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Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Nadine wrote:

Melhay wrote:

***SPOILERS***

 

...

When I was rereading pg 314, I was wondering what Shashara, Arteel, & Denth have in common?  Vasher killed 2 and wants to kill Denth.  Is there more to the relationship of these 4 people then we think?  Even Nightblood seems to know them all and thinks Denth would be happy to see him and then in the next breath wants to go see Shashara that she would be happy with him.  Just seems suspicious to me.


 Page 314

 

As usual, Nightblood refused to acknowledge Shashara’s death. She made
me, you know, Nightblood said. Made me to destroy things that were evil. I’m
rather good at it. I think she’d be proud of me. We should go talk to her. Show her
how well I do my job.

----------------------------

 

Shashara seems to be his creator. I have  feeling that Nightblood does a lot of killing on his own without the help of Vasher. I also think Nightblood kills an "evil" person and does not know what he does. The implication above is that he killed Shashara his creator and doesn't know it. I also don't know how Nightblood defines "evil". I'm not sure if some one like Shashara started out good and then became "evil" or something has gone wrong with Nightblood. He has killed several soldiers, though on the wrong side of the conflict, I would not define them as "evil."

 

Vasher does not like the idea of killing and is very reluctant to do so. He did remark that Nightblood was "too good" at his job.

 

I tend to refer to Nightblood as male but I've noted that Nightblood's sex has never been identified and I don't think I've seen a pronoun used to reference "him."


Okay here is another thought on Nightblood.  I am referencing page 204, this is where I got the line on my Magic Systems post of life and people were what Nightblood had been created to protect.

 

Vasher notes in his thoughts that protection could cause destruction.  So maybe it is not that the people are evil, but are against who holds the sword.

 

pg 204

  But I can feel you seeing it. Crimson. Like blood in the air.

  Vasher didn't respond.  The sword couldn't see. But with its powerful, twisted BioChroma, it could sense life and people. Both were things Nightblood had been created to protect. It was strange, how easily and quickly protection could cause destruction. Sometimes, Vasher wondered if the two weren't really the same thing. Protect a flower, destroy the pests who wanted to feed on it. Protect a building, destroy the plants that could have grown in the soil.

  Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates.

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Inspired Scribe
carmen22
Posts: 988
Registered: ‎01-12-2009

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Melhay wrote:

***POSSIBLE SPOILERS*** 

 

The next thing I am stuck on tonight was Clod the Lifeless.

 

Vivenna seems to notice a look of determination in Clods face when he was fighting to protect her (pg 335).  The Lifeless are not to have living human expressions or feelings in there eyes, at this moment Clod did have it.

 

Clod also had a moment when he appeared quietly beside Vivenna at the safe house.  Denth said he does that once in a while like he is curious about humans (pg 234).

 

Also, Denth mentions that you can get more skilled Lifeless, that the have some semblance of their past life to be better swordsman for fighters if they were before.

 

With just these 3 instances I wonder if there is some inkling of more human left in him that is trying to get out than people give them credit for.  Maybe more will come out later in the book.


Yeah, I was wondering this same thing when Vivenna was talking of Clod. I was wondering if there's still a part of his soul left and maybe he's starting to have feelings for his human friends/masters. I'm kind of hoping that maybe there is more to Clod, and I wonder if he will continue to show human emotions (maybe do something that wasn't a command?).

_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

IF it is true that the Returned can prophesis for the future, here is Lightsongs take on what he saw in the painting he looked at and really liked.

 

Lightsong Responds positively to a painting of war

 Pg 267 – 269

  …Violent, terrible reds, clashing against one another like waves – waves that only vaguely resembled men, yet that somehow managed to convey the idea of armies fighting much better than any detailed realistic depiction could have.

  Chaos.  Bloody wounds upon bloody uniforms upon bloody skin.  Thiere was so much violence in red.  His own color.  He almost felt as if he were in the painting-felt its turmoil shaking him, disorienting him, pulling on him.

  The waves of men pointed toward one figure at the center.  A woman, vaguely depicted by a couple of curved brushstrokes.  And yet it was obvious.  She stood high, as if atop a cresting wave of crashing soldiers, caught in midmotion, head flung back, her arm upraised.

  Holding a deep black sword that darkened the red sky around it.

  “The Battle of Twilight Falls,” Llarimar said quietly, standing beside him in the white hallway.  “Last conflict of the Manywar.”

  Lightsong nodded. He’d known that, somehow.  The faces of many of the soldiers were tinged with grey.  They were Lifeless.  The Manywar had been the first time they had been used in large numbers on the battlefield.

 

Remember Llarimar his High Priest does NOT see this in the painting and seems to have concern for Lightsongs interpretation.

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
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Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


carmen22 wrote:

Melhay wrote:

***POSSIBLE SPOILERS*** 

 

The next thing I am stuck on tonight was Clod the Lifeless.

 

Vivenna seems to notice a look of determination in Clods face when he was fighting to protect her (pg 335).  The Lifeless are not to have living human expressions or feelings in there eyes, at this moment Clod did have it.

 

Clod also had a moment when he appeared quietly beside Vivenna at the safe house.  Denth said he does that once in a while like he is curious about humans (pg 234).

 

Also, Denth mentions that you can get more skilled Lifeless, that the have some semblance of their past life to be better swordsman for fighters if they were before.

 

With just these 3 instances I wonder if there is some inkling of more human left in him that is trying to get out than people give them credit for.  Maybe more will come out later in the book.


Yeah, I was wondering this same thing when Vivenna was talking of Clod. I was wondering if there's still a part of his soul left and maybe he's starting to have feelings for his human friends/masters. I'm kind of hoping that maybe there is more to Clod, and I wonder if he will continue to show human emotions (maybe do something that wasn't a command?).


 

I think I have to agree with you.
_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

I have updated the information on the Returned Gods we have meet and are mentioned in the book thus far.  Please, any changes please do, also for additional info.

 

Returned Gods:

1)  Lightsong the bold (he)

         For Bravery – 1 of 4 Gods

         Duty:  Holds Lifeless commands

         Colors:  Red & Gold

         High Priest:  Llarimar

         Not into politics

         Not for war

2)  Brightvision the true (she)

         Colors:  White & Green

         Not into politics

3)  Blushwever the beautiful (she)

         Of Honesty

         Duty:  Communication & Interpersonal relationships

         Colors:  Green & Silver

         High Priestess:  Inhanna

         Is for war

4)  Calmseer (she)

         Is deceased

5)  Lifeblesser (he)

         Colors:  Blue & Silver

6)  Mercystar (she)

         Of Kindness

         Duty: Holds Lifeless commands

         Colors:  Yellow & Gold (pg 238 Orange & Gold)

         Involved in politics

7)  Hopefinder the just (he)

         Of Innocence & Beauty

         Duty: Holds Lifeless commands

         Colors:  Lavender & Silver

         Returned when 2 yrs old

         Involved in politics

8)  Stillmark

         Color:  Blue & Gold

         High Priest:  Nanrovah

         Not for war

9)  Weatherlove (he)

         Of Storms

         Colors:  Green & Gold

10) Truthcall (he)

          Duty: Vote over trade with kingdoms

          Colors:  Maroon & White

11) Allmother (she)         

          Duty: Holds Lifeless commands

12) Mirthgiver (he)         

          Of laughter

13) Giftbeacon 

14) Peaceyearning

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

Tonight I will not be able to get to a computer till probably really late.  I will try to get on here, but don't know if I can.

 

I plan on looking through the history of Hallandren, God Kings, Royals, and all.  There is a lot of information in this section in relation to all of this.  I am curious on the whole God King Breath thing, and what Susebron knows and doesn't know.  And the relationships of all of it fitting together.

 

I feel that what the storyteller, Hoid, has to share if extremely important but very detailed.  In comparison with what the priests say along with Susebron himself, and I think what Denth mentions of it to Vivenna also.  There seems to be a lot of conflict in the information, but I can't pinpoint the conflict just yet.

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Inspired Scribe
carmen22
Posts: 988
Registered: ‎01-12-2009

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Melhay wrote:

What of the mercenaries???  I think Denth is more than he wants to lead on to.  I think Denth can be older and much wiser than we see.  He seems very set on saying he is doing the job because that is what employees do, and that everyone thinks badly of mercenaries.  Who is he trying to convince, himself or someone else?  Sounds to me as himself.

 

***SPOILERS***

Pg 314 Nightblood sees Denth and recognizes him.  Nightblood gives Denth another name, Vara Treledees, and mentions that Denth (Vara) would be happy to see him.  Was Nightblood being sarcastic or serious?  I think possibly serious.  I think there is more behind Denth and Vasher (also named Tax on pg 195-196).  I think they know each other better than they are leading on to at this point.

 

Now, for Denths real name - Vara Treledees...  Is Denth related to the God Kings High Priest?  Did anyone else catch that?  The High Priests name is Treledees.  Where did that come from? 

 

I am starting to think they are around to keep an eye on things.  But what things?  They seem to be siding theirselves with Idris and helping.  Denth seems to be involved in a lot of the meetings and the politics that are happening, even though he seems to be letting Vivenna take the lead at the moment.

 

It just dawned on me that the storyteller was telling Siri that the people were divided in his long story.  I will have to go back now and reread that section to see if there is something there that can help me.

 

There is more to Denth and I think he is on the right side (good side) but there is definetly much, much more to him than meets the eye...


 

Denth is a character we need to watch out for, Vivenna is always seeing two sides of him it seems. The one look she describes is the look of a dangerous and threatening man, but then she also sees the look of a good soul hiding underneath at times. There has been some bad times in his past that may catch up to him in the future it seems. I'm so curious to know what will happen once Vasher and Denth meet there seems to be a lot of hostility between them and business left unfinished. I wonder if in the end they will work together, or how this will play out if Vasher is not their evil force.

 

 

_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
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carmen22
Posts: 988
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

[ Edited ]

  I am going out of town for my brithday(11th july) tomorrow the 10th through the 18th so I wont be around very much, if at all. I know we just stared this discussion, but since I won't be around I was just wondering what you guys will be reading, if we will be reading the Shannara or Warbreaker?  This is why I put my thoughts out there so soon and I'm trying to get to all the posts before I leave, but with packing and all I may not be able to, sorry.

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 01:19 PM
_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
Inspired Scribe
carmen22
Posts: 988
Registered: ‎01-12-2009

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

 


Melhay wrote:

Okay here is another thought on Nightblood.  I am referencing page 204, this is where I got the line on my Magic Systems post of life and people were what Nightblood had been created to protect.

 

Vasher notes in his thoughts that protection could cause destruction.  So maybe it is not that the people are evil, but are against who holds the sword.

 

pg 204

  But I can feel you seeing it. Crimson. Like blood in the air.

  Vasher didn't respond.  The sword couldn't see. But with its powerful, twisted BioChroma, it could sense life and people. Both were things Nightblood had been created to protect. It was strange, how easily and quickly protection could cause destruction. Sometimes, Vasher wondered if the two weren't really the same thing. Protect a flower, destroy the pests who wanted to feed on it. Protect a building, destroy the plants that could have grown in the soil.

  Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates.


 

Nightblood is an interesting character he does seem to only want to kill, but his mind is more like a child's. I'm thinking your right that if they're threatening him or his owner is who his "child like mind" sees as evil. This is a very interesting paragraph it seems to be giving us a lot of information on how Nightblood and Vasher see things. I'm not thinking that Vasher is evil but after something and maybe trying to undo something that caused destruction? "Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates." This seems like a pretty important and more personal statement and maybe this holds some truth for Vasher. 
_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
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Melhay
Posts: 2,062
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


carmen22 wrote:

  I am going out of town for my brithday(11th july) tomorrow the 10th through the 18th so I wont be around very much, if at all. I know we just stared this discussion, but since I won't be around I was just wondering what you guys will be reading, if we will be reading the Shannara or Warbreaker?  This is why I put my thoughts out there so soon and I'm trying to get to all the posts before I leave, but with packing and all I may not be able to, sorry.

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 01:19 PM

 

First off

   HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!! And have a wonderful time!!

 

I think Nadine mentioned about reading the first section of Shannara for next week while we talk about Warbreaker, then to finish the week I am not sure.  What would you like to do to finish the week out?

 

I will be on for a little bit tomorrow during the day, but after 5:00 I will probably not be back on till Sunday.  I have to go stay with my dad and then have a carnival Saturday night.

 

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Inspired Scribe
carmen22
Posts: 988
Registered: ‎01-12-2009
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

[ Edited ]

Melhay wrote:

carmen22 wrote:

  I am going out of town for my brithday(11th july) tomorrow the 10th through the 18th so I wont be around very much, if at all. I know we just stared this discussion, but since I won't be around I was just wondering what you guys will be reading, if we will be reading the Shannara or Warbreaker?  This is why I put my thoughts out there so soon and I'm trying to get to all the posts before I leave, but with packing and all I may not be able to, sorry.

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 01:19 PM

 

First off

   HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!! And have a wonderful time!!

 

I think Nadine mentioned about reading the first section of Shannara for next week while we talk about Warbreaker, then to finish the week I am not sure.  What would you like to do to finish the week out?

 

I will be on for a little bit tomorrow during the day, but after 5:00 I will probably not be back on till Sunday.  I have to go stay with my dad and then have a carnival Saturday night.

 


 

 

Thank you, Melhay! I'm sure it will be tons of fun! 

 

I think reading the first part of Shannara will be fine with me, because honestly I don't know how much time I'll have to read anyway, so hopefully when I get back I won't be to far behind here. I'm going to try and get on a couple nights so I can stay on track but "who knows?" LOL!

 

Krista

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 02:24 PM
_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
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Nadine
Posts: 2,456
Registered: ‎10-30-2006
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


carmen22 wrote:

  I am going out of town for my brithday(11th july) tomorrow the 10th through the 18th so I wont be around very much, if at all. I know we just stared this discussion, but since I won't be around I was just wondering what you guys will be reading, if we will be reading the Shannara or Warbreaker?  This is why I put my thoughts out there so soon and I'm trying to get to all the posts before I leave, but with packing and all I may not be able to, sorry.

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 01:19 PM

Melissa is pressed for time and you are leaving. Lets slow down here for awhile and give everyone some time. We have three weeks more to go this month and we are already more than halfway through the book. So we don't have to rush. We have plenty of material out there already on Part 2 and also a lot of material from Brandon. Oh, and lets not forget looking through that other forum!

 

I'm going to switch over to Shannara for a few days. So just post what you want to get off your mind and on the board, and lets call a weekend break. We can come back and finish our discussion about Part 2 and then pick up our reading again.

 

We will hold our discussion of Part 3 until the 19th or 20th when Krista returns. Krista, since you will be out-of-town for a week, you might as well go ahead with Part 3. Then we can finish off the final week of the month with the conclusion. The timing will work out perfectly.

 

"Happy birthday to you, happy birthday to you.

Happy birthday to Krista....

Happy birthday to you."

 

Well, I'm a bit off tune :smileysad:but the thought is there!  :smileyvery-happy:

Distinguished Bibliophile
Nadine
Posts: 2,456
Registered: ‎10-30-2006

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


carmen22 wrote:

 


Melhay wrote:

Okay here is another thought on Nightblood.  I am referencing page 204, this is where I got the line on my Magic Systems post of life and people were what Nightblood had been created to protect.

 

Vasher notes in his thoughts that protection could cause destruction.  So maybe it is not that the people are evil, but are against who holds the sword.

 

pg 204

  But I can feel you seeing it. Crimson. Like blood in the air.

  Vasher didn't respond.  The sword couldn't see. But with its powerful, twisted BioChroma, it could sense life and people. Both were things Nightblood had been created to protect. It was strange, how easily and quickly protection could cause destruction. Sometimes, Vasher wondered if the two weren't really the same thing. Protect a flower, destroy the pests who wanted to feed on it. Protect a building, destroy the plants that could have grown in the soil.

  Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates.


 

Nightblood is an interesting character he does seem to only want to kill, but his mind is more like a child's. I'm thinking your right that if they're threatening him or his owner is who his "child like mind" sees as evil. This is a very interesting paragraph it seems to be giving us a lot of information on how Nightblood and Vasher see things. I'm not thinking that Vasher is evil but after something and maybe trying to undo something that caused destruction? "Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates." This seems like a pretty important and more personal statement and maybe this holds some truth for Vasher. 

I think that Nightblood was created to protect whom ever he was "bonded" to. He does seem to have a mind-link with Vasher -- they can read each other's thoughts -- and Nightblood doesn't attack Vasher but did his creator. So Nightblood appears to be a mindless killer that responds to Vasher's needs. We still do not know at this point who the bad guys and the good guys are.

Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Nadine wrote:

carmen22 wrote:

 


Melhay wrote:

Okay here is another thought on Nightblood.  I am referencing page 204, this is where I got the line on my Magic Systems post of life and people were what Nightblood had been created to protect.

 

Vasher notes in his thoughts that protection could cause destruction.  So maybe it is not that the people are evil, but are against who holds the sword.

 

pg 204

  But I can feel you seeing it. Crimson. Like blood in the air.

  Vasher didn't respond.  The sword couldn't see. But with its powerful, twisted BioChroma, it could sense life and people. Both were things Nightblood had been created to protect. It was strange, how easily and quickly protection could cause destruction. Sometimes, Vasher wondered if the two weren't really the same thing. Protect a flower, destroy the pests who wanted to feed on it. Protect a building, destroy the plants that could have grown in the soil.

  Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates.


 

Nightblood is an interesting character he does seem to only want to kill, but his mind is more like a child's. I'm thinking your right that if they're threatening him or his owner is who his "child like mind" sees as evil. This is a very interesting paragraph it seems to be giving us a lot of information on how Nightblood and Vasher see things. I'm not thinking that Vasher is evil but after something and maybe trying to undo something that caused destruction? "Protect a man. Live with the destruction he creates." This seems like a pretty important and more personal statement and maybe this holds some truth for Vasher. 

I think that Nightblood was created to protect whom ever he was "bonded" to. He does seem to have a mind-link with Vasher -- they can read each other's thoughts -- and Nightblood doesn't attack Vasher but did his creator. So Nightblood appears to be a mindless killer that responds to Vasher's needs. We still do not know at this point who the bad guys and the good guys are.


 

I think in someway Vasher took possession of Nightblood, however that is done, then killed his creater, Shashara.  Vasher keeps telling Nightblood on pg 314 "We killed Shashara long ago" so for some reason his bond with Vasher, to protect Vasher, took over and he has killed people that were enemies or were going to harm Vasher to protect him. 

 

For all I know, Nightblood could have been made for Vasher.  But, I wonder because of the women that Lightsong sees in the painting is holding the black sword which I think is Nightblood.  Maybe Vasher dies and Vivenna is next to take Nightblood as a possession... Or does Nightblood choose who he protects?

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
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carmen22
Posts: 988
Registered: ‎01-12-2009
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Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Nadine wrote:

carmen22 wrote:

  I am going out of town for my brithday(11th july) tomorrow the 10th through the 18th so I wont be around very much, if at all. I know we just stared this discussion, but since I won't be around I was just wondering what you guys will be reading, if we will be reading the Shannara or Warbreaker?  This is why I put my thoughts out there so soon and I'm trying to get to all the posts before I leave, but with packing and all I may not be able to, sorry.

Message Edited by carmen22 on 07-09-2009 01:19 PM

Melissa is pressed for time and you are leaving. Lets slow down here for awhile and give everyone some time. We have three weeks more to go this month and we are already more than halfway through the book. So we don't have to rush. We have plenty of material out there already on Part 2 and also a lot of material from Brandon. Oh, and lets not forget looking through that other forum!

 

I'm going to switch over to Shannara for a few days. So just post what you want to get off your mind and on the board, and lets call a weekend break. We can come back and finish our discussion about Part 2 and then pick up our reading again.

 

We will hold our discussion of Part 3 until the 19th or 20th when Krista returns. Krista, since you will be out-of-town for a week, you might as well go ahead with Part 3. Then we can finish off the final week of the month with the conclusion. The timing will work out perfectly.

 

"Happy birthday to you, happy birthday to you.

Happy birthday to Krista....

Happy birthday to you."

 

Well, I'm a bit off tune :smileysad:but the thought is there!  :smileyvery-happy:


 

Sounds good, Nadine! I'll read as much as I can and when I get back I'll let you guys know where I stand, because who knows how much reading time I'll have :smileywink:.

 

Thanks for all the Happy Birthday wishes, guys!

_______________________
"Bright colors, Vasher thought. I'll have to get used to those again. In any other nation, the vibrant blues and yellows would have been ridiculous on soldiers. This, however, was Hallandren: land of Returned gods, Lifeless servants, BioChromatic research, and - of course - color." Warbreaker By Brandon Sanderson
Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

Okay, I pulled a list together of the history of Hallandren.  Most of this came from the Hoid's story.  It kind of ended up being a little long but I will post it here if you would care to read through it.  Please, if there are any changes go ahead and make them, I can make mistakes.

 

Hallandren History People of Chedesh  - Sailed the Inner Sea from the east – First discovered the land  

Vo – 1st Returned

      Returned on a ship at the coast at this time

      Declared the 5 Visions

      Died 1 week later

   Vo’s ship found the kingdom of Pahn Kahl here a city called Hanald

       Vo’s crew choose his wife as their Queen (the Royals)

           Royals – ruled 300 years ago (Vo’s Wife)

       Vo’s crew used the Tears of Edgli to make die and sell

 

Awakening was discovered 400 years ago

 

The years leading up to the Manywar

   Were days of the Five Scholars and discovering the new Commands

      One of the 5 scholars discovered the Commands & Methods to create Lifeless from 1 Breath

Kalad the Usurper, also called Strifelover, a Returned

   Started the Manywar, created the Lifeless to seize power of Hallandren, but drove royals out to highlands.

      Manywar was for 1 of these reasons:

         The Tears of Edgli to make die and MONEY

         Breath

         The ability to create Lifeless so cheaply

 

During the Manywar

   the 5 Scholars divided, going to different sides

   Royals broke away from Kalad     

      Vo’s wife, Queen, left – was pregnant with Vo’s child

      (Are descendants of the 1st Returned.  The God Kings are not.)

   Kalad renamed the city to Hallandren

  Peacegiver the Blessed (a Returned) – Defeated Kalad,

   Saved Hallandren from being destroyed by using politics

   Created The Light of Peace – gathered thousands of Breaths during Manywars      Passed The Light of Peace to the 1st God King   Died to give his Breath to successor (Give life away to bless another?) Total of 5 God Kings in 300 years  Each grows restless once they have an heir and looks for the opportunity to us up his Breath to benefit the realm.

  #1

  #2

  #3 died to heal children of a village attacked by bandits

       (2nd child born a month before – 1st was a girl of not divine powers)

  #4 died giving his Breath to cure a plague of distrentia

       (child was born just weeks before)

  #5 Currently living – 50 years

 

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Distinguished Bibliophile
Nadine
Posts: 2,456
Registered: ‎10-30-2006
0 Kudos

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

Per usual excellent research! Actually, I was doing some research on Hoid myself since he seems to be an important issue in the "Questions to Brandon." I don't have anything more to add at this point but I will if I discover something your eagle eye overlooked. One nice thing I have discovered about the whole book being online as a PDF file is that it is searchable. Oh, wow -- what a help that is!
 

Melhay wrote:

Okay, I pulled a list together of the history of Hallandren.  Most of this came from the Hoid's story.  It kind of ended up being a little long but I will post it here if you would care to read through it.  Please, if there are any changes go ahead and make them, I can make mistakes.

 

Hallandren History People of Chedesh  - Sailed the Inner Sea from the east – First discovered the land  

Vo – 1st Returned

      Returned on a ship at the coast at this time

      Declared the 5 Visions

      Died 1 week later

   Vo’s ship found the kingdom of Pahn Kahl here a city called Hanald

       Vo’s crew choose his wife as their Queen (the Royals)

           Royals – ruled 300 years ago (Vo’s Wife)

       Vo’s crew used the Tears of Edgli to make die and sell

 

Awakening was discovered 400 years ago

 

The years leading up to the Manywar

   Were days of the Five Scholars and discovering the new Commands

      One of the 5 scholars discovered the Commands & Methods to create Lifeless from 1 Breath

Kalad the Usurper, also called Strifelover, a Returned

   Started the Manywar, created the Lifeless to seize power of Hallandren, but drove royals out to highlands.

      Manywar was for 1 of these reasons:

         The Tears of Edgli to make die and MONEY

         Breath

         The ability to create Lifeless so cheaply

 

During the Manywar

   the 5 Scholars divided, going to different sides

   Royals broke away from Kalad     

      Vo’s wife, Queen, left – was pregnant with Vo’s child

      (Are descendants of the 1st Returned.  The God Kings are not.)

   Kalad renamed the city to Hallandren

  Peacegiver the Blessed (a Returned) – Defeated Kalad,

   Saved Hallandren from being destroyed by using politics

   Created The Light of Peace – gathered thousands of Breaths during Manywars      Passed The Light of Peace to the 1st God King   Died to give his Breath to successor (Give life away to bless another?) Total of 5 God Kings in 300 years  Each grows restless once they have an heir and looks for the opportunity to us up his Breath to benefit the realm.

  #1

  #2

  #3 died to heal children of a village attacked by bandits

       (2nd child born a month before – 1st was a girl of not divine powers)

  #4 died giving his Breath to cure a plague of distrentia

       (child was born just weeks before)

  #5 Currently living – 50 years

 


 

Distinguished Bibliophile
Nadine
Posts: 2,456
Registered: ‎10-30-2006
0 Kudos

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

I still have a bit of catching up to do on some of the previous posts. I may be juggling too many balls.

 

Kista wrote:
The God King, what a character, I had a feeling he wasn't going to be as bad as everyone has made him out to be. It seems he's a character of pure innocence and ignorance of the world around him(not his fault, though). He has no tongue, so he can't make any kind of commands, or even use the breath he has. Though, it has said that with such a high heightening you don't have to speak to make your commands, so I'm wondering if the priest made this up, or haven't told him about it to keep his powers under there control? Will the God King figure this out and in turn be able to make commands through his mind or was this just a fairy tale? But this could be where Siri's teaching comes into play for The God King to be able to make these commands and use his breath.

==========================
I agree, I really like the God-King. He is total innocence. It seems he must have some way of passing on his aurora or Bio-Chroma. I gather this is part of the ritual where one god-king passes on his BioChroma to his "still born" son, who then becomes "Returned" and then the old God-King "dies." The same thing then happens to his son, who has his tongue removed and is brought up in innocence. There is no doubt, in my mind at least, that the priests have their own agenda and only use the God-King as their pawn.

I don't remember now where it said the God-King didn't need to give vocal commands. But there has to be a way. Maybe he has such power that he can restore his own tongue or, as you have said, can make them through his mind. (Though that seems like it might violate the rules of this magic system). I agree, though, Siri is going to be instrumental in helping him achieve something that will give him some power back and the God-King will use that power, possibly to defeat the priests.

Bibliophile
Melhay
Posts: 2,062
Registered: ‎12-11-2008
0 Kudos

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*


Nadine wrote:

I still have a bit of catching up to do on some of the previous posts. I may be juggling too many balls.

 

Kista wrote:
The God King, what a character, I had a feeling he wasn't going to be as bad as everyone has made him out to be. It seems he's a character of pure innocence and ignorance of the world around him(not his fault, though). He has no tongue, so he can't make any kind of commands, or even use the breath he has. Though, it has said that with such a high heightening you don't have to speak to make your commands, so I'm wondering if the priest made this up, or haven't told him about it to keep his powers under there control? Will the God King figure this out and in turn be able to make commands through his mind or was this just a fairy tale? But this could be where Siri's teaching comes into play for The God King to be able to make these commands and use his breath.

==========================
I agree, I really like the God-King. He is total innocence. It seems he must have some way of passing on his aurora or Bio-Chroma. I gather this is part of the ritual where one god-king passes on his BioChroma to his "still born" son, who then becomes "Returned" and then the old God-King "dies." The same thing then happens to his son, who has his tongue removed and is brought up in innocence. There is no doubt, in my mind at least, that the priests have their own agenda and only use the God-King as their pawn.

I don't remember now where it said the God-King didn't need to give vocal commands. But there has to be a way. Maybe he has such power that he can restore his own tongue or, as you have said, can make them through his mind. (Though that seems like it might violate the rules of this magic system). I agree, though, Siri is going to be instrumental in helping him achieve something that will give him some power back and the God-King will use that power, possibly to defeat the priests.


I think there is a big catch here with this part of passing on the Breath from the God King to son.  As we know the current God King can not talk to give it, the son can not take it.  There are stories of the God Kings of past "saving" his people, one saved the people from a disease the other saved a village from bandits.  How did they do this?  Do they think the thoughts clearly?  What is the catch here?  Something is missing, I just feel something is not right in the information.

 

Could the priests be using the possiblity of the God King saving these people from the horrid fates that may not have really been, to cover something with the God Kings?  Could they be using the possiblity of war with Siri's people as a cover?  Maybe the possiblity of war will give them a cause to have the God King "give his breath" to save the people. 

 

Or did the God Kings Breath really save the people as stated?  Could they be planning to go to war and then when they have an heir have the current God King give his Breath to save the people of Hallandren to defeat Siri's home? 

 

Could this all be just a hoax, that the God King has a "sickness" or something and passes away, a hereditary defect from being the God King and still born.  How long have the other God Kings lived for?  We haven't truely got the answer to this question yet, it may help us some in coming up with a plan for what may happen.

_______________________
"There are no honorable causes. There is no good or evil. Evil is only what we call those who oppose us." From Nyphron Rising, By Michael J. Sullivan

My Blog Spot: http://melissa-melsworld.blogspot.com/
Distinguished Bibliophile
Nadine
Posts: 2,456
Registered: ‎10-30-2006

Re: JULY FEATURE #1: Warbreaker: Part 2 - Pages 153-360*Spoilers*

Melissa wrote:

I think there is a big catch here with this part of passing on the Breath from the God King to son.  As we know the current God King can not talk to give it, the son can not take it.  There are stories of the God Kings of past "saving" his people, one saved the people from a disease the other saved a village from bandits.  How did they do this?  Do they think the thoughts clearly?  What is the catch here?  Something is missing, I just feel something is not right in the information.

 

Could the priests be using the possiblity of the God King saving these people from the horrid fates that may not have really been, to cover something with the God Kings?  Could they be using the possiblity of war with Siri's people as a cover?  Maybe the possiblity of war will give them a cause to have the God King "give his breath" to save the people. 

 

Or did the God Kings Breath really save the people as stated?  Could they be planning to go to war and then when they have an heir have the current God King give his Breath to save the people of Hallandren to defeat Siri's home? 

 

Could this all be just a hoax, that the God King has a "sickness" or something and passes away, a hereditary defect from being the God King and still born.  How long have the other God Kings lived for?  We haven't truely got the answer to this question yet, it may help us some in coming up with a plan for what may happen.

----------------------------------

 

You're comments here have gotten me thinking. maybe the God-King does't do anything and things actually do not happen the way we are being told.

 

The priests can kill a god easily by withholding their weekly "breath feed." They can also cause "miracles" to happen by one of them "giving his breath." It seems odd to me that all the future god-kings are "still born." Well, maybe not and that is all a hoax as well. The priests totally control the information system and the timing of events. I just think a lot of things are not what they seem to be. I also don't think all the priests are in on it -- only the higher level ones of the God-King.

 

I think the God-King is without a tongue because Siri saw it and remarked on it. Otherwise, I might have been suspicious that they had made him "dumb" and could bring him around later to do a final deed for them. The God-King is obviously well brain-washed.

 

We know that Brandon is going to come up with something unexpected, so I'm starting to get suspicious of everything!

 

----------------

 

Melissa, I have been waiting before going back to reading Warbreaker and continuing on with Shannara. I thought it might be better to wait for Kristi to return and get back into things before we move on, but I'm flexible. If you want to move on, that will be fine with me as well. We still have about a third of Warbreaker reading to go, and we've hardly gotten into Shannara.  Wednesday will put us about halfway into the month.