechos and the 'second generation' library mechos were reproductions created by Charles from the drawings and diagrams of Ruefello. The birds were found intact underground by the Androfrancines. Charles just had to figure out to how to power them up again. The mechos who accompanied Raj Y'Zir in his invasion were described as being silver, but we don't know if they had emerald eyes. However, it's a good bet that the 'Watcher' mecho was one of those and became blackened and scarred when he sang out the curse for Xhum Y'Zir. So perhaps those Y'Zir mechos had emerald eyes identical to the 'Watcher'. 

 

Contributor
PeteyParker
Posts: 24
Registered: ‎07-02-2010

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

I finally finished a section during the correct week :smileyhappy:

 

Hebda got off light for what he did to Neb. Regardless of whether he believed that Neb would survive, is that a chance a father can really afford to take?

 

Going in to this book Rudolfo was my favorite character but both Rafe (when he re-appeared out of nowhere) and Lysias (when he actually told Rudolfo that they needed a leader not a drunk) have had some great moments.

 

I think the biggest revelation (besides Hebda leaving Neb) had to be the shear amount of people that were detected entering the secret shines. It makes you wonder, even though they are practicing in secret, which group is actually the minority in the Ninefold Forests?

Contributor
ToniWI
Posts: 22
Registered: ‎03-29-2010

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

I wonder if the watcher is using everyone as a pawn. He seems to be playing a game of chess where he is directing the outcome. What are his plans? Who is he taking orders from or who wrote his scripting?
Distinguished Correspondent
flouncyninja
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎09-14-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


dalnewt wrote:

 


-----------------------------------------------------------

It doesn't make any sense for Lord Jakob not to somehow make sure that his son, Rudolfo, was secretly raised in the Y'Zirite faith if he was a true believer. Earlier in the thread it's been suggested that perhaps Lord Jacob was somehow forced to take the mark of Y'Zir but actually resisted it in some way. Perhaps this is the same case with the Tam grandfather? Perhaps the Tam grandfather actually placed his 42nd daughter with the Y'Zirites to somehow try to disrupt their plans?

-------------------------------------------------------------

 


 

 

In my head, I could see Jakob and Vlad's father (has he been given a proper name yet?) being true believers and their following actions being of result of that belief.  We don't know the full Y'Zirite teachings or prophecies.  Perhaps it's crucial for the Child of Promise to be the creation of a non-Y'Zirite father and mother, to then choose to become a Y'Zirite or assist in the rise of the Crimson Empress of his own volition. 

 

My hesitation with thinking that the grandfather Li Tam wasn't a true believer is the book that he left for Mal that more or less sentenced future generations of his family to death.  If Rudolfo hadn't rescued the Tams, I think Ria would have sentenced all the adults to death without hesitation.  I can't imagine doing that to your own family without truly believing in the gospel.

 

Then again, this is all a giant long con on both sides, so maybe there's only one person holding the puppet strings, playing both sides, and so the players in the con could also do nonsensical things like playing both sides.  I don't know.  It's all quite a lot to ponder.  I hope that we get some more solid answers before we have to wait for the next book.

Distinguished Correspondent
flouncyninja
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎09-14-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


dalnewt wrote:

 

---------------------------------------------

There was a bargaining pool under the Moon Wizards Tower in the Weeping Czar material. 

There is a bargaining pool in the Beneath Places that healed Neb. There also appears to have been a bargaining pool in the basement of the island Blood Temple in Canticle. In other words it appears that there were/are multiple bargaining pools, and as the Younger Gods resided on the Moon, there were probably multiple bargaining pools there too.

----------------------------------------------

 

 

 

 

I guess after reading the Falling Moon short, I took the bargaining pool to be some sort of place that could act as a teleportation device, meaning it would have a connecting end point.  Thinking more on it, that doesn't make much sense because these pools were used for other things than transport between earth and moon, obviously.  Now I'm left with wondering how the bragaining pools are created, how many are there, who has the power to create and control them...

 

And I'm thinking the bird cage like stones in the Ghosting Crest is the end of the "teleportation device" I invisioned Amal using to get to the earth.  That would explain all the d'jinn in the water - they were all people who used the bargaining pools to get off the moon without success.  I've half developed a theory that the antiphon will act as an activation code to "activate" the big glass ball on top of the rocks and allow it to function as a transport to the moon.  But then there are big questions like why would the antiphon be built so far away in the mountains, why have the landing zone in the water, etc. etc. that rip the theory apart.  We'll see.  :smileyhappy:

Distinguished Correspondent
flouncyninja
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎09-14-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


PeteyParker wrote:

I finally finished a section during the correct week :smileyhappy:

 

Hebda got off light for what he did to Neb. Regardless of whether he believed that Neb would survive, is that a chance a father can really afford to take?

 

Going in to this book Rudolfo was my favorite character but both Rafe (when he re-appeared out of nowhere) and Lysias (when he actually told Rudolfo that they needed a leader not a drunk) have had some great moments.

 

I think the biggest revelation (besides Hebda leaving Neb) had to be the shear amount of people that were detected entering the secret shines. It makes you wonder, even though they are practicing in secret, which group is actually the minority in the Ninefold Forests?


 

I think Rafe has become my favorite character too.  Him showing up with those Blood Guard girls tied up just proves how great he is.  I hope we get more of him in the last section.

 

Scribe
DSaff
Posts: 2,048
Registered: ‎10-19-2006

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

Your ending question has been on my mind too. It is almost too frightening to think about. Section 4 awaits  :smileyhappy:

 


PeteyParker wrote:

I finally finished a section during the correct week :smileyhappy:

 

Hebda got off light for what he did to Neb. Regardless of whether he believed that Neb would survive, is that a chance a father can really afford to take?

 

Going in to this book Rudolfo was my favorite character but both Rafe (when he re-appeared out of nowhere) and Lysias (when he actually told Rudolfo that they needed a leader not a drunk) have had some great moments.

 

I think the biggest revelation (besides Hebda leaving Neb) had to be the shear amount of people that were detected entering the secret shines. It makes you wonder, even though they are practicing in secret, which group is actually the minority in the Ninefold Forests?


 

 

DonnaS =) " Reading is a means of thinking with another person's mind; it forces you to stretch your own." Charles Scribner
"A book is like a garden carried in the pocket." Chinese Proverb
My blog: http://bookworm56.blogspot.com
Correspondent
LadyMin
Posts: 51
Registered: ‎11-29-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264


pen21 wrote:

 


Nadine wrote:

OK, Paul. I have to say again that you have made fantastic section breaks. BUT HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO ME!  :smileymad:  Every POV ends leaving you hanging! Do you have any idea what will power it is taking not to turn the page! Revelations! Wow!

 

Well, I need to collect my thoughts. The discussion doesn't start until tomorrow.

 

Except: I was right about Brother Hebda!!! :smileytongue: -- Brother Hebda lives! I knew something was fishy about that whole set up at the beginning of Lamentation!


 

 

Yes, Hebda lives. I didn't catch on to this til the second section of this book. This is a great plot twist. Also Habda the General Orios and his men showing up. Was the destruction all staged or were they brought back from the dead? I am leaning toward both Windwir destruction staged and they were brought back or never died. This is a master of manipulation to pull this off.

Luanne


That fooled me too. I was sure Hebda was a spirit that would only appear in dreams and now here he is, alive. I find I can't read this book at my usual speed, because if I do I miss the subtle hints, and I'm sure there were hints.

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Nadine
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Registered: ‎10-30-2006

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

Leslie wrote:

I think Rafe has become my favorite character too.  Him showing up with those Blood Guard girls tied up just proves how great he is.  I hope we get more of him in the last section.

-----------------------------------

 

I can't comment much on this thread anymore since I've moved on. But I did want to interject that I had not put much significance on Rafe at this point. But I think you might have hit on something here. Rafe is a very good character and has not been utilized much. I think Ken is grooming him for bigger things and we will see him taking a bigger role in Requiem--maybe even a POV. And you are right! I hadn't realized it. No one so far has been much of a match for the Blood Guards, but Rafe took them on and won!

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Nadine
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


Nadine wrote:

Leslie wrote:

I think Rafe has become my favorite character too.  Him showing up with those Blood Guard girls tied up just proves how great he is.  I hope we get more of him in the last section.

-----------------------------------

 

I can't comment much on this thread anymore since I've moved on. But I did want to interject that I had not put much significance on Rafe at this point. But I think you might have hit on something here. Rafe is a very good character and has not been utilized much. I think Ken is grooming him for bigger things and we will see him taking a bigger role in Requiem--maybe even a POV. And you are right! I hadn't realized it. No one so far has been much of a match for the Blood Guards, but Rafe took them on and won!


 

 

Oh, another thing I just thought of. I think Rudolfo spend a year or so in his youth sailing with Rafe before he became a ruler (I think with Gregoric). I don't know where I got that information. It would have had to have been in Lamentation. But that indicates that there is a lot more to Rafe then just a person who moves people and goods around for whoever will pay. Rafe could have had an influence on the "formation" or Rudolfo (a la Tam). We don't know much about Rafe yet, but I think you are right, there is a lot more to him.

 

I can't back up my comment about Rudolfo's apprentiship with Rafe right now, but I will check on it later.

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flouncyninja
Posts: 78
Registered: ‎09-14-2009

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


Nadine wrote:

 


Nadine wrote:

Leslie wrote:

I think Rafe has become my favorite character too.  Him showing up with those Blood Guard girls tied up just proves how great he is.  I hope we get more of him in the last section.

-----------------------------------

 

I can't comment much on this thread anymore since I've moved on. But I did want to interject that I had not put much significance on Rafe at this point. But I think you might have hit on something here. Rafe is a very good character and has not been utilized much. I think Ken is grooming him for bigger things and we will see him taking a bigger role in Requiem--maybe even a POV. And you are right! I hadn't realized it. No one so far has been much of a match for the Blood Guards, but Rafe took them on and won!


 

 

Oh, another thing I just thought of. I think Rudolfo spend a year or so in his youth sailing with Rafe before he became a ruler (I think with Gregoric). I don't know where I got that information. It would have had to have been in Lamentation. But that indicates that there is a lot more to Rafe then just a person who moves people and goods around for whoever will pay. Rafe could have had an influence on the "formation" or Rudolfo (a la Tam). We don't know much about Rafe yet, but I think you are right, there is a lot more to him.

 

I can't back up my comment about Rudolfo's apprentiship with Rafe right now, but I will check on it later.


 

You're right.  It was referenced in Canticle a few times as they were sailing for the Li Tam family that Rudolfo knew Rafe and had spent some time sailing with him when he was younger.  I believe Gregoric was with him as well.

 

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kenscholes
Posts: 136
Registered: ‎10-17-2008

Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

It's nice to see that people are enjoying Rafe.  He has more stories in him, including the time he sailed with Rudolfo years earlier.  I've considered him as a character for a potential stand-alone novel as well as some shorter projects.  :smileywink:

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PeteyParker
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

 


kenscholes wrote:

It's nice to see that people are enjoying Rafe.  He has more stories in him, including the time he sailed with Rudolfo years earlier.  I've considered him as a character for a potential stand-alone novel as well as some shorter projects.  :smileywink:


 

Excellent!

 

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Melhay
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264


kenscholes wrote:

It's nice to see that people are enjoying Rafe.  He has more stories in him, including the time he sailed with Rudolfo years earlier.  I've considered him as a character for a potential stand-alone novel as well as some shorter projects.  :smileywink:


 

Rafe would be a great character to read about.  He has a tough bone to him and I like that.

 

I still would love to read more of Rudolfo and his long time close friend, which we lost early in the series - Gregoric.  He is one character that is not in the stories, but I feel for through Rudolfo.  I think in part it is due to his loss of such a great friend.   Their youth growing up would be great to read, as a couple of crazy young kids getting in trouble.

 

Melissa

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BryanThomasS
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Registered: ‎06-15-2010
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Re: ANTIPHON SNEAK PEEK: Section 3, Revelations: page 168-264

Well job interviews, moving, and other real life concerns have side tracked me.  Been unemployed since May and we needed to downsize.  So I am behind.  I have finished this section and will review to put something together, but didn't want you to think I vaporized.  I just had to put this aside temporarily.  Should be back up to speed soon.  Already intrigued reading the first parts of your discussion.

 

Bryan

Author of "The North Star Serial" and "The Worker Prince."

www.bryanthomasschmidt.net