Before I Fall, Chapters 5 & 6:

[Lildove3]

Sam needs to be applauded for all the changes she's trying to accomplish for Feb. 12th,it's very

obvious with every reoccurring time of the dream, she is strivng to make that aprticular day much

better from the time before.

Sam is wanting juliet to realize to believe in yourself is important and that other people can

see the good in oneself. Sam learned she does not need friends to get things done, and that it's

better to be a leader,not a follower.

Sam learns from Kent how to be natural,and people will love and appreciate you more.

yes, Sam is coming along in an excellant way, by helping others and being kind, she is also learning about her inner self,by correcting error she's made most of her life.

Yes, Sam can make a great deal of changes in one day,if she stays on track.

[0104]

I was wondering the same thine about it being about Juliet's death and not Sam's.

I see all these changes Sam is making/trying to make and although it seems to be the natural course of action for anyone, isn't it just the same trying to fit in... but with a different twist?  And in making all these changes, how is it really changing Sam?

[Lizzy96]

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

Sam's good deed toward Juliet is she just tries to help her and understand her and secretly be her friend. but i think sam is gradually realizing that in order to help juliet, she will have to leave her old self and she cant do it in secret. she will have to come out of her shell and she will have to be seen helping juliet, and i think that scares her most of all at first. but as time goes on, and as sam sees more and more of juliet's hurt, she starts to  see that it dosent matter if people see her because the most imporntant thing to her right now is to help juliet, because she knows how to.

i think that from kent, sami is learning to be herself. kent was her friend before she was popular, and sam is now realizing that he would like her whether or not she is popular, and nobody else will. through the span of repeating time, kent dosent change at all. sam changes and her reactions towards him change and therefore she sees him changing when he really has been this way all along. she is starting to see the world through in a new way now that she has experienced a day from many different perspectives.

[kels10]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

Sam tries to keep Juliet from killing herself and she tries to keep her friends from doing stupid stuff to people. She also tries to be kind to people and take the keys from Lindsay so she can't drive. I pretty much applaud all those decision because they helped out each time.

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

Sam sends three dozen roses to Juliet and she tries to save her from killing herself by apologizing. Sam learns that she was following Lindsay's lead and she learns that all along its like she was blind and not being herself. She learns that what has already happened; you can't change.

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

She learns that she's better than what she thought she was. She learns that she was acting like a fake, but Kent helped her realize it. He's making her become a better person and think of others. I would definitely say their relationship is growing because she is pretty much in love with him.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

Sam is coming into her own. She doesn't follow everything Lindsay says to do or another friends. Also she doesn't take advantage of things because she realizes that in one split second they can be gone. She said that she might not be the kind of person people remember good things about, but from these chapters, if the people would just understand, I think they would remember her as a wonderful person.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

Personally, I don't think its possible for Sam to make all the changes in a single day. What they did to Juliet hurt her for years and she can't just take all the pain away in one day. I think the reason this same day keeps getting repeated is because it can't take one day to make everything right. Its goanna take  while.

[JennM14]

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vpenning wrote:

In Chapter 5, Sam is trying to make the perfect day. Trying to enjoy the things she now knows are most important. And, in 6 see tries to make things right by being nice to everyone, and fixing all the bad things she had done in the day.But, each time, the results do not save Sam's life. So it seems that there is more to saving Sam, than just making little changes. But, I think that each of these changes is carrying Sam one more step along to make the true change that is needed.

By  telling her mother that she broke up with Rob, she allows her mother to cross the line in order to console her. Sam now realizes that her mother's love is one of the important things, not a nuisance to be avoided. Here, Sam is beginning to realize that previous relationships are important, and to throw them out carelessly for the sake of teenage appearances is foolish, and self defeating.

She tries to make Juliet feel better by sending her a rose, but in doing so, makes Juliet believe it is just another joke. Sam doesn't realize that the torment isn't the rose, but the humiliation of the rose, and the public display that the rose has wrought for years. Having been a student who didn't receive roses during Valentine week, and was looked down upon with disdain from the popular crowd because I did not get one, I know that there were others like me who also did not get one. We banded together at that time, and there was a commonality between our lack of roses that made us one. But, to be singled out by one of the in crowd with a rose every year made Juliet stand out with even that crowd. So, just changing the message on the rose did not change the message in the sending, nor does sending a dozen roses make the message any sweeter.

Sam was a kid tormented by others...she knows what it is like. But, she does not fully embrace what that encompassed, and felt like as she lives her life and now in her death. Sam is making the changes, but she has yet to see WHY she should make those changes.

She was chosen by Lindsey in the 7th grade, and she chose to turn her back on her pain, and the ones she had as friends, including Kent. But, now when there is true tragedy and pain, it isn't Lindsey who is the one to help her, but her friend of old. her relationship with Kent is growing, but it is because of death and destruction. She still hasn't realized that being a true friend is being one even when that friend has turned their back on you. Kent did it with Sam, and Juliet did it with Lindsey.

Sam gave up her friends of old but she also up on  herself. She gave up the things she loved, like dinners with her family, and her horses. In doing so this makes her still a victim-a victim of the bullying.

This makes me think of how similar Juliet the one being openly bullied is to Sam, the former bullied. Juliet has given up her arts and crafts, and the things she loves.The scars of being bullied seem to never go away. Is being accepted by Lindsey as a "in crowd" persona, and not for Sam's true self just just another form of being bullied? This makes me think about the first pages and how Sam's thoughts are of Vickie, a girl she remembered bulling way back. Even Vickie remembers the incident, and though Sam thinks Vickie is over it. Is she really?

Seeing Juliet's family life, I also wonder if her suicide is totally based on the bullying. Could it just be the catalyst? But, then we see Juliet's sister who has the same family life, yet has friends galore on the swim team.

I also wonder, in Chapter 5 when Juliet says "next time" that Juliet herself may be reliving the same day over and over just as Sam is. (the rose phase was next YEAR, not time). In addition, when Juliet tells Sam in Chapter 6 that it "Isn't all about you"; is Juliet telling Sam that this reliving is NOT about Sam's death, but Juliet's.

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WOW fabulous post!

[JennM14]

I can't really decide which is harder for me to 'watch'....

 Sam trying sooo hard to stop tragedy from occurring at the end of the day and never being able to

OR

The feelings that Sam is coming to grips with, knowing that those moments, forever in her heart and mind, will be gone to Kent - as if they never happened - when he wakes up the next morning.  I see such a strong, healthy and loving relationship there and it breaks my heart thinking of how she must feel carrying it with her, knowing he doesn't even remember it.

I struggled with Sam in the beginning, but she has found a place in my heart now :-)  Imagine going through what she is going through. 

[retromom]

In these chapters Sam realizes that she has a chance to change things for the better. It was nice to see her reach out to her sister and parents and even students that she had been quite mean to in the past. I kind of felt sorry for her when she tried so hard to change things and they still went bad. She was trying so hard to reach out to Juliet and save her. No matter what she did it was never enough.  I think by the end of Chapter 6 she finally gets what really is important in life. It's nice to see the changes in Sam.

[Rebz]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

Sam tries to change the big things. She tries to, in a way, befriend Juliet, and she tries to spend more time with her family and the things that are mst important in life, even if she didn't realize it before.  I applaud her decision to spend more time with her sister and her parents, but in trying to be supernice to Juliet and trying to save both herself and Juliet, I don't think she realizes the reprecussions and how stranger that would seem to Juliet.

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

Sam sends Juliet a lot of roses and tries to be nice to Juliet, including trying to stop her from killing herself through her good deeds and through preventing Juliet from even going to the party in the first place, but failing.  Sam learns a great deal from Julet including that she can't change things without a sacrifice. She learns that it is impossible to save both their lives but she does need to make subtle changes while not turning her back on the things that she cared about before the first accident in order to make a sacrifice and save Juliet's life, which doesn't deserve to be ended so abruptly.

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

Sam learns what it means to really care for someone and to be cared for.  She learns what love is. Yes, her relationship with Kent is definitely growing and she is learning alot about herself and whats real through her relationship with Kent.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

I think she is. I think she finally realizes her purpose, what is real and important in her life and who she is.  She's growing as a purpose and has gained so much insight in these two days.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

At this point, after reading these two chapters, I think that Sam has gained enough insight to make the changes she needs to, in a single day.  She knows, finally, what needs to be done and how she needs to do it.

[Bonnie_C]

Sam learns some valuable lessons in her repeat day.  She learns to appreciate the unconditional love of a family, the steadfastness of true friendships and the difference between lust and true love.  She also realizes that a simple act of kindness (i.e.. Sending a whole bouquet of roses to Juliet) cannot wipe out years of being mistreated. 

[-Cia-]

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does sam learn about herself from juliet?

I have to give Sam credit. She is really trying to be nice to Juliet. She sends her three dozen roses. She is really trying her hardest and sadly, it's just not that easy. Unfortunately, through all the mean and harsh things that Sam and Lindsay have done to Juliet, it's going to take alot more than a simple apology to make things okay with Juliet now.

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

Kent is really helping Sam realize who she is. He is making her a better person. Their relationship is definately growing. Sam realizes that all along Kent has been the one there. When she was popular and even when she wasn't he was the only one who like her no matter what. I definately see a strong, unbreakable bond between Sam and Kent.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

Sam is definately coming into her own in these chapters. She is now more independant and doesn't follow in Lindsay's footsteps. She's the leader now, and it doesn't affect that much if she isn't friends with Lindsay. Having friends isn't the most important thing in the world and Sam finally realizes it. She can just be herself and stop trying to fit in and by doing so, she finds more people take an interest in her and will think of her as a good person.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

Although it will take awhile for Sam to make changes in individual things such as Juliet, i think that it is possible for her to make the changes she needs to in a single day. After repeating several February 12ths, she is finally realizing and figuring out all the things she needs to do inorder for the day to be successful. Now she knows exactly what she needs to do on February 12th and therefore i think it's very possible for her.

[bookcrazyme]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

In a way I saw Sam as a scientist during these February 12ths, experimenting with doing this or that and observing the repercussions as each different action's ripples spread. The one I applauded the most, that brought me near tears, was the one in which she reconciled with her family. Reading of her taking her little sister to Goose Point, and reading of her internal conflict and thoughts when she thinks of what her sister will be like in a few years, if she'll lose her lisp or become popular or be reduced to a mocked loner, shows to me Sam's increasing maturity. She feels the fierce need to protect and shield her sister from the cruel real world, and personally I was able to empathize with her because I have a little sister myself. Reading of Sam making peace with her mom and dad and going out to dinner with them gave me a sense of peace and contentment. In my eyes Lauren Oliver succeeded in making the perfect day, in regards to her family. The one that I believe was the most ill-considered was when Sam gave the roses to Juliet. Reading it made me wince because of Sam's apparent thoughtlessness, or at least showed that her still-burgeoning maturity hadn't evolved far enough that she thought ahead to what Juliet might think of the roses.

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet were the aforementioned roses, which were ill-received by Juliet, who viewed them as a mockery. Juliet's reaction was actually in my opinion well expected, because being suddenly showered with a storm of roses isn't exactly the best way to show that Sam cared about Juliet and her plight. 

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

From Kent Sam is able to view herself from a distance, in a sense through Kent's eyes. She sees herself "rise" from a lowly and ridiculed nerd to the loved yet hated popular "top dog" she is now, along the way losing her personality because it was "uncool" and forming a facade of a mean girl, a facade that she donned and hadn't questioned until now. I think yes, her relationship with Ken is indeed growing! She comes see that the stereotype of Kent as a nerd is simply just that- a flimsy stereotype. Kent is actually Sam's one true friend who's been alongside her the whole way, watching as she plunged into the depths of popularity, and lending a hand when she finally resurfaces into growing maturity and the realization that popularity is nothing.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

Yes! Sam is definitely coming into her own in these chapters, step by step. She tries to amend past mistakes with each recurring February 12th, as evident in her interactions with family and friends and classmates. I hope to see her utilize her past mistakes to do good and to finally set things right with Juliet. And if possible, I want a happy ending for Sam, who I have come to love and know as though she were real flesh and blood, in who I see the embodiment of countless teenage girls that live today.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

Seeing as how the single day has repeated seven times, I think it is definitely possible if she looks back onto the previous six February 12ths and from there, tread carefully on the right path that was made possible by past errors.

[Wrighty]

I had to mark a favorite passage from chapter 5 on page 285. It's when Sam was with her little sister Izzy at Goose Point, her special place in the woods. This was when it seemed like things were started to click for her.

It amazes me easy it is for things to change, how easy it is to start off down the same road you always take and wind up somewhere new. Just one false step, one pause, one detour, and you end up with new friends or a bad reputation or a boyfriend or a breakup. It's never occurred to me before; I've never been able to see it. And it makes me feel, weirdly, like maybe all of these different possibilities exist at the same time, like each moment we live has a thousand other moments layered underneath it that look different.

[Zia01]

That was one of my favorite passages in the book. The whole scene with Izzy at Goose Point was very touching.

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Wrighty wrote:

I had to mark a favorite passage from chapter 5 on page 285. It's when Sam was with her little sister Izzy at Goose Point, her special place in the woods. This was when it seemed like things were started to click for her.

It amazes me easy it is for things to change, how easy it is to start off down the same road you always take and wind up somewhere new. Just one false step, one pause, one detour, and you end up with new friends or a bad reputation or a boyfriend or a breakup. It's never occurred to me before; I've never been able to see it. And it makes me feel, weirdly, like maybe all of these different possibilities exist at the same time, like each moment we live has a thousand other moments layered underneath it that look different.

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[DSaff]

I love this one too. Thanks for posting it.

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Wrighty wrote:

I had to mark a favorite passage from chapter 5 on page 285. It's when Sam was with her little sister Izzy at Goose Point, her special place in the woods. This was when it seemed like things were started to click for her.

It amazes me easy it is for things to change, how easy it is to start off down the same road you always take and wind up somewhere new. Just one false step, one pause, one detour, and you end up with new friends or a bad reputation or a boyfriend or a breakup. It's never occurred to me before; I've never been able to see it. And it makes me feel, weirdly, like maybe all of these different possibilities exist at the same time, like each moment we live has a thousand other moments layered underneath it that look different.

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[flarglepuf]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

 Sam trys to get rid of her facade, the one where she is the popular girl who couldn't give a car ein the world, that for the londest time, she thought was not a facade.  She is spending time with the people she really cares about, trying to make up for lost time.

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

Sam buys Juliet a dozen roses, sent from her "secret admirer."  Juliet freaks out, thinking the whole thing is another practical joke.  Sam learns from Juliet how much pain she has been causing, and she learns that she hasn't been thinking about anyone but herself.

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

Sam learns that she is not fake, that she is a normal human with normal problems and emotions.  She learns that, despite the horrible life she had been leading, people still care about who she is on the inside.  She learns that she is willing to change.  through the brief span of time, their relationship is definitely close.  Each day, they get closer, and each opens up to the other a bit more, letting the other know that they, too, care about them.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

I really applaud Sam for coming into her own in these chapters.  She's getting rid of her false front and doing what she wants to and what she thinks is right and good.  She isn't listening to what LLndsay or anyone says is "cool" or acceptable, she's doing what she KNOS is acceptable.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

I think it is.  Now that she's got the motivation, and has had the change of heart, i think Sam is able to do everything nessesary to make things right.

[1237]

Sam tryes to fix things and make everything better. I completly agree with almost all of what she does. Sam sends Juliet a boque of flowers and Juliet thinks its a prank. I think that Juliet showed Sam that she dosent really know everyone like she thinks she does but then agen thats how i interperted it. Sam learns that she likes Kent and that he rembers a lot from when they were little. Her relationship with Kent is growing at a fast paste but i thing of it as kinda sweet!

[kittykat59]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

Sam tries to become juliet's friend and she tries to spend more time with her family. Sam tries to re-live her Feb 12th by trying to change the big things.

What are Sam's "good deeds" toward Juliet, and what is Juliet's reaction? What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

Sam tries being nice to Juliet and tries to change the outcome of the day but does not succeed. Juliet's reaction is bewilderment. Sam learns a lot from Juliet learning that life is precious.

What does Sam learn about herself from Kent? Is her relationship with Kent growing in this brief span of repeating time?

Sam learns the true meaning of caring for a person and having that feeling returned.

Is Sam coming into her own in these chapters? If so, how? If not, what do you hope to see from her in the final chapter?

yes she is. She is finaly realizing what is important family and love.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

It is going to be difficult but sam has learned so much.

[MissShopaholic]

It is impossible to accomplish everything one needs to do in a single day.  I applaud Sam for making a list and trying to make things right. I even admire her for realizing all that is important in life, such as family relationships, her friendship with kent, for being kind to others( the golden rule of treating others how you'd like to be treated), for beginning to why-question her friends reasoning for their actions instead of just going with the flow, being more assertive and independent in her thinking, and also for realizing what isn't too important such as the roses on cupid day.

In the previous chapters, Sam took a more cavalier attitude towards life, school, and other rules. She got "high" off of living a day on the wild side with no limits.  In these chapters, you can tell she has matured and calmed down enough to focus on important matters such as making it important to help Juliet.  I'm glad to see that she is truly going out of her way to do right while learning some life lessons along the way. As she relives each day she finds it necessary to do right.  She learned that sometimes good deeds can backfire... She has the idea of buying roses for Juliet which makes her feel good inside for doing a good thing but didn't consider that Juliet may have possibly thought it to be a cruel joke.  I can see how Juliet may have felt upset, especially since Sam wrote "secret admirer" instead of being a little more honest.  Sam has the advantage that tomorrow will be a fresh, clean day make better decisions and these feelings into consideration, which opposed to my world, the opportunity to prove to myself to make better judgements, based on previous learning opportunities, doesn't present itself right away. 

Her relationship with Kent is growing each day although he doesn't realize it. I love how she tosses the popularity thing aside and follows her heart but also realizing at the same time that she may not deserve him.  I'm proud of her for realizing that her feelings for Kent are stronger than she ever felt for Rob... because as a middle school teacher, i see everyday that a teenager's love for one another is purely superficial.

[jb70]

I kept notes while I was reading because I got ahead of schedule.  These are thoughts I had on chapter 5 while reading:  I thought it was ironic that Juliet lived on Serenity Place and from the size of her house it sounded like her family had money which often seemed tied to the popularity of these characters.  Should Juliet really have had Sam's place in the group?  I also wondered which one of the last days was her real last day- is it the last one she has or could it have been any of the others as well?  Was the accident caused by Juliet stepping into the road or the fight for the Ipod or does her stepping into the road all get traced back to Lindsay and her groups treatment for all those years of Juliet- kind of the whole chicken and the egg thing.  Since Kent vowed that he would be her "hero" has he now fulfilled his vow?  How would Sam's life have differed if she had stayed away from the in crowd.  It was nice to see her recognizing how stupid and annoying everyone was while they were drunk, for teens I think it would be good to see for themselves how while they think they are witty and cool it is really quite the opposite (maybe even eye opening for some adults!)  Is there any way Sam can stop Juliet.  How could she undo years of accumulated acts in a day or is it like sun damage, where if you stop the damaging activity you can start to repair the skin so Juliet could start to repair herself.

Chapter 6 thoughts:

Start to realize how important little overlooked things are or can be.  There were all those guidance posters in the office and a real need for guidance for Sam as well as many other students.  On page 350 when she is looking at the notes for the roses it starts to mean something about how important words can be also Gullet's rose had not bloomed just like she had not bloomed yet.  I was so glad that she recognized, or started to recognize Kent as genuine and read.  Some of the changes were that Sarah go the spot, she starts trying to reverse the Katie rumors, decides not to give Rob a rose and no more mean note for Juliet.  On page 362 she starts to wonder what the point is, why does she have to relive this day?  I really wanted her to confide in Kent either about her death or that she likes him.  I wondered how much she is changing.  High school was like swimming with piranhas.  When she tells Brianna about Alex is she fixing anything or would it have been fixed in its own time anyway- could he really have sustained the lie and cheating indefinitely or was it just a matter of time?  Can people really change in a day (page 385). On page 394 she talks about people drowning by going the wrong way- is she going the wrong way and why is Lindsay so afraid that people will see through her?

[mgarrison]

In what ways does Sam try to change her February 12th in these chapters?  Which changes do you applaud, and which do you think are ill-considered?

I really think that she is truly trying to make a difference in the last few chapters.  I see a huge different in the way she is treating Kent and Juliet.  I believe that she is finally beginning to see how her actions have affected the lives of other people around her. I am not sure that all of her actions towards Juliet are really doing any good.  Everytime she does something, Juliet still manages to kill herself.  I'm waiting to see if the way Sam treats Juliet will eventually change the outcome.

 What does Sam learn about herself from Juliet?

I think she is finding that it takes a lot to change the affects of the horrible actions she has done to Juliet.  I think that she thought, at the beginning, that all she had to do was do a few good deeds in order to change Juliet's thoughts.

Is it possible for Sam to make the changes she needs to make in a single day?

I believe that it's a start.. she may not be able to change everything that she has done in one single day, but she can make a difference in someone's life.