Mothers and Daughters

[mattzay]

I agree that Mercy was probably not supposed to use her powers. When she is in the tree, she hides from her father. She uses her powers to make the apple grow so she could eat it, but does it in a secretive way.

[mattzay]

Connie may not have a relationship with her mother, but it does not mean that she doesn't love her. Part of the reason why they may not have a relationship could be because Connie does not understand her mother. That could be part of the reason why Grace wanted Connie to clear out Granna's cottage. She says it's because of the taxes owed, but maybe it is also because she wants Connie to understand her family history.

[LabRatSB]

Connie and Grace remind me in some aspects of my own relationship with my mother.  There is a lot of love there, but they don't really know each other.  They took two different paths and have two different personalities, but in the end feel a sense of comfort from each other.

I got the impression that Sophia was much like the other mothers in this story.  Distant to her daughter.  Overlooking her.  She let the craft get the best of her life.

Mercy and Deliverance remind me a lot of Connie and Grace.  A bond exists b/c of the mother-daughter factor, but strained.  It seems as though Deliverance overlooks Mercy.

[bud12]

I think that Connie and Grace have something in common. Both believe strongly about how they go about their lives. They each embrace different philosophies and don't know how to appreciate what the other offers. They are like the flip sides of the same coin. Their mission is to understand each other, and yet they don't know this at first. It is in the unfolding of the plot that we learn how they will reconcile these differences. Although it is Connie who changes the most,  perhaps that is needed to make her feel whole and not rigidly bound to logic and reason as her raison d'etre. The other free-spirited aspects of her mother are within her and need to be expressed and appreciated to enable her to reach a more integrated identity.  

[JulieC82]

I'm sure it's been said but Connie's relationship with her mother is strained at best. They don't speak all that often and Grace is constantly forgetting the important things in Connie's life. Connie has no patience for Grace's flighty personality and thinks her mom is a bit out of touch with reality. Needless to say, they don't understand each other much in the beginning of the novel.

I think Deliverance and Mercy's relationship is similar to Connie and Grace's but we also have to remember the time period. Children were born to work the field/farm not to cultivate close personal relationships. They were a necessity back then. As the story unfolds we see a shift in Deliverance and Mercy's relationship. We see Deliverance become proud of Mercy instead of seeing her as a nusance. We see Mercy come into her own and understand the sacrafice that her mother has made.

I wish we had actually gotten to meet Sophia aka Granna. I think it would have been fascinating to throw another Goodwin woman into the mix. We do begin to understand her through what she left behind. The glass jars and the garden are all keys to unlocking Sophia and for Connie to start to understand herself. 

[mamawli]

I have been reading most of the responses about Mothers and Daughters and find that my viewpoint is entirely different from all of the others.  I feel that Grace ran away from her Mothers lifestyle and wanted to raise Connie in a different environment.  I also feel that Grace did not want to come back to that house and that is why she asked Connie to clean it up so that she could sell it. 

[Tarri]

I think the mother/daughter relationships of the 20th Century are pretty much spot on with my relationship with my mother and my friends' relationships with their mothers and I am in Grace's age group.  When I was Connie's age, my mom and I did not have the same interests, ideas, goals, and ideals, we still don't really. 

Grace respects Connie, but doesn't feel the need to discuss the things that Connie wants to discuss, most likely because Grace already knows how Connie is doing, what she has found, where she is going, who she is meeting, how she is feeling.  The problem is that Connie does not realize (yet) that Grace knows all.  More than likely Sophia and Grace communicated in the same manner and did not have to be in close contact.

[kiakar]

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mamawli wrote:
I have been reading most of the responses about Mothers and Daughters and find that my viewpoint is entirely different from all of the others.  I feel that Grace ran away from her Mothers lifestyle and wanted to raise Connie in a different environment.  I also feel that Grace did not want to come back to that house and that is why she asked Connie to clean it up so that she could sell it. 

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This is certainly a different view from the majority but let's discuss it. I believe Grace might have tried to steer Connie away from witchcraft because she wasn't happy that her daughter was headed for this lifestyle that her ancestors had lived. Even today, there is a sterotype for physic and witchcraft lifestyles by Christian and other religion. And also there are so many closed minded people that cause alot of heartache as they did in Deliverance Dane's time. Grace didn't  tell Connie about her relative inheritance  into witchcraft , she showed her by asking her to clean up the house. Grace knew that all the answers would be  there.

[wendyroba]

I believe that Grace wanted Connie to recognize and discover her "gift" and not see it as 'witchcraft'...that's why she told Connie that she (Connie) did not need the book...although she acknowledged it might be helpful to those just starting out. I believe Grace's view of "witchcraft" was a modernized view - she probably would be more apt to call it intuition, or psychic ability. She communicated with Connie on another level (Connie didn't understand it at first, but I think she came to appreciate that she could envision her mother from thousands of miles away and be accurate as to what her mom was doing at that moment). I liked how Howe connected the mothers/daughters through the generations and showed how although their gifts remained the same, the way they viewed them evolved depending on the historical time they lived in.

[Jo6353]

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mattzay wrote:
I agree that Mercy was probably not supposed to use her powers. When she is in the tree, she hides from her father. She uses her powers to make the apple grow so she could eat it, but does it in a secretive way.

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Although her mother was probably training her, I don't imagine that Mercy was would have been encouraged to use her powers on her own.  That would have been a dangerous practice for a child. Jo

[adopted1]

I believe that Graces relationship with her mother has brought about a mutual respect between her and Connie. In saying that, I mean that Grace didn't want to judge Connie in the choices that she made in her life so therefore, was able to let her search for her "soul" on her own. Grace had to (literally) leave the life she knew with Sophia to become who she wanted to be and I am sure, as in each generation, lifestyles changed with the times. That is why she chose to move to Santa Fe. Connie on the other hand was led to a life of acadamia (generation #3) and she sees the world different than that of her mother.

I don't see their relationship as strained, just unique. Grace lives more of a 'natural' lifestyle, while Connie lives her life according to social acceptance.

Grace wanting Connie to prepare the Milk St house for sale, I believe, is because of her not wanting to face whatever demons she had there herself as a child. It did take 20 years for her to do anything about the house afterall. I don't think Connie's willingness to do it had anything to do with her looking for her mothers love. Grace LOVED Connie in her own way. Her interests in Connies life were limited to what interested her about Connies life, and no more (i.e. Sam).

Grace new what Connie would face when she got to Grannas. Maybe that was her way of exposing her to her heritage and her abilities. Hmmm, how do you tell your child that she's a witch? It's like Samantha telling Tabitha that she is going to grow up with warts (for all of us "old" "Bewitched" fans). It would be hard for anyone to accept. Grace wanted her to know who she was. According to Grace....she is the one that burned the symbol into the front door for protection. Isn't it the duty of every mother to protect their child at all cost no matter what?

[DSaff]

Good thoughts.  =)

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adopted1 wrote:
I believe that Graces relationship with her mother has brought about a mutual respect between her and Connie. In saying that, I mean that Grace didn't want to judge Connie in the choices that she made in her life so therefore, was able to let her search for her "soul" on her own. Grace had to (literally) leave the life she knew with Sophia to become who she wanted to be and I am sure, as in each generation, lifestyles changed with the times. That is why she chose to move to Santa Fe. Connie on the other hand was led to a life of acadamia (generation #3) and she sees the world different than that of her mother.

I don't see their relationship as strained, just unique. Grace lives more of a 'natural' lifestyle, while Connie lives her life according to social acceptance.

Grace wanting Connie to prepare the Milk St house for sale, I believe, is because of her not wanting to face whatever demons she had there herself as a child. It did take 20 years for her to do anything about the house afterall. I don't think Connie's willingness to do it had anything to do with her looking for her mothers love. Grace LOVED Connie in her own way. Her interests in Connies life were limited to what interested her about Connies life, and no more (i.e. Sam).

Grace new what Connie would face when she got to Grannas. Maybe that was her way of exposing her to her heritage and her abilities. Hmmm, how do you tell your child that she's a witch? It's like Samantha telling Tabitha that she is going to grow up with warts (for all of us "old" "Bewitched" fans). It would be hard for anyone to accept. Grace wanted her to know who she was. According to Grace....she is the one that burned the symbol into the front door for protection. Isn't it the duty of every mother to protect their child at all cost no matter what?

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[PiperMurphy]

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adopted1 wrote:

Grace new what Connie would face when she got to Grannas. Maybe that was her way of exposing her to her heritage and her abilities. Hmmm, how do you tell your child that she's a witch? It's like Samantha telling Tabitha that she is going to grow up with warts (for all of us "old" "Bewitched" fans). It would be hard for anyone to accept. Grace wanted her to know who she was. According to Grace....she is the one that burned the symbol into the front door for protection. Isn't it the duty of every mother to protect their child at all cost no matter what?

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I totally agree with you that Grace used the house to expose Connie to her heritage and abilities. She seemed to know what was happening whether Connie told her or not. The thing I've been wondering about is how Grace raised Connie without revealing her own abilities. She must have been very adept at disguising them. Maybe she steered Connie toward other interests so that she wouldn't question her mother. Connie would just accept that that was the way she was. She would have been protecting Connie just as Deliverance protected Mercy.

[ladybug74]

I understand what you are saying and that is my thought on the matter, also. My mom and I are like that. We are 2 very different people in many ways. That doesn't mean that we dont' love each other and wouldn't be there to help each other.

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LabRatSB wrote:

Connie and Grace remind me in some aspects of my own relationship with my mother.  There is a lot of love there, but they don't really know each other.  They took two different paths and have two different personalities, but in the end feel a sense of comfort from each other.

[Bedelia]

Interesting how Connie is blind to some things right before her eyes regarding the relationships both between herself and her mother and her mother and grandmother. Many parallels to draw from there.   I think Connie, as well as ourselves, get into a "rut" thinking just one way about ourselves and our mothers.  It's sometimes hard to see through the eyes of another.  It's one of the reasons I like to read books - to "see" another way and to keep my mind open.  As I  read the chapters taking place in 1991 or the chapters set in 1692, I'm amazed at how little time really matters when it comes to how we relate to each other as mothers and daughters

[skiibunny1213]

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ponie wrote:

Well said skiibunny1213!  I just wish Grace could do what she is doing in a less (seemingly) disinterested and hurtful manner.  Are there not more encouraging ways to encourage "while still keeping enough space"? 

 ___________

It's possible, but think about it now that you've read most of the book... if your mother told you you are a witch would you believe her?  It seems like Grace is letting Connie figure it out on her own more out of necessity rather than because she is trying to make her daughter feel bad.  I think in Grace's eyes this is a growing experience for Connie.  And remember, she obviously cares deeply, hence the protection charm on the door.  I think Connie realizes later that Grace isn't aloof toward her at all, rather, they are so connected that verbal communication isn't necessary for them to know what is going on with the other. 

Message Edited by skiibunny1213 on 04-14-2009 05:21 PM

[bookworm_gp]

Relationships between mothers and daughters are always complicated but I think there's another element to this one. When Connie calls Grace she knows exactly what she's doing. She asks her mother "What are you making?" Grace responds "Samosas." She doesn't even ask Connine how she knew she was making something. And Grace knows there's a boy in Connie's life even tho Connie isn't ready to talk about Sam. I believe there's a supernatural connection between them and when Grace says she wants Connie to find herself that's what she's referring to.

[ponie]

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skiibunny1213 wrote:

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ponie wrote:

Well said skiibunny1213!  I just wish Grace could do what she is doing in a less (seemingly) disinterested and hurtful manner.  Are there not more encouraging ways to encourage "while still keeping enough space"? 

 ___________

It's possible, but think about it now that you've read most of the book... if your mother told you you are a witch would you believe her?  It seems like Grace is letting Connie figure it out on her own more out of necessity rather than because she is trying to make her daughter feel bad.  I think in Grace's eyes this is a growing experience for Connie.  And remember, she obviously cares deeply, hence the protection charm on the door.  I think Connie realizes later that Grace isn't aloof toward her at all, rather, they are so connected that verbal communication isn't necessary for them to know what is going on with the other. 

Message Edited by skiibunny1213 on 04-14-2009 05:21 PM

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skiibunny1213 - check out my post earlier today on the Part II Chapter 15 - 21 thread...I own having judged Grace harshly and not giving her the credit she deserves. 

I love coming to new conclusions!!!  I love books, and conversations, and postings that make me do that!!!

[adopted1]

Good Day Piper,

Grace could have possibly steered Connie in a different direction. I also believe that Grace could have very well used her own abilities (powers) while raising Connie, and like you said...'Connie would just accept that that was the way she was'. 

In looking at their relationship, I would bet that Connie found interests of her own while growing up under Grace.  To me, their relationship screams.....'you do your thing and I'll do mine and together we shall live in peace'.

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PiperMurphy wrote:

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adopted1 wrote:

Grace new what Connie would face when she got to Grannas. Maybe that was her way of exposing her to her heritage and her abilities. Hmmm, how do you tell your child that she's a witch? It's like Samantha telling Tabitha that she is going to grow up with warts (for all of us "old" "Bewitched" fans). It would be hard for anyone to accept. Grace wanted her to know who she was. According to Grace....she is the one that burned the symbol into the front door for protection. Isn't it the duty of every mother to protect their child at all cost no matter what?

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I totally agree with you that Grace used the house to expose Connie to her heritage and abilities. She seemed to know what was happening whether Connie told her or not. The thing I've been wondering about is how Grace raised Connie without revealing her own abilities. She must have been very adept at disguising them. Maybe she steered Connie toward other interests so that she wouldn't question her mother. Connie would just accept that that was the way she was. She would have been protecting Connie just as Deliverance protected Mercy.

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[skiibunny1213]

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ponie wrote:

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skiibunny1213 wrote:

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ponie wrote:

Well said skiibunny1213!  I just wish Grace could do what she is doing in a less (seemingly) disinterested and hurtful manner.  Are there not more encouraging ways to encourage "while still keeping enough space"? 

 ___________

It's possible, but think about it now that you've read most of the book... if your mother told you you are a witch would you believe her?  It seems like Grace is letting Connie figure it out on her own more out of necessity rather than because she is trying to make her daughter feel bad.  I think in Grace's eyes this is a growing experience for Connie.  And remember, she obviously cares deeply, hence the protection charm on the door.  I think Connie realizes later that Grace isn't aloof toward her at all, rather, they are so connected that verbal communication isn't necessary for them to know what is going on with the other. 

Message Edited by skiibunny1213 on 04-14-2009 05:21 PM

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skiibunny1213 - check out my post earlier today on the Part II Chapter 15 - 21 thread...I own having judged Grace harshly and not giving her the credit she deserves. 

I love coming to new conclusions!!!  I love books, and conversations, and postings that make me do that!!!

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Apologies ponie, I didn't see the other post!  I am still new to this type of forum, I feel like there are too many posts and not enough time to read them all!!