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Vermontcozy
Posts: 5,276
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Re: Sex and Romance

In Sam's world that she has created,the Scene with Mr.Daimler is giving her Control.that in turn gives her strength,,So how can I be Dead,if this feels so real.She knows its wrong,but moves on..She can now Control all that went wrong with Juliet,change,control..Again gives her that sense of I am Still here..Rob is just a distraction,uses him to change the Juliet scene that she knows was horribly wrong,,,Kent is her "Knight in Shining Armour,so to speak..Giving her that security,love,and genuine affection that she so desperately needs,once again to feel "Now everything is ok,I am still here..Vtc...

Kindness,I've discovered,is everything in life...Issac Bashevis Singer
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tracyjacobs007
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?  I think that it's very disgusting that Mr. Daimler would be that open in his class to show that he's interested in these girls.  And the fact that he is much older and interested in highschool girls is even more wrong.  Sam was nervous at first and really was excited until things happened between her and Mr. Daimler.  She then had a change of heart and seemed to be a bit disgusted.  Probably disgusted with herself and with him. 

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?  Sam probably thinks that if she's with Rob then maybe she won't be there when the drinks get thrown on Juliet and they wouldn't be leaving at the end of the night.  The "steamy" scene didn't turn out so perfectly for Sam.  Rob was already too drunk and ended up passing out on her.  My opinion of Rob has changed.  He doesn't seem to care that much about Sam.  He just wants to have sex with her.

 

 

 

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Vermontcozy
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Re: Sex and Romance

[ Edited ]

krb2g wrote:

Like a few other people have mentioned, in the first few days I didn't see anything particularly wrong with Mr. Daimler. But I think it's really telling that Kent does from the first moments in which we meet him. Although the scene where Kent tucks Sam in is more overtly romantic than him telling her what a creep Mr. Daimler is, I think the fact that he can recognize him as a predator and tries to warn Sam before she gets in over her head is just as romantic.


i like your comments,and even though I am in denial about Sam losing her life so violently,I am taken with Kent's kindness,given all Sam has been through..

Kindness,I've discovered,is everything in life...Issac Bashevis Singer
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Facepalm
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Re: Sex and Romance

 Sam didn't seem to have any problems with the fact that he was her math teacher. I couldn't believe that even on her last day she would do something to stupid and gross. His job and her school career were at risk there, even if she was sure she was going to live the day over again. I think that Mr.Daimler clearly needs to learn better control, especially if he values his job.

 

Sam got exactly what she had coming, dating a guy like rob. Of course he was too drunk and not interested, that should hardly have been a surprise or letdown for her. This doesn't change my opinion of Rob, I always knew what a jerk he was. It does sort of change my opinion of sam. She knew Juliet was going to die, and knew where she was going to be. She had the chance to stop it, but instead of taking it, she was purposely avoiding it. It was cowardly and selfish.

 

Of course. Kent is really sweet, and you can tell that he cares about her. She spends so much time blocking him out, when she should really feel lucky that such a nice guy would waste time on her.

 

team GALE, anyone?
Inspired Bibliophile
Vermontcozy
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Re: Sex and Romance

You are right on so many levels,I have only read up to chapter 5,but I can already feel some sort of explosive moment(s) ahead..

Facepalm wrote:

 Sam didn't seem to have any problems with the fact that he was her math teacher. I couldn't believe that even on her last day she would do something to stupid and gross. His job and her school career were at risk there, even if she was sure she was going to live the day over again. I think that Mr.Daimler clearly needs to learn better control, especially if he values his job.

 

Sam got exactly what she had coming, dating a guy like rob. Of course he was too drunk and not interested, that should hardly have been a surprise or letdown for her. This doesn't change my opinion of Rob, I always knew what a jerk he was. It does sort of change my opinion of sam. She knew Juliet was going to die, and knew where she was going to be. She had the chance to stop it, but instead of taking it, she was purposely avoiding it. It was cowardly and selfish.

 

Of course. Kent is really sweet, and you can tell that he cares about her. She spends so much time blocking him out, when she should really feel lucky that such a nice guy would waste time on her.

 


 

Kindness,I've discovered,is everything in life...Issac Bashevis Singer
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ambika22
Posts: 57
Registered: ‎08-31-2009
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?

One thing is to think about your teacher that way or even have a crush but another totally different is to do something about it.I didnt like at all the fact that the teacher responded to her provocations. I mean, if he works in a highschool and he reacts like that he should be fired or something. I dont understand why Sam doesnt tell the principal about it when she decides to reject him.

 

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?

Its a different situation. Kent doesnt want to be with Sam just for the sex, its something more deep and i really liked it. I wished they had gone a step further and i think they would make a very nice couple.

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KateBrianIsAwesome
Posts: 115
Registered: ‎08-19-2009
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?

Sam was completely shocked, and so was I. As soon as he released all the students and CLOSED THE DOOR I knew he was ready to take the flirting to the next level. Any teacher that just wants to talk to a student about their behavior would of left the door open. After this situation I am ashamed of Mr.Daimler, he obvisiously does not have self control.

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?

 I think Rob is a big loser who is concieted and self centered. Sam is stupid for even being with Rob that night, after the other nights she experienced.

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?

I thought it was very romantic. Who wouldn't want to be tucked into bed by a sweet boy that cares a lot about you. He truly cares about Sam and is not after sex. He respects Sam.

 

Reading can only make you more happy and smarter. :smileyhappy:

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DSaff
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam decides to really live on the edge when it comes to Mr. Daimler. He should have kept his distance - he is the adult! But it goes to show that our actions can definitely affect others. She finds it isn't what she thought it would be. She found that she didn't have any control in the situation. It would have been just a physical thing, nothing more, and something she would regret everyday she lived (or relived).

 

When it came to her new "desire" for Rob, I found myself thinking she was trying to believe in something that wasn't there. I think she knows he doesn't love her and that does seem important to her. I'm glad Rob fell asleep!

 

Kent is a real gentleman. He is there for her and she should pay attention to him. Not only is he a great friend, but he has the potential to be the romantic partner she is looking for, perhaps the love of her life. (I will have to read more to find out what she figures out.) I thought he was romantic in the way he took care of her and tucked her in. My impression is that he loves her and reaches out to show her that anytime he can. Romance can be subtle. :smileyhappy:

DonnaS =) " Reading is a means of thinking with another person's mind; it forces you to stretch your own." Charles Scribner
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DSlaughter
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Re: Sex and Romance


Rachel-K wrote:

Sam's three steamy scenes?

 

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr.. Daimler?

 

Thankfully I think the author did a great job with the response to Mr.. Daimlers anvance on Sam.  She was shocked and kind of taken a back by his advances and I think that was an honest reaction to the situation.  My thoughts were what a slime ball!

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?

 Ha it turned out just like how I figured Rob to act! He is my least liked character in any book I have read for a long time.  I think Sam is maturing so much and I think she knows in her heart Rob is a no one.  I think he is the next Mr. Dailmer!

 

 

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?

 

Very much so and I think this just goes to show you don't need sex to have intimate moments with another person. 


 

Melissa_W
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam learns there is actually a difference between the physical act of sex and the mental act of love (contrary to what MTV and the movies would have us believe).  Just by the simple act of tucking her in Kent shows that he cares for her, not about what she can do to service him.  The connection between Sam and Kent on the mental/soul level goes far deeper than the two minutes of physical action Sam could get with Rob.

 

Speaking of Rob...shows his true colors, doesn't he?  Too bad no one told him what too much beer does for the anatomy....

 

And as for Mr. Daimler he probably doesn't see any difference between the high school seniors in his class and the college undergrads he's used to seeing at the bar.  He's a hot guy (25 years old), he knows it, and when Sam just acts like she's going to give it all up right there in the classroom he goes for it.  it's not an excuse, just shows him to be the, uh, well, something I can't type here, that he probably is in the rest of his life, too.

 

Actually, the conversation between Sam and Kent, when Kent warns her Mr. Daimler is a slime, reminded me of a scene in Jane Austen's Emma.  When Emma tries to match-make with Mr. Elton and Harriet Smith, Mr. Knightley warns Emma that he has overheard Mr. Elton in conversation with other gentlemen and that he (Mr. Knightley) does not feel Mr. Elton is an upstanding young man (I'm paraphrasing).  So Kent is Sam's Mr. Knightley.


Rachel-K wrote:

Sam's three steamy scenes?

 

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?

 


 

Melissa W.
I read and knit and dance. Compulsively feel yarn. Consume books. Darn tights. Drink too much caffiene. All that good stuff.
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horsefreak13
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Re: Sex and Romance

The scene where Sam and Mr.. Daimler made out was quite interesting to me. I didn't really see it coming as much as some other people did. It actually freaked me out to be honest because thinking of teachers in my school, I could never see that happen. Especially how Sam and Mr.. Daimler did it. Wow, it was quite a scene!

 

The scenes where Sam and Kent were together I thought were so romantic! I absolutely loved them, even though the "sex" scenes weren't as romantic. In my opinion, the scenes with Kent and Sam were so much more romantic than the "sex" scenes. I don't know why, that's just my opinion.

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Zeal
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Re: Sex and Romance

I agree!  Kent really cares about Sam, but Mr. Daimler and Rob obviously do NOT!  That makes a huge difference.  I would much rather be in a relationship with someone like Kent than be used by someone such as Rob or Mr. Daimler.

 

 


 

 

horsefreak13 wrote:

 

The scenes where Sam and Kent were together I thought were so romantic! I absolutely loved them, even though the "sex" scenes weren't as romantic. In my opinion, the scenes with Kent and Sam were so much more romantic than the "sex" scenes. I don't know why, that's just my opinion.


 

"I learned to dream through reading, learned to create dreams through writing, and learned to develop dreamers through teaching. I shall always be a dreamer."
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stopper19
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Re: Sex and Romance

The scenes when Sam is with Kent are WAY more romantic than the "sex" scenes. The other guys such as Rob and Mr.Daimler were just using Sam because she could give them what they wanted but Kent truly cared about Sam. He knows how to treat a girl and those scenes were the best scenes in the book when Sam was in Kent's room. He is so kind and gentle with her that he would never do anything to hurt her and only thinks about what is best for her. That is why the scenes with Kent are way more romantic than the desperate sex scenes.

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breathless
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?

First of all, let me just say that Mr. Daimler is just one of those people that I didn't like from the beginning of the book. Things like this happen all too often in fiction and if you look closely enough, you can spot the pervs before they do any dastardly deeds.

I think Sam's response was a little bit underrated. If I had been in her shoes (not that they sound very comfortable, because let us not forget that that was the day she was wearing 5 inch platform heels.), I would have been out the door so fast, you wouldn't even see me.

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?

Neither my opinion of Rob not my opinion of Sam changed after this scene. Rob passed out (no surprise there.), and Sam just left, so I don't think the scene really allows you to form a differnt opinion.

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lg4154
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Re: Sex and Romance

I thought the scene with the teacher made him out to be a sick puppy & I think her reaction to it made her realize it is wrong of him to act like that.

The scene with Rob and Sam making a pass at him kinda backfires for her because he ends up falling asleep on her, I think she wasn't up for it anyway, just trying to change the sequence of events with Juliet.

I thinks Sam's spending time with Kent is really sweet and shows how much she cares for him, a nice escape to the horrible turn of events at the party.

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bkwormMD
Posts: 6
Registered: ‎01-04-2010

Re: Sex and Romance

I suppose most of us would have experienced having a crush on a teacher or professor at one point in our lives. Mr. Daimler epitomizes that fantasy for a young girl. He seemed smart, all grown up, but still cool. He's the kind of guy that all the students put on a pedestal, and he should just stay there! His ears turning red whenever Sam flirts with him shows that he himself is thrilled and excited by their bantering. It probably didn't take much to push him over the edge, since we really have no idea (although there were hints!) of how far his own fantasies went! So, when the guy comes down from the pedestal, Sam is forced back to reality and is grossed out by him. Mr. Daimler took advantage of the situation--a big no-no for guys, especially teachers! That became his ruin! Like someone else's "perfect" husband who a woman swoons over. Once he shows interest in that other woman, he becomes disgusting because suddenly, he's no longer a perfect husband after all.

 

Even then, the fact that Sam wanted to brag about it to her friends indicates that, whether she had "fun" or not, she still did something adventurous, and her friends would just envy her boldness and daring. She got something everyone else wanted! Even if I condemn Sam and her friends for living their lives according to what they think other people would envy, who can say that we ourselves, even beyond our teen years, have not had the same, very human, tendency?

 

Rob was the same thing. From the beginning, did Sam really like Rob? All she harped about was how all the girls liked Rob, not like that weird Kent guy who no one cares about (but who she thinks of every so often anyway). Yet, she dated him anyway, and since this was written from Sam's point of view, it was obvious that she really didn't like him, but would have had sex with him just because everyone else was thrilled about it, and she can brag about it to them later.

 

Of course, by the last days, she has discovered hew own self. What she herself wanted (Kent) that no one might have understood, but in the end, her friends actually respected. Her friends are true friends, even if they might have appeared to be the mean and popular girls that made the life of geek girls miserable in high school.

 

In this sense, Lauren Oliver was really good,because, from the comments on this forum, it looks like she got a majority of us reacting to Mr. Daimler and Rob the way Sam did.

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bkwormMD
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Re: Sex and Romance

I agree with you, Vermontcozy, regarding Sam's need for control to feel real. I would like to add, too, that her mishap with Mr. Daimler occurs the day after she makes discoveries about Lindsay, and she is angry. Her anger gives her her strength, too, as well as the boldness to do things that she never would have done otherwise. She was feeling rebellious, and a part of her just didn't care anymore. If we were to think of the phases of grief -- Shock, denial, bargaining, guilt, anger, depression, acceptance and hope-- she was, at the anger stage.

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lhays
Posts: 19
Registered: ‎07-02-2009

Re: Sex and Romance

 

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler? Sam finally figured out what Kent was talking about when he said tha Mr. Daimler was sick. She figured out that it wasn't as romanitic to be with a good looking older man as she thought it was. Mr. Daimler is a sick man that shouldn't be around teen girls. He is still stuck in the days when he was cool and popular (as demonstrated by him still wearing the hemp necklace from his highschool days)

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam? My opinion of Rob is the same, he has been waiting for Sam to give in to him about sex and I think that is really the only reason that he is with her. Rob passes out so he doesn't get to experience what he has been waiting for. I am happy about that.


Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't? The scene with Kent is very romantic. Sam gets to get a glimpse of what it is like to be treated with respect and cared about without someone expecting something from her.

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GReba
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Re: Sex and Romance

I'm glad this topic was brought up...

 

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler? Mr. Daimler ...what can I say?  I think Samantha's reaction and statement to him in later chapters sums it up quite well.  There is a line there that should not have been crossed and if things are going well in his own life, why on earth did he cross it?  I think this part, despite the "steaminess", will serve as a reminder of that line for teens AND teachers...hopefully leading to more awareness in the matter.

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?  My opinion of Rob from the beginning was not all that high.  I don't know exactly why, can't quite pinpoint it...but something just rang as off, so his actions were not all that surprising.  Sam....what can I saw....I was not in love with the book for a while with all the focus on sex, but I was THRILLED to see Sam's character grow as she kept reliving that day and unscrambling the hidden message.

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?  Ummm, YES!  Sometimes (more often than not) the idea of something is much more than the actual act.  In books, the sweet gestures that make the reader go "Awww" and the anticipation of more can go a lot farther than an all-out-hands-on-body fest.

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retromom
Posts: 113
Registered: ‎02-02-2008
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Re: Sex and Romance

Sam and her friends have all had crushes on the math teacher, who has flirted fairly openly. During Sam's new leave-skidmarks-method of burning through her last day, she openly makes a pass at him, and he responds. What Sam's response to this, and what was yours? What do you think of Mr. Daimler?

 

I don't think Sam realized she was playing such a dangerous game with Mr. Daimler by flirting with him. I think she expected Mr. Daimler to behave appropriately and I imagine she was shocked when he didn't! I don't think she ever though he would respond in such a manner. I was creeped out by both behaviors, Sam flirting with a teacher which is inappropriate and Mr. Daimler for acting on that flirtation, also inappropriate. They both were in the wrong! But clearly Mr. Daimler was the adult in the situation and should have walked away.

 

Sam also decides, in order to escape again experiencing the awful attack on Juliet Sykes to make a pass at Rob. How does this "steamy" scene turn out for Sam--and the reader? Has your opinion of Rob changed at all? How about your opinion of Sam?

 

I am not a fan of Rob's at this point. I think he is after sex with Sam and really doesn't care for her that much. Then again Sam is using him to escape the attack on Juliet. They both seem to be just using each other.

 

Sam spends time alone with Kent in the dark rooms of his house, away from the noise of the party, and he holds her hand to take her to a guest room and tucks her in so that she can sleep. Are there ways this scene is romantic that the "sex" scenes in this chapter aren't?

 

I like Kent and I think he deeply cares for Sam. I think it is very romantic how he is gentle with Sam.

Beth

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