Hunting, Trapping, Poaching

[Rachel-K]

In these middle chapters we get longer descriptions of Mike and Jack checking traps while Mike is a child.

Can you describe the animals we've come across in the story so far? Do any of them seem to have personalities?

Can you compare Jack's  attitude toward hunting and trapping with Mike's attitude wildlife, including his attitude about searching for the bear?

[dhaupt]

Good Monday morning to everyone.

First I have to say that this is one book that it's incredibly hard to stay on schedule with, I keep wanting to go on, but I've refrained so far.

In discussing the animals described in the chapter where Mike goes with Jack to check the traps I found depressing and concerning. Jack had so little care for Mike's health that he took him out in the cold and damp knowing he was sick. What a jerk. And if he wasn't belittling him he was ignoring him. I have no fond feelings for Jack at all.

Talking about the animals having personalities, all the ones in the traps were nothing but victims. I'm not opposed to hunting but poaching is something all together different and I have no sympathy for any of the perpetrators, unless the poaching was for feeding a family which in this case it wasn't.

The difference between Mike and Jack's attitude toward hunting and trapping is that Mike has reverence and respect for the law and Jack does what he pleases no matter the consequences.

I empathized with Mike when he had no choice but to kill the bear and I had no sympathy for Bud Thompson, too bad the bear didn't take a bigger bite out of him.

[Deltadawn]

Good morning,

I agree with Debbie - it was terrible how Jack had no concern for Mike's health when he took him out in the cold knowing how sick he was. That was awful.

I also am in total agreement with this statement:

"The difference between Mike and Jack's attitude toward hunting and trapping is that Mike has reverence and respect for the law and Jack does what he pleases no matter the consequences."

Another difference is that Mike also has reverence and respect for wildlife.

[lg4154]

Yeah, I thought Jack was a little harsh and not considerate of Mike being sick, he had no regard for his well being and bullied him into going anyway, also questioning his manhood. I felt sorry for the trapped animals and the author did a good job in making them have personalities. For Jack hunting and trapping is what he does, he never thought on the illegal side of it, more like everybody else is doing it. For Mike, he knows it is illegal and he tries everything in his power to save the Bear and is angry with himself when he has to shoot  it.

[LadyMin]

Mike and Jack have very different attitudes about everything. Jack comes off as selfish and inconsiderate. He doesn't respect his family, the wildlife or the law. Mike on the other hand shows thoughtfulness and concern. He goes out of his way to make explanations for Jack and seems to accept him for who he is.

At this point I think Jack is innocent, but that doesn't make me like him. Taking a sick child on a hunting trip in the cold and ignoring the fact that he was miserable was inexcusable.

[babzilla41]

Rachel-K wrote:

In these middle chapters we get longer descriptions of Mike and Jack checking traps while Mike is a child.

Can you describe the animals we've come across in the story so far? Do any of them seem to have personalities?

Can you compare Jack's  attitude toward hunting and trapping with Mike's attitude wildlife, including his attitude about searching for the bear?

I wonder if Jack even knew how sick Mike was when he took him out trapping.  Since he had so little to do with him, he probably didn't even know how to properly take care of him; how would he know if he just had a runny nose versus something more serious.  I'm not making excuses for him, but it happens; many parents take such a small part in the care of their children - the true care and upbringing falls to one parent.  I think that might explain why Mike saw him crying at his hospital bedside.  I want to think that Jack was angry at himself for not knowing how to care for his son and also that he was showing some emotion/love for his sick child.

Jack views hunting/trapping as a way of life; a means to make money, a way to feed himself and for a while his family.  Mike is more sensitive towards the animals, as he showed the day he was trapping with his dad and asked why he didn't just shoot the fox.  You could see that it bothered him to know what the fox felt before he died.  Shooting the fox was more humane to Mike.  Mike, as an adult, still cares for the animals as he has shown in dealing with the bear - he wanted to trap the bear and was angry that he ended up having to track down the injured bear only to have to kill him.  He knew the bear was suffering from the gunshot wound that Bud inflicted.  Interestingly, Mike did not show Bud any concern when he realized that Bud was injured/bleeding - his comment about Bud not having to worry, he wasn't going to bleed to death - then leaving him alone in the house while he went after the bear.  His disregard for Bud was similiar to Jack's disregard for Mike's feelings about the trapped animals. 

[maxcat]

None of the animals caught in traps had personalities. they knew what was going to happen to them I was not enjoying reading this whole part as Jack didn't care about Mike's health. He was trying to show off and how to be a man by shooting creatures caught in those traps.

Eventually, as Mike grew up, he learned about poaching and decided that was not the life for him. He becomes a warden for the state caring for animals and giving them space. He loved the quietude of the woods and seemed even to embrace it. He did have trouble with a bear, who in the first few chapters, caught a pig and tried to break into a house. The bear came back and mauled Thompson. Mike found out that Thompson had been putting trash and food out for the bear. He shot it but evidently it wasn't dead. Mike had to shoot the bear as it began to charge at him.

[CAG]

I am not sure if I think any of the animals in the story have a personality at this point although I think the bear represents normal wildlife and the substory about the bear gives us a picture of Mike's love for the wilderness and respect for the law. He cares about the bear and does not want to kill it because it is after all, just being a bear.

The animals that Jack hunts don't have a chance. This aspect of the story shows me Jack doesn't care about the wildlife. His only concern is what he wants to do. He is selfish and self-centered. His trapping methods seem barbaric to me. I was especially concerned that he couldn't even take care of his child and recognize how ill he was. Yet it didn't surprise me given his personality. Jack doesn't care what the consequences are and he just does what he wants to do.

[LindaEducation]

The animals are helpless victims. It was especially hard to read about the poor fox.  I love wildlife and am actively a supporter of various animals causes, especially wlidlife.  I had tears in my eyes when Mike asked his callous Dad why he couldnt have just shot the wolf.  I like Mike because he has a real caring for animals and respects the law.  I think Mike became a game warden to do the right thing; to help balance what his Dad does in poaching. 

[mgorbatjuk]

Comparatively speaking-Jack has the same respect for the animals as he does for his son. Maybe even more so-at least the animals are worth something to him. If I thought it was out of just necessity that he take Mike along I could see taking a sick child out but you'd leave him in the car and hurry about your business. You wouldn't drag him out in the elements. And I'm pretty sure most of the money went for alcohol and not for food. I don't like Mike's dad too much.

[DSaff]

While I am really enjoying this book, I am not enjoying the tortured animals. I have no problem with hunters and trappers who do so for food, etc. But these traps are torturing the animals and that stinks. The rational is that the fur has to be kept nice for the customer, but humanity should show too. Mike definitely had an adverse reaction to this practice, especially with the fox, and that didn't help his health. His father was looking for money, and so far all I see him really spend money on is booze. I am hoping there is more softness in Jack than we have seen thus far.

Mike cares about the animals and wants to do everything he can to keep man and animal alive. I hated that he had to kill the bear because of a drunk baiting it. Then, he couldn't even arrest the guy. I totally understand his feelings and hope there are consequences for the drunk later in the book.

[Bonnie824]

Jack sees animals as things for him to benefit from. He doesn't care about their pain or suffering at all. I see the same attitude towards his son when he was a child, and probably his wife.

Mike is a protector of the wildlife and woods. I don't see why he is not more disgusted by his father than he is.

[kleeGA]

Jack seems to only look at wildlife as something to kill.  It’s more of a game to him to see how many he can trap and bonus points for the ones he can get illegally under the warden’s nose.  Mike looks at it as more of a necessity.  He sees wildlife as another life and doesn’t want to kill them unless he has to.

[Meandmoose]

I don't think Jack has any respect or compassion for any living creature, be it human or animal. Mike respects wildlife and though he accepts hunting as a means to provide food, he doesn't believe in senseless killing or suffering of animals.

[Bonnie_C]

The section with the animal trapping was hard to read.  Let's face it, Jack is just not a nice person.  I think the author did his homework when he came up with this character.  Jack does illicit emotion whenever he appears in the story.

I will say that Jack is good at what he does.  He obviously has a depth of knowledge regarding the woods and the wildlife that inhabit them that is unparalleled.   If only he would apply this talent for the good!  He himself would make an excellent game warden.

[Zia01]

Can you describe the animals we've come across in the story so far? Do any of them seem to have personalities?

Foxes, Raccoons, Muskrats, Otters, Bucks. We hear of all kinds of animals on the day Jack took mike out to check his traps. As for personalities, most of what we've seen so far have been dead. I was infuriated at Jack in this chapter, taking his sick son out to check his traps, such irresponsibility.

Can you compare Jack's  attitude toward hunting and trapping with Mike's attitude wildlife, including his attitude about searching for the bear? Jack seems to have a reckless attitude towards hunting and trapping. He doesn't seem to care about laws and legalities. If he was feeding his family I might have some sympathies towards him, but he's trapping to sell and that is just wrong in my opinion.

Mike, on the other hand, seems to care about the animals. He was upset that he had to shoot the bear and it angered him when he found out Mr.. Thompson had baited it. He almost seems rigid in his work, a by the book kind of guy. Almost an exact opposite of his father, like he's trying so hard not to be his father.

[pen21]

I think we have a lot to learn about Jack. I don't agree with his poaching. But I wonder if in his background and family if hunting and trapping was their way of life. The way they provided for their families. Is this how Jack was raised? As I have read the book that is how I have been looking at Jack. We are all a combination of many influences and experiences by the time we reach the age Jack is. I think that Mike is trying to figure out that side of Jack. Just as Mike is trying to figure out his life, how he became a game warden and what being a game warden means to being the man he wants to be.

pen21

[Rebz]

At this point in the novel, I do not believe that the animals described in this novel had real "personalities" per say.  They are all pretty helpless, all inevitable victims to Jack and his traps.

Jack and Mike are pretty much opposites on pretty much all things.  Jack obviously shows no regard for Mike's health and well being when he takes him to check his tracks, selfishly, I might add.  Jack sees wildlife as objects for him to use and manipulate for his own needs, wants, or pleasures.  I think this influenced Mike's attitude towards wildlife because it made him feel a need to be the "anti-Jack" and respect nature more.  Mike definitely sympathizes with animals he encounters in his older years and doesn't want to hurt anything.  Mike tries to go after the bear in a civil manner where no one gets hurt...unfortunately this doesn't seem to be possible.

[trschi]

For all of the differences between father and son on this topic, I think that Mike and Jack have a few things in common when it comes to wildlife. One of these is enjoyment. They both enjoy the animals they come across, albeit in different ways.  Jack prefers to destroy them, whereas Mike prefers to conserve them, but I get the sense that both are happy when they are engaging in their respective activities. Another commonality is the pride and care with which they go through their acts.  As despicable as Jack's poaching and trapping are, he still is diligent, thorough, and successful (though hardly anyone besides a poacher would consider this "success").  Similarly, Mike has the same thoughtfulness when he is doing his job.

[MSaff]

Good Morning All,

  I think these middle chapters were set to bring us in line with the way each character played their part both separately and as a whole.  Mike at his early age in the section, shows that he is trying to be accepting of his father, but to no avail.  Jack is a single minded person with no regard to anyone or anything other than himself.  This is evident in the completed disregard for Mike's health when he, Jack, takes Mike along on a poaching trip, in the form of checking traps, while Mike is sick. 

  This expedition is not a hunting or trapping experience for Mike.  However, Mike is still trying to look up to his father.  Why, I don't know, but for the yearning of youth and acceptance.

  I am all for hunting, but I do have a problem with trapping.  Especially those of the steel traps.  They are designed to mame, and they are more of a torture than anything else. 

  Mike's attitude towards the animals is very different from his fathers'.  Mike has compassion for the animals and has taken an oath to protect them.  That is why he had such a terrible time having to kill the bear.  I don't have any respect for either Bud Thompson, as he baited the bear in order to get revenge.  Jack has no regard for animals as seen in his poaching experiences.  Jack also has no regard for human dignity either.  Jack is out for himself.

Rachel-K wrote:

In these middle chapters we get longer descriptions of Mike and Jack checking traps while Mike is a child.

Can you compare Jack's  attitude toward hunting and trapping with Mike's attitude wildlife, including his attitude about searching for the bear?