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Atreyu59
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

TO ReadingPatti- 

        You know what will be interesting ? Is to look back (maybe after the next novel of Ingenuine) and see if we were on-target with the characters or if they become someone or folks we would never have guessed they'd become.  Watching them blossom into adults will be interesting, almost as though we 'born' into their personalities as parents watching children grow up.

 

 

 


 

:smileyhappy:

 


 

you stated:

        he characters I think are trying to find themselves. They don't want to be put in a mold that their have made for them. It does remain to be seen if they successful.

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Atreyu59
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I must be old, cause I was able to follow and understand the lingo, language and take on what was being said even amongst the gangsters, the flappers (which I had no experience to before this book) and the wealthy high-class folks too.

Yet, perhaps if you are aiming at a Younger audience you may do good by putting in a section in the rear of the book about terms or setting the tone on what the 1920's mean't.  I think I have watched enough movies with my ma and family that I got it and did not find the language hard to follow.  

Now talk about hard to follow lingo was the last FL book I read- The Wake of Forgiveness.  I had to re-read each page to understand the lingo.

 


 

Airion1 you said

However, some of the termanology and slang takes away from it if you don't know what it means. Some sort of period guide in the back would be helpful.

Reading . . .is LIVING in true color
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Sarah-W
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

 

It would be interesting to know how much Jillian knew about her characters and what would happen with the from the start... or how much they changed as she wrote the books...

Atreyu59 wrote:

TO ReadingPatti- 

        You know what will be interesting ? Is to look back (maybe after the next novel of Ingenuine) and see if we were on-target with the characters or if they become someone or folks we would never have guessed they'd become.  Watching them blossom into adults will be interesting, almost as though we 'born' into their personalities as parents watching children grow up.

 

 

 

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hawkdancer
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎10-21-2009

Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

[ Edited ]

1. They all want to change their looks because they want to adopt a different persona. They don't think they're reaching their fullest potential, at least in Gloria and Lorraine's cases. For Clara, it is more out of necessity than anything else; she must change, or risk a worse fate. They all want something more from life than what their current situations have to offer-- Gloria's engagement to Bastian, Lorraine's life in Gloria's shadow, Clara's parents' threat to ship her away for school.

I think, for the most part, they are successful. And yes, they do change their lives. They discover new opportunities and new doors for their life. They may not wholeheartedly know where they are going nor are they necessarily thrilled with the resulting developments, but they each got what they wanted-- change.

 

2. I agree with Jerome in that Gloria is not completely free, but at the same time, by making her decision to rebel against her parents, she makes herself free. She proves that no one controls her-- not her parents, not her fiance, not even her friends. By society's standards and her family's expectations, she is still bound. But in choosing to go to the Green Mill, in choosing to speak to Jerome without her friends, she proves that she is independent-- perhaps not in body, but definitely in mind.

 

I think Vixen is an interesting book; to be completely frank, it's a bit similar to the other posse-girl series that have been hitting shelves in recent years. It's definitely not a book I have my face glued to every second of the day; nevertheless, I think the characters' exploits are entertaining, and they each have a lot of depth to them. I would like to see more development with Bastian's character, though-- he typically pops up only as a mention in conversations, and as Gloria's fiance, I think he deserves a bit more screen time! ;D

 

I look forward to the rest of this book! :smileyhappy:

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hawkdancer
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I agree with your last paragraph, about the sex. I'm a teen myself, and I don't have any problems with 'sexy' scenes, but I think that in this novel, sex is mentioned in parts where it doesn't have to be mentioned. It's used more as a device to scandalize the audience and to add the degree of rebelliousness to the story than to serve a purpose in the plot, and that bothers me a bit. I think the use of sex would be much more effective if it weren't mentioned in places where it needn't be metioned, like within the first two pages.

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Atreyu59
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

TO Hawkdancer:

 

In your reading did you think that by having sex mentioned so early in the beginning it will act as a deterrent for YA reading the novel or browsing to see what it may be about?  Personally I didn't thing it was too much, yet I am an old adult too.

 


 

hawkdancer stated:

       I think the use of sex would be much more effective if it weren't mentioned in places where it needn't be metioned, like within the first two pages.

Reading . . .is LIVING in true color
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cmmn
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I am really enjoying Vixen.  I like the way each chapter is seen from that character's point of view.  Each is still trying to discover who they are.  Gloria likes her new personae but she's not free.  She is still her mother's daughter and how she was brought up is holding her back.

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MissysReadsAndReviews
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

1. I think all of these characters have been raised to act and look a certain way. The society girls are all raised the same way and none of them really stick out or get attention for being different. These girls are all reaching the age in which they feel as though they're just doing what everyone wants them to do and they want to rebel against that to draw attention to themselves. Clara is a little ahead, as she has already rebelled and now she's trying to fit in ... for now. However, even with the change, they still have the same issues and until they solve all of those issues then appearance won't change anything - just mask problems and potentially make them worse.

 

2. Their actions may make them feel free temporarily, but as I stated before ... nothing will change until they take care of their problems. Freedom, to me, is being able to step up and face your issues, decide which direction you want to take, and being able to live with that. Once you're completely satisfied with your decisions and yourself, then you are truly free. Where we are in the story right now ... I don't think any of the characters are free.

 

I am loving Vixen so far and cannot wait to continue reading!

 

 

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Sarah-W
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

Hello, and welcome to the board! I agree that the book has some similarities to the 'posse' girl books that have been popular in recent years... but the 1920s setting really makes it fresh for me. I'm very interested in what happens to the characters... particularly because the stakes are so high.

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sarah_in_ca
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Registered: ‎09-28-2009

Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

Gloria, Clara, and Loraine are all very young, very young.  They are easily influenced by the society around them, and at this time it was prohibition, flappers, and speak-easies.  These girls are approximately 17 years old, with 2 of them in a uniform-wearing girls' school run by a strict head-master.  They read about the exciting times in the newspaper and long to be a part of it--young people will go to extreme lengths to experiences such things--just across town.  Gloria and Loraine have well-to-do parents, who trust their daughters to do no wrong.  clara has more experience, but longs for the life Gloria has...but not for long.   The girls change their looks to fit in to the flapper image because they think it's exciting.  They feel stiffled at home, at school, and don't want to do what all good girls of their time do.

 

Gloria doesn't want to end up with the same life and life-style as her unhappy mother.  She doesn't want to marry someone to save the family from misfortune.  Jerome offers her another world she was looking for. I find Gloria quite liberal in her thinking because she has no racial bias whatsoever and sees Jerome as an exciting man, not a black man.  Her whole being is open to change and life.  However, I find it difficult to believe a girl of 17 is ready for such decisions  and the consequences of such decisions. 

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librarysusie
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

 

How are you enjoying Vixen so far?

 

 

 I am enjoying it immensley!Its fun to see these three girls from their own perspective and from the others.

 

 

To start things off, I thought I would comment that I noticed two things in this first section of Vixen and I'm very interested in hearing what you might think about them:

 

1. Each of the characters seems to be trying to change their lives by manipulating their image. Gloria is a good girl interested in exploring the flapper lifestyle. Lorraine is her best friend who is jealous of Gloria and thinks she can get attention through a bad girl reputation and appearance. Then we have Clara who has a past living the high life as a flapper in New York City, but decides to adopt of the persona of 'Country Clara' when she comes to Chicago to help with Gloria's wedding. Why do you think each of these character is so interested in changing their looks? Do you think they are successful? Does changing their looks change their lives?

 

 

 I think Gloria is scared to become tied down with the man her parents have chosen more than she chose for herself. I think she wants to spread her wings before she is tied down and has to "become her mother"

 

I think Lorraine just wants to be the center of someone's/anyone's attention. She doesn't seem to have the dreams of becoming a wife that the other girls at her school do. But I think really its all she wants but she only wants it with Marcus.She however is making mistakes in this regard and I have a bad feeling she will end up in the same kind of trouble Clara found herself in.

 

 

I don't think at this point we know exactly what all happened to Clara in NY I think there is a lot more to her story. Its funny when the girls are talking about her and if they only knew who she was in NY they would be bowing at her feet and wanting to know all the dish. I do understand her need to be "Country Clara" but I have a feeling as time goes on she will find it harder and harder to keep up the act.

 

 

2. The other thing that really struck me about this first section of Vixen is Gloria's first meeting with Jerome, a black piano player at the Green Mill speakeasy."'You're here because you think it makes you free,'" he tells her. "'Unlike the rest of your little schoolgirl friends, sneaking out without Daddy's permission. Listening to the black man play his music and dirty your lily white hands... But you ain't free, kid. You wouldn't know how to be free if your life depended on it.'" I'm very interested in hearing about what you think regarding 'freedom' in this novel. Does sneaking off to a speakeasy, drinking illegal substances, or cutting one's hair make someone free? What constitutes freedom to you, and do any of the characters we've met so far have it?

 

No sneaking off to a speakeasy, drinking illegal substances, or cutting one's hair does not make you free it just makes you rebellious. None of these characters except maybe Marcus have freedom; they are all still dictated by their families. Clara tasted freedom but had to give it up and I think she is the one who realizes what "freedom" means. The other 2 girls are playing at freedom but as I said its really just rebellion.

 

What are your thoughts about the first section of Vixen? What are your predictions (no spoilers, please!) about what might happen next?

 

I am really enjoying getting to know these girls and I foresee some bad things happening I have a feeling Gloria's life is going to get very complicated. And I am so curious to hear just who is after Clara. And I have a feeling that Raine is going to self destruct is some way.

 

Ok must get back to this book! Can't seem to put it down!

 

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veronica1890
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I am really enjoying the books so far. I liked how Gloria snuck into that club in the beginning, it really shows us how far she is willing to go to change her lifestyle. Also she feels trapped being froced into marriage with Seabastion. Then there is clara. I think that they are trying so hard to change because they are tired and want to escape the daily problems that they face.

 

2. The other thing that really struck me about this first section of Vixen is Gloria's first meeting with Jerome, a black piano player at the Green Mill speakeasy."'You're here because you think it makes you free,'" he tells her. "'Unlike the rest of your little schoolgirl friends, sneaking out without Daddy's permission. Listening to the black man play his music and dirty your lily white hands... But you ain't free, kid. You wouldn't know how to be free if your life depended on it.'" I'm very interested in hearing about what you think regarding 'freedom' in this novel. Does sneaking off to a speakeasy, drinking illegal substances, or cutting one's hair make someone free? What constitutes freedom to you, and do any of the characters we've met so far have it?

 

In the book it made them feel free because it didnt conform to the rest of society. Freedom to me means being able to be myself. So far I dont think ive seen anyone.

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jhollon76
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I am only half way through the book but what I am seeing is that all 3 girls are wanting to be free or to change their lives on the outside, but what they need to truely be free is to change on the inside. None of the girls have the confidence to make the decisions in life to be happy, and that is where a person has to start.

I do think the book is very interesting. What a great new author. She has a talent to keep you wanting to know more, and to make you feel that you are part of the story. This was my first ARC and I was really excited. I am so glad that the book is as good as I had hoped. I will post more when I am finished.

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Sarah-W
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

 

Hello, and welcome to the board! I'm so glad you're enjoying the book. We'll be discussing the book here through the end of November, so feel free to join in whenever you would like!

jhollon76 wrote:

I am only half way through the book but what I am seeing is that all 3 girls are wanting to be free or to change their lives on the outside, but what they need to truely be free is to change on the inside. None of the girls have the confidence to make the decisions in life to be happy, and that is where a person has to start.

I do think the book is very interesting. What a great new author. She has a talent to keep you wanting to know more, and to make you feel that you are part of the story. This was my first ARC and I was really excited. I am so glad that the book is as good as I had hoped. I will post more when I am finished.


 

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Sarah-W
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy thru page 144

 

I'm very interested by your distinction between 'rebellion' and 'freedom.' You will have to let us know if your perspective on this changes by the end of the book.

librarysusie wrote:

 

No sneaking off to a speakeasy, drinking illegal substances, or cutting one's hair does not make you free it just makes you rebellious. None of these characters except maybe Marcus have freedom; they are all still dictated by their families. Clara tasted freedom but had to give it up and I think she is the one who realizes what "freedom" means. The other 2 girls are playing at freedom but as I said its really just rebellion.

  

 

 

Ok must get back to this book! Can't seem to put it down!

 


 

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hookedonbooks09
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I wondered if there was not much fleshing out of Bastian's character because he is meant to be portrayed as a rather pale, weak character.  More of a shadow character than one of the more animated ones. 

 

Just my impression of him!

 

B

 


 

. . . I would like to see more development with Bastian's character, though-- he typically pops up only as a mention in conversations, and as Gloria's fiance, I think he deserves a bit more screen time! ;D

 

I look forward to the rest of this book! :smileyhappy:


 

Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read. ~Groucho Marx
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Lilly_White
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

im probably very behind here but im having a lot of trouble getting into this book. every time i start to enjoy it the characters change and its a whole new tone. some books i can do that for - not this one. which is me personally, the author so far is very well writen, and its intersting, just slow moving for me. So sorry again for being so far behind.

 

as for the questions:

1) i dont think that gloria is actually trying to change her reputation as much as shes trying to experiance life a little until she cannot experiance anything other than marriage. So far Lorrane is trying to change her immage but just to stand out. and she's not standing out in a very good way. innocence seems to be key to fitting in, in this time and place and lorrane is trying to scream out for attention. negative or otherwize, she doesnt care as long as its attention. Clara, in my opinion is the only one actually trying to change her reputation. she is so afraid of being sent to boarding school that she'll do anything in order to make everyone belive that she is "country clara"

 

2)I dont think any of the characters are free as of yet. well, maybe marcus, i'm interstead to learn more about his lifestyle. Clara was free but only becuase she escaped from her parents. and then she abused her freedom, and is now basically chained up under lock and key. Lorrane is definately not free, although she does not seem to have the same rules as gloria does she is slaved to her own self. if she felt better about herself and stopped trying to one up gloria and show everyone that she was better than gloria, and started just being herself because thats what she wanted,  then she would be free. And Gloria, well, i think she's working on being free. She wants to be married, she wants to be in love, but she also wants to be a flapper. and if she can have both-why not try.

 

my predictions:

I can see Clara showing Gloria how to have the best of both worlds. I see them becoming very close and helping eachother live secret lives.

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jhollon76
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

Well I am on page 167 and am loving every page. I don't want to put the book down to go into work...lol. I have that problem with books, I get so into them that I don't wanna re enter real life. I am infatuated with Clara and Marcus's realationship and how he seems to make Clara feel young and foolish even though she seems to be more experienced than the other two girls. I can't wait to see if they end up together. I am worried about who and why is sending her these letters. Sometimes people do need a fresh start and deserve one. I too am annoyed by Loraine. She is not a very good friend to Gloria, and she seems spoiled and selfish. Gloria is a whole different story. To me she seems to be going down a scary path, and who know's what trouble this girl will get herself into, but I guess anything would be better than "Boring Bastian" lol. It will probably take me a lil longet to read the book than others because I work 40 +hrs a week, but I read it whenever I get a chance, and love having other book lovers to talk about it with. I do hope that Clara gets her new start though, and maybe it will be with Marcus. He seems so sexy but also sweet and dependable also. Its almost like he know's Clara is hiding a shady past, but could care less. He wants to be her knight in shining armor. Every woman longs for that.

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Airion1
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

Yeah I know about the period and what is happening in the world, but I have never read anything that takes place in the 20's so some of the lingo is confusing at times. Because this book is geared toward a younger auidence some sort of guide would be helpful. For example I had no idea what a bob was and just assumed it was the hairstlye of the girl on the cover.

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bibanon1
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Re: Vixen Discussion: Part I: Speak Easy through page 144

I have to say I don't think the cover does the book any favors.  It makes it look like a cheap teenaged romance novel.  I wish they had gone with something a little more stylized and simple.

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