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jb70
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

poirotNY wrote:

Forgot - my impression of Sarah:

I think she suffers from what a lot of people do - you think you can change someone.  This rarely happens, and in real life, people only make changes if the person themselves want to change.  She knew from the get-go what Mike wanted to do.  Sarah also had reasons for worrying if the salary Mike would make would be sufficient, due to her parents financial issues, but she is also conflicted. She is like Mike's mother - it's like a cycle of life repeating itself.

Both women love men who are emotionally unavailable and unwilling to try and pursue a life that will make them (the women) more financially comfortable.

Clearly, Mike is his father and Sarah is his mother - the only question is whether their relationship will turn out the same.

 

The relationship does seem a bit one sided, like Sarah wants it to work a lot more than Mike does which often seems to be the case.  I don't know that Mike is his father though, he works long hours on an actual job not just escaping into the wood to poach and hide out.

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jb70
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

DSaff wrote:

Good ideas on your suspects. Another person I have on my suspect list is Mike's stepfather. He could know about the phone calls and the sale of the land. He seems to be a man with trust and anger issues (down deep) and could have hired someone to frame Mike's dad.

 

maxcat wrote:

I'd like to post one on suspects. First, it might be Pelletier as he seems to have a lot at stake in losing his business. He, to me , is not someone who would be easy to talk to  about anything.

Second, you know in a murder mystery, it's going to be someone you don't suspect. But I am having a feeling that Charley Stevens might be a suspect. He helps out by flying the plane around in the wilderness to spot Jack. But he seems to be genuinely nice about hanging around Mike. He knew something was going on when Mike's dad had poached a deer and had it in his cabin. But he never said anything about it.

Then there's Truman Dellis who was poaching with Jack. He is a mean character and wants nothing to do with the right side of the law.

These are just some suspects I've questioned in my mind that they could really do harm.

 

 

 

I hadn't even considered the step father, that is an interesting idea.

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jb70
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

babzilla41 wrote:

I think it's interesting that most everyone has commented that Mike's idea of what a relationship should be is based on his mother's and father's relationship.  He was only nine when they split.  Seems like he would be more influenced by his mother and step-father's relationship as he spent more years with them, which leads me to think that things in that relationship weren't so hunky-dory either.  Mike's mother gave us a small glimpse of that when she told Mike that his dad still called her.  The fact that she still takes his calls, and that she never told her husband about them, leads me to think that she still loves Jack, on some level, and feels the need to hide things from her husband.  For some reason she reminds me of a Stepford wife in her "new" life - which could account for Mike's inability to be involved in an emotional relationship with Sarah.

 

I wondered if she still took the calls because she still loves him, just knows that she can't live with him, as if she hasn't really moved on like she says she has.

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jb70
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

SandyS wrote:

MamaGoose49 wrote:

I  enjoy getting to know the characters, and I wonder how much Charley will be playing a part later in the book

I have been thinking a lot about Charley Stevens.  Chapter 8, pg 66, "What I didn't tell the lieutenant was that Charley Stevens and my dad had a long history together, or that the retired pilot, more than anyone, was probably responsible for my joining the Warden Service.  It was a long story and a bad memory, especially under the circumstances."

 

I'm trying to pinpoint exactly what Charley did that was responsible for Mike becoming a Warden.  Does it relate to when he was a young man (Chapter 18) visiting his dad at camp?

 

SandyS

 

My guess is that part is still to come because I was looking for it too and didn't really see much in that one scene to make Mike decide to become a warden (having a drunk hold a shot gun pointed at you wouldn't make me want to start a career!)

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julyso
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

MamaGoose49 wrote:

You can't help but feel a little annoyed with Mike. He is showing lack of judgment with his personal life as well as his job.

 

He did not enjoy his time with his father but he is still trying to find approval from him. Instead of worrying about his father so much he needs to stop and think about his own life. The author does a wonderful job of showing how history can repeat itself. Hopefully Mike can break this cycle and find satisfaction with his life, whether it is in the forest alone or making a life somewhere else.

 

 

I SO agree with you! I am enjoying the book, also, but I am so frustrated with Mike! Why is he ruining his own life/job for a man who was never there for him? I just want to smack him! I really like him & want him to straighten all this out & soon...

 

Julie
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Zeal
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

Bonnie824 wrote:

hookedonbooks09 wrote:

I will just hit on the Sarah aspect for now. 

 

I was kind of put off at Mike's treatment of Sarah when she showed up to try to lend support during his time of need.  (He actually reminded me of boyfriends I'd had in HS, who were a little childish and not very nice at times!)

 

Anyway, I think it took a lot of nerve for her to try to bridge their differences and come back to be there for him and while he seemed to realize this, he rebuilt the wall between them anyway.

 

All of that being said, I think we as humans, basically function within our frame of reference and Mike's frame of reference with regard to relationships is weak and broken to say the least!  How much can we expect of him, unless he can break out of the mold of his parents' example?

 

--Barb

 

 

I agree Barb, she made the effort and he didn't, I really dont' think he loves her. He seems to think they wanted different things (they did) but didn't care enough to compromise even a little.

 

Bonnie

 

 

I don't think Mike knows HOW to love.  He is afraid, and he doesn't want to make the same mistakes as his parents.  Mike is struggling to define himself and his life.

When his father calls him, I think Mike feels as if he is finally wanted/needed by his father.  He wants so badly to believe in his innocence, that he will help Jack in any way that he can.  Mike is still looking for acceptance from his father.  If Mike succeeds in proving Jack's innocence, then surely, his father will accept him and love him.

 

 

"I learned to dream through reading, learned to create dreams through writing, and learned to develop dreamers through teaching. I shall always be a dreamer."
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

All of Mike's frustrations are taken out on DeSalle.  At first, Mike is frustrated by DeSalle and his treatment of his son, but as Mike continues to "run" into them, it becomes more than that.  Mike has chosen to be a Maine Game Warden, and he intends to fulfill those duties to their fullest, especially when everything else in his life is spinning out of control.  What does he have to loose?  Mike is not thinking of his future or the repercussions of his actions.  His emotional state is getting in the way of his professional thinking. 

"I learned to dream through reading, learned to create dreams through writing, and learned to develop dreamers through teaching. I shall always be a dreamer."
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BaseballMomma
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 While the takeover of logging is the reason behind the murder (that we know of so far), it seems that it's taken a backseat in the story. The residents definitely aren't happy about it, and people are going to be displaced and lose a lot with the takeover. To me the story is more concentrated on finding Jack and whether he's guilty or not. I think you can include any of Jack's friends because he mentions to Mike that he could have been set up.

 

 The tourists all seem to be described as rich, and you get the idea that the locals lead a simpler life and not have much money. Mike seems to seculde himself for the most part. He's the new game warden and everybody knows him, but he'd rather stay to himself.

 

In the first scene with Desalle, Mike was in the right. He was checking up on things and doing his job. The second time, he was looking for a fight. Mike waited for Desalle and purposely looked for something to give him a ticket for. He's definitely better at communicating people he's close to, but then again, who is he close to? You could say Sarah, but he ran her off.

 

 I think Sarah really does love Mike and would stay with him if he hadn't pushed her away. In his mind he was trying to "make it easier" by shoving her out the door before she could walk out herself. He doesn't let her make up her own mind about how she feels about him and their relationship and instead tells her. My impression is their relationship is a lot like his parents' was. I think his father sabatoged the relationship every chance he got, so he was the one hurting her and not the other way around.

 

 It was interesting to meet Mike's mom. Of course she's described by Mike as former trailor trash that married up and has worked to have a perfect life she doesn't want disturbed by her former life. I think that she still has feelings for his father though. Jack loved her and still loves her (despite his actions saying otherwise), and I think a part of her knows that he really did love her. He just couldn't get past his own self-loathing to give them a chance.

 

 

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CharlieG31
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

How central or distant does the takeover of the logging seem so far in the story? What role do these local politics play in the lives of the the residents here? Do you have any other possible suspects to consider?

The way the corporation is handling the logging and the use of lands is certainly causing a stir in the town, However from my point of view the people from the town and the people who live around the town do not feel as if they can do anything to stop what is going on , there is only a small group of people who actually care about protecting their lands but a lot of people do not care about what happens to their lands as long as they get some money for their lands. In the town there seems to be the two type of people, the people who will protect their lands no matter what and the people who no longer feel attached to the town and will certainly consider selling it for a good price. For me another suspect to consider is the company , considering that they are the ones who want the land so if they creat a big social stir up then they will look like the victims making the people that are protecting their lands be to the eyes of the world murderers.

 

 

Compare life for the tourists and life for most of the locals. How does Mike fit in?

Mike is an in between life of the locs and life of the tourists, he is not as closed as the locals but he is not as opened as the tourists. The paths that life has taken him through make him be indifferent towards others and all the situations that present concerning tourists, the problem with his father makes him get out this indifference however concerning other situations it seems Mike does not find a place to fit in he does not fit in with the locals but also he does not fit in with the tourists or with people from other cities , which is why sometimes he feels like a visitor or a foreign stranger because he does not have the personality of a certain group he simply does not fit in.

 

In Mike's scenes so far with Anthony Desalle--who's got the bigger attitude? Is Mike in the right? Is Mike any better at communicating with the people he's close to?

 From my point of view Mike is now just trying to focus that stress and anger he has concerning his fathers problem in whoever he finds the chance to get even at. When he sees Mr. Desalle again he has just come back from all the problems and he decides that maybe if he can give him a hard time then maybe he will feel better but then he realizes his stress and his anguish are still there and that no matter who he decides to take it all off with it is a problem he needs to solve not others. Mike is not better at all with communication with the people he's closer to at least while he is stressed out , when Mike is in the highest point of stress because they will not let him participate in the investigation he is rude to everyone who approaches him because that is the way he has learned of self defense which is why when he feels threatened he builds up this wall in which rudeness can certainly protect him.

 

Do you have much impression of Mike's ex-girlfriend, Sarah? We meet Mike's mother in these chapters--what is your impression of her?

 

From my point of view there are certain characteristics between Sarah and Mikes mother that clearly show a resemblance. From my point of view Sarah is still in love with Mike but she is afraid of poverty and of getting hurt again which is why she tries to distance herself and she still has the hope that Mike will reconquer her and she knows that deep inside she will accept because she loves him no matter what and that even though there were hard times Sarah does not care if she gets hurt again but Mike does which is why there is a wall between them that does not let them re fall in love again. Mikes mother is the same case as Sarah with a different context but from my point of view its the same, Mikes mother had to deal with his dad and his alcoholism, but when Mikes mother tells him that they were still talking through the phone this shows that Mikes mother also loves his dad but that she got hurt so many times that she decided to leave for good. When Mikes mom talks about his father there is a certain sense of love as in friends or as in a couple showing that Mikes mom still cares for his father the way Sarah cares for him right now. This shows that the women around Mikes life have the same life, and that the problem between Mike and Sarah is the same Mikes mother had with his dad with a different action (Dad alcoholism Mike Job) but they are still the same. I am hoping that as the book goes through Mike will realize all the things he has done and try to reconquer Sarah in order to not end up like his dad when he s older.

"The questions are more essential than the answers."
Karl Theodor Jaspers

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DfiggZ
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

In Mike's scenes so far with Anthony Desalle--who's got the bigger attitude? Is Mike in the right? Is Mike any better at communicating with the people he's close to?

 

I really don't know what to think of Mike. He seems to be all over the place. I can't connect with him. He just does things that he clearly is not supposed to do and I know he is "just doing his job" but really??? He knew who he was walking up to the second time! He could have just backed up and called someone else over or what have you. It made him look so bad and I really didn't think he was capabile of doing such things.

 

Mike is not really good at communicating at much with anyone really. He says things to push people away because he doesn't want to hurt them later but I just feel that it's a cop out of some sort. I don't know! He just confuses me at times. I feel like I could really like his character but then he does this with DeSalle! Ahhh Who knows???

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lizabet1196
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

How central or distant does the takeover of the logging seem so far in the story?   I believe that it is seems very central to the story so far.  It seems that the murders happened because of the takeover of the land.  What role do these local politics play in the lives of the the residents here? Any small town is all about politics and they play bigger roles in your life than it seems it does in a bigger town.  Do you have any other possible suspects to consider?  I am thinking Pelletier.

 

Compare life for the tourists and life for most of the locals. How does Mike fit in?  I think Mike is well on his way to fitting in as a local but maybe not quite there yet.

 

 

Do you have much impression of Mike's ex-girlfriend, Sarah?  After reading these last chapters, I feel that maybe she does love Mike and maybe regrets leaving him to a degree.

 

We meet Mike's mother in these chapters--what is your impression of her?  She reminds me somewhat of Sarah.

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mrsareads
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

 

How central or distant does the takeover of the logging seem so far in the story? What role do these local politics play in the lives of the the residents here? Do you have any other possible suspects to consider? The takeover of the logging seems to be central to the mystery. It is all about local politics. Progress is great, unless it affects my normalcy. Any local could be a possible suspect.

 

Compare life for the tourists and life for most of the locals. How does Mike fit in? Mike is still trying to fit in to his new role and town. Like any small town, it takes a while to not be considered from elsewhere; to be trusted - but you will always be an 'outsider'. Mike is more likely to fit in here than anywhere. He is a loner who seems to value what many in this small town seem to value.

 

In Mike's scenes so far with Anthony Desalle--who's got the bigger attitude? Is Mike in the right? Is Mike any better at communicating with the people he's close to? I don't like Mike in the scenes with Desalle - not that I like Desalle any. But it seems that Mike could handle the situation better - especially the second time around. I think his boss was right to put him on 'vacation'. But this seems to be how Mike communicates; his history growing up influences his reactions to others.

 

Do you have much impression of Mike's ex-girlfriend, Sarah? She seems to care about Mike, but they both seem to realize that they want different things.

 

We meet Mike's mother in these chapters--what is your impression of her? She has done what is best for her, and in her mind her son. She still has feelings for Mike's father, but like Sarah, realized that it could not go on.

 

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AnnahE
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 I think that the takeover of the logging is central to this story.  The locals are losing land and being displaced and that would make anyone angry. They have a love/hate relationship with the tourists.  The locals need their money, yet they hate the fact that they need their money. I think that Mike and his mother will never have a close relationship.  She is more concerned with her new marriage and the security that it brings her, than mending the relationship with Mike.  I have a niggling feelng in the back of my mind that Mike's dad is really guilty.  I don't know why I think that, I just do.  I can't wait to read the rest to see the outcome.

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pattycakeMN
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

It does seem that the takeover of the land the people are leasing relates to the murders.  Especially when the murders happened the night of the community meeting.  As I was reading, I first suspected Charley and then BJ (Brenda).

 

I think both Mike and Anthony Desalle have big attitudes.  I was really upset about the way Desalle treated his son, and was thinking that Mike related to the son in that his own Father treated him poorly when he was a child.  Perhaps Mike was striking out to Desalle with his deep seated feelings against his own father/son relationship.  Mike doesn't communicate well at all with people he is associated with.

 

Sarah is nice girl, and I think Mike loves her very much.  I think she is somewhat like Mike's Mother with the exception that I believe Sarah is not as superficial.  Mike's Mother is still in love with Jack but doesn't want to admit it.  She couldn't live as "trailer trash", but still yearns for Jack.  She seems to love material things more than Jack and Mike.

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Marcella87
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

fordmg wrote:

 

 I guess I don't understand why most people are upset with Mike checking out DeSalle again.  I am more upset that after making a formal complaint, DeSalle still is not following the rules.  Does he believe they don't apply to him?  DeSalle jeopardizes a person's job with a formal complaint, and then breaks the rules again - this is the ultimate snub to the warden agency. 

 

MG 

 

I wasn't upset at Mike doing his job, it was the manner in which he was doing it. I completely agree that there are consequences for not following the rules. The impression I got from Mike right before and during that scene is that he was angered by all the recent events and he was looking for a fight. Its acceptable to enforce rules and do your job but going about it in a "I'll show him" attitude isn't the professional way to do it. Mike I'm sure is also aware of the policy not to engage someone who has made a complaint, no matter how bogus it is. By disregarding this policy it showed me he was more concerned about picking a fight and feeling in control than enforcing the laws. 

 

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Zia01
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

I don't know that I like Sarah, she actually reminds me a bit of his mother. Mike's all perfect as long as he wants more, achieves more. Otherwise he's not worth it.

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nickntom
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

JaneM wrote:

EMILY7W wrote:

I had a hard time putting the book down after chapter 18. It's getting interesting.
The more we learn about Mike's father, the more repulsive he becomes and we're reminded of Mike's ability to overlook or be in denial of what kind of person his father really is.
I think his mother still has a love for his father. He was her husband and father of her child and though she loved him, decided she could no longer put herself and son through living with him. And because of this love for him, she chose to keep his phone calls a secret from her husband.
Mike's confronting Desalle, I think was to mess with him some more as well as looking out for the little boy. They both have big attitudes and it seems Mike's not really "close" to anyone, but could work on his communication skills, especially with Sarah.(And I thought the nipple part in the sex scene was a little too much info., though I have to give Paul Doiron props for making me feel like I was there. haha)

-Emily

I can't figure out how to modify the quote to be just the part I want to comment about!  Anyway, I agree with the last line of Emily's post in that I though the sex scene was too gratuitous and didn't really add anything significant to the character or story development.

 

I thought I had accidently stumbled into the Romance selection  :smileywink:  You don't usually find that many nipples in the Mystery aisle...

 

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retromom
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

[ Edited ]

Possible suspects - Officer Twombly sure has my suspicions up as does Russell Pelletier. Russell stands to lose a lot if the logging takeover happens. Who better to frame than Jack. Twombly seems to have it in for Jack for some reason which raises my suspicions about him. Why did he go to arrest Jack all alone? I was thinking maybe to shoot Jack and shut him up. Every time a new character is introduced I find myself thinking if they could be a suspect. I was thinking that maybe even De Salle was involved in some way.

 

DeSalle- The first time Mike approached him I think he was just doing his job. The second time I think Mike was just looking for trouble. I think Mike thinks in his own way he is protecting that boy. Maybe he wishes someone would have protected him as a child.

 

Mike's Mother- I was shocked when she said she used to take calls from Jack. Seems like maybe she still cares for him somewhat although I don't know for the life of me why.

 

 

Beth

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Zeal
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

 

Zia01 wrote:

I don't know that I like Sarah, she actually reminds me a bit of his mother. Mike's all perfect as long as he wants more, achieves more. Otherwise he's not worth it.

 

This is an interesting comparison...one that I never would have considered, but I can see why you connect Sarah and Mike's mother.  Maybe if we knew Sarah in a little more depth, like we do Mike, it would be even clearer.

 

"I learned to dream through reading, learned to create dreams through writing, and learned to develop dreamers through teaching. I shall always be a dreamer."
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nickntom
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Re: Poacher's Son: Middle Chapters, 8 - 18

I am starting to feel like the logging takeover could be more of a red herring, too...and, while I initially thought the Mike-DeSalle-Son scene was a Next Generation Charley-Jack-Mike set up, after the second confrontation I am forced to include DeSalle on the suspect list, since why use such a chance encounter twice unless it wasn't really chance?  Sarah's character still seems a little one dimensional to me, and I am throwing my vote into the Mike's-parents-are-still-in-love, but-sometimes-that-isn't-enough pool.