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Inspired Wordsmith
Kreacherteacher
Posts: 1,234
Registered: ‎07-24-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

[ Edited ]

This got me thinking yesterday. I tried to post it then, but my computer was a miffed with me so he locked the posting portal. I suppose I made amends as I am able to post today.

 

Anywho, my thoughts yesterday went something like this...

 

What if someone had taken the polyjuice potion and was killed in that person's place, kinda like the scene from "The Seven Harry's" in DH, would their body revert back to its original state upon death, or would they remain as the person they were impersonating?

 

Say Draco polyjuiced Harry, and Voldy killed DracoHarry, do you think Voldy would know right away that it wasn't the real Harry?

 

I say Voldy would be pretty stupid to catch on to that, especially if HarryHarry kept it on the lowdown after his DracoHarry death.

 

Then I wondered if the person being impersonated could somehow sense their temporary-twin's death. That does seem pretty far-fetched I suppose, but the body does change during polyjuicing, doesn't it?

 

Finally, I wondered to myself if I were going to polyjuice someone, who would I juice and why? I am stuck on that question, but I shall return later to answer.

Message Edited by Kreacherteacher on 09-26-2008 06:32 PM
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Interesting questions, KreacherTeacher...

 

My guess is that after an hour, the polyjuice effect would stop whether or not the person was alive or dead.

 

I also doubt that a person would feel if he had a polyjuiced twin or not, as there is no cloning of the psychological state which would enable any kind of hypothetical ESP thing to happen...

 

But those are just my thoughts!


Kreacherteacher wrote:

This got me thinking yesterday. I tried to post it then, but my computer was a miffed with me so he locked the posting portal. I suppose I made amends as I am able to post today.

 

Anywho, my thoughts yesterday went something like this...

 

What if someone had taken the polyjuice potion and was killed in that person's place, kinda like the scene from "The Seven Harry's" in DH, would their body revert back to its original state upon death, or would they remain as the person they were impersonating?

 

Say Draco polyjuiced Harry, and Voldy killed DracoHarry, do you think Voldy would know right away that it wasn't the real Harry?

 

I say Voldy would be pretty stupid to catch on to that, especially if HarryHarry kept it on the lowdown after his DracoHarry death.

 

Then I wondered if the person being impersonated could somehow sense their temporary-twin's death. That does seem pretty far-fetched I suppose, but the body does change during polyjuicing, doesn't it?

 

Finally, I wondered to myself if I were going to polyjuice someone, who would I juice and why? I am stuck on that question, but I shall return later to answer.

Message Edited by Kreacherteacher on 09-26-2008 06:32 PM

 

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Mollywobbles
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Hi Kreacherteacher, glad to see you're still thinking about us.  Drop in on the alphabet round robin when you can!

 

If I remember correctly, Mrs. Crouch took PJ to get Barty out of Azkaban, she kept taking it until she died, but when they buried her, they thought they were burying Barty, so the PJ effect doesn't seem to cease at the time of death.  I think it's just a superficial change which wears off in the hour that Hermione described, so it's a good thing they buried Mrs.Crouch toute de suite. 

 

Because it appears to be only a superficial change in appearance, I doubt there would be any sympathetic vibrations if there was an injury to the genuine article.  For example, when the 7 Potter's left Privet drive, they had the scar, but I doubt they felt any pain in the scar when Voldemort was nearby. 

 

 Interesting question about what Voldemort would have thought if he had AKd one of the other Harrys. You would think with the mind link between the two of them, Voldey could have spotted the genuine Harry without any problem.  I know Voldemort feared possessing Harry because of the pain it had caused him in the MOM, but you'd think he could have risked it to suss out the original Harry when the gang left Privet Dr.  But no, he waited until the others had identified Harry by his signature move, then he swooped in.  I bet, since he was "blocking" the mind link, he might have thought he had gotten the real one and had a few moments of elation.  Voldey probably would have wanted to display his trophy however, and I bet he would have been some ticked off after an hour when it turned into the original person.

 

 


Kreacherteacher wrote:

This got me thinking yesterday. I tried to post it then, but my computer was a miffed with me so he locked the posting portal. I suppose I made amends as I am able to post today.

 

Anywho, my thoughts yesterday went something like this...

 

What if someone had taken the polyjuice potion and was killed in that person's place, kinda like the scene from "The Seven Harry's" in DH, would their body revert back to its original state upon death, or would they remain as the person they were impersonating?

 

Say Draco polyjuiced Harry, and Voldy killed DracoHarry, do you think Voldy would know right away that it wasn't the real Harry?

 

I say Voldy would be pretty stupid to catch on to that, especially if HarryHarry kept it on the lowdown after his DracoHarry death.

 

Then I wondered if the person being impersonated could somehow sense their temporary-twin's death. That does seem pretty far-fetched I suppose, but the body does change during polyjuicing, doesn't it?

 

Finally, I wondered to myself if I were going to polyjuice someone, who would I juice and why? I am stuck on that question, but I shall return later to answer.

Message Edited by Kreacherteacher on 09-26-2008 06:32 PM

 

Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
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Registered: ‎04-17-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Mollywobbles, I understood from the text that the Dementors buried Mrs. Crouch, and they are blind.  As a result, I don't think we can take that as an indication that the Polyjuice didn't wear off.
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Mollywobbles
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

I didn't necessarily think the Dementors buried Mrs. Crouch.  I know their blindness helped Barty and Mrs. Crouch do the switch.  Barty after drinking the veritasserum, says his mum was careful to drink PJ right until the end and "she was buried under my name and bearing my appearance".  Mind you, how Barty knew this, I don't know. LoL.  Barty had escaped before his Mum died, so how would he know who she looked like?  While we have no text to support this, wouldn't it be likely that if a prisoner died in Azkaban, next of kin was invited to attend the burial?  Or, perhaps a Ministry official (a coroner type position) would have to complete some paperwork to certify the death, if for no other reason that keeping the records straight and simplifying wills? Just a thought.

 


Psychee wrote:
Mollywobbles, I understood from the text that the Dementors buried Mrs. Crouch, and they are blind.  As a result, I don't think we can take that as an indication that the Polyjuice didn't wear off.

 

Inspired Wordsmith
Kreacherteacher
Posts: 1,234
Registered: ‎07-24-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Thanks for the info. I had forgotten about the Crouch family so that helped reel my thoughts in. As far as the round robin thread, I don't know if I could compete anymore there. I checked it out one day, and I can't figure out how you guys know if it's already been posted. Sorry, my head was spinning. If there's a trick, let me know. :-)

 

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Mollywobbles
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

No trick, Kreacherteacher, you just have to keep a running alphabetical list of words/names etc. that have been used. It does get a little tricky, because sometimes a name will be used under the surname, other times under the given name.  There are also some oddball things in the really difficult letters (Q,X,Y,Z) where the Z may be the second or third letter in the word.  I guess it would be a little difficult to start up at this point.  I think we're on about our 20th round (not sure but something like that) and even the N's, I's and O's are getting difficult.


Kreacherteacher wrote:

Thanks for the info. I had forgotten about the Crouch family so that helped reel my thoughts in. As far as the round robin thread, I don't know if I could compete anymore there. I checked it out one day, and I can't figure out how you guys know if it's already been posted. Sorry, my head was spinning. If there's a trick, let me know. :-)

 


 

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Stewies_Mom
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Registered: ‎05-28-2008
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

First of all, thanks to MrsRW for exhuming some older threads.  I didn't know what the reaction would be if I did it and was afraid to upset the flow of thoughts, but I'm glad someone led the way!  I really enjoy revisiting the older threads.

 

In regards to Draco Malfoy: Dope or Dupe?, I vote for dope.  I read through a few posts and I agree with the poster (I forgot who it was, sorry!) who felt that (paraphrasing here) Draco was a bully who enjoyed a comfortable, pampered lifestyle.  I couldn't agree more.  I don't think that Draco had a real clue in the earlier books.  He was a bully because his dad was a bully.  He was just a little pampered boy who had bad role models.  His only real role model (from a baby until he went to school, anyway) was his father.  I think his father was a real piece of work.  A real sleazy, slimy kind of guy who felt he was above reproach.  If that was my only role model, how could I not think that I had the "right" idea about the way things should be? 

I do think that by HBP, however, Draco had matured enough and had seen and experienced enough different points of view that he knew he was in over his head.  I don't think his decision to join the DE was really a choice.  If I remember correctly, Draco's inclusion as a DE and his instructions by Voldemort to kill Dumbledore, were in retribution for his fathers' failings.  I remember him crying in the restrooms about not being able to figure out a way to carry out his task.  At the beginning of book 7, the entire family seemed uncomfortable with their guest.  By the time the story ended, Draco was sitting at a table with his parents in the great hall.  Perhaps, they, too, realized that they were disposable to Voldemort, and Volemorts' lack of repect for anyone (including his faithful servants) gave them a much needed wake-up call.  I'd say that qualifies the whole trio as dopes. 

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Psychee
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Stewies_Mom, feel free to resurrect any of the older threads.  If it isn't locked, it's fair game!
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ConnieAnnKirk
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Registered: ‎06-14-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.


Stewies_Mom wrote, in part:

 

First of all, thanks to MrsRW for exhuming some older threads.  I didn't know what the reaction would be if I did it and was afraid to upset the flow of thoughts, but I'm glad someone led the way!  I really enjoy revisiting the older threads.

 


SM:  Please feel free to bring back older threads any time you're interested in them!  It will be especially fruitful now, I should think, as we all get ready to see HP6.

 

EnJOY!

~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
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Kat-NE
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

I don't think that Draco was necessarily "evil".  I think that he tried to do what his parents wanted him to do, and he made some bad decisions.  OK, several bad decisions.  In the beginning, he was always trying to use his family name to bully others and come out on top, much like his father did.  I think he was kind of a coward.  He wouldn't bully others unless he had several larger friends by his side and ran when he was on his own (like the time in the Forbidden Forest).  I think, towards the end, after his father lost respect from his fellow Death Eaters and society as a whole, he didn't want to be on Voldemort's side, but he couldn't get out of it because it would have threatened his family, that's why he tried to kill Dumbledore.  I'm glad that his character was allowed the chance to grow and we got to see the reasons behind his actions. 

 

I'm happy with the Harry/Draco ending.  After Voldemort was killed and no war, there was no reason for them to hate each other anymore.  I think after everything Harry went through with Voldemort and leaving school, the animosity they felt for each other kind of died.

 

As for picking between Draco and Dudley, if we are going for which one would you rather have as an enemy, I would pick Dudley, Draco does have a wand ya know.

 

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Mollywobbles
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

It's difficult for me to muster much sympathy for Draco.  If we think of Voldemort as evil, why not Draco?  Sure Draco got in over his head, but Voldey and Draco share certain qualities.  They were both bullies, both were into controlling people, both gathered cronies around them, Voldemort actually killed people, but Draco was eager to see Buckbeak killed (an early sign?) both were into trickery and coersion to get what they wanted, both abused positions of power..I could go on.  While in no way am I making excuses for Voldemort, he had a much harder start in life than Draco did.  Draco chose to associate himself with the dark side and the fact that he bit off a lot more than he could chew and put his family in jeopardy doesn't make me feel terribly sorry for him.  Regulus Black was raised with a similar background to Draco Malfoy, and also got in over his head, but Regulus made an incredible sacrifice at the end.  The only redeeming things that Draco seemed to do were 1. having some concern for Crabbe or Goyle (never can keep those two straight) when caught up in the Fiendfyre, and 2. he did try to avoid identifying Harry when the kids were captured and taken to Malfoy manor.  Why should we feel anymore compassion for for a 17 year old Draco than we do for a 17 year old Tom Riddle? 
Kat-NE wrote:

I don't think that Draco was necessarily "evil".  I think that he tried to do what his parents wanted him to do, and he made some bad decisions.  OK, several bad decisions.  In the beginning, he was always trying to use his family name to bully others and come out on top, much like his father did.  I think he was kind of a coward.  He wouldn't bully others unless he had several larger friends by his side and ran when he was on his own (like the time in the Forbidden Forest).  I think, towards the end, after his father lost respect from his fellow Death Eaters and society as a whole, he didn't want to be on Voldemort's side, but he couldn't get out of it because it would have threatened his family, that's why he tried to kill Dumbledore.  I'm glad that his character was allowed the chance to grow and we got to see the reasons behind his actions. 

 

I'm happy with the Harry/Draco ending.  After Voldemort was killed and no war, there was no reason for them to hate each other anymore.  I think after everything Harry went through with Voldemort and leaving school, the animosity they felt for each other kind of died.

 

As for picking between Draco and Dudley, if we are going for which one would you rather have as an enemy, I would pick Dudley, Draco does have a wand ya know.

 


 

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Stewies_Mom
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Mollywobbles, I'm sorry to disagree with you, but the 17-year old Voldemort was evil.  Heck, he was evil at the age of 11!  To clasify Draco as evil, just because he is a bully and shares some of the same traits (controlling people, gathering cronies around himself, trickery, etc.) as Voldemort just proves that he is a bully, but it seems a bit of a stretch to clasify him as evil.  Draco was a product of his parents beliefs. 

 

Your post made me think that your position is that the Malfoy family's trouble was because of Dracos actions.  I think that Dracos trouble was a result of the entire Malfoy family's actions.  Don't get the wrong idea, I do not think "poor Draco"; he was not a kind or generous person, just a misguided one.  However, I do not think his actions would qualify him as evil.  (I can't say the same about Lucious.) 

 

We should consider compassion towards Draco, because he did seem to have a change of heart in DH.  I am not suggesting that he was spurned to become a valiant hero, or anything, but he did change.  I believe (okay, maybe I want to believe) that Narcissa and Lucious may have changed, as well.  Draco's curt nod to Harry at the King's Cross in the epilogue of DH leads me to believe that although he and Harry never become chums, they did at least make peace with their past and let go of their grudges.  I can't believe that the adult Harry would have left Draco to his evil ways, if he was, indeed, evil. (afterall, doesn't Harry eventually head the Auror's dept.?)


Mollywobbles wrote:
It's difficult for me to muster much sympathy for Draco.  If we think of Voldemort as evil, why not Draco?  Sure Draco got in over his head, but Voldey and Draco share certain qualities.  They were both bullies, both were into controlling people, both gathered cronies around them, Voldemort actually killed people, but Draco was eager to see Buckbeak killed (an early sign?) both were into trickery and coersion to get what they wanted, both abused positions of power..I could go on.  While in no way am I making excuses for Voldemort, he had a much harder start in life than Draco did.  Draco chose to associate himself with the dark side and the fact that he bit off a lot more than he could chew and put his family in jeopardy doesn't make me feel terribly sorry for him.  Regulus Black was raised with a similar background to Draco Malfoy, and also got in over his head, but Regulus made an incredible sacrifice at the end.  The only redeeming things that Draco seemed to do were 1. having some concern for Crabbe or Goyle (never can keep those two straight) when caught up in the Fiendfyre, and 2. he did try to avoid identifying Harry when the kids were captured and taken to Malfoy manor.  Why should we feel anymore compassion for for a 17 year old Draco than we do for a 17 year old Tom Riddle? 
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Mollywobbles
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Don't worry about disagreeing Stewies_Mom, it's what makes this board so interesting!

 

It is difficult to fully compare Draco with Voldemort because we only see young Draco, whereas we see young and adult Voldemorts and know what the latter became, which I agree is completely evil.  But what distinguishes Draco and Riddle at the same ages?  Tom bullies the kids in the orphanage, Draco bullies kids at Hogwarts-both are concerned with power-both seem to have a taste for blood.

 

I think Draco did cause the severe problems for his family by voluntarily joining the Death Eaters.  He was inclined that way beause of Lucius' involvement and the kind of "pure-blood" upbringing he had, but he nonetheless took the step to join Voldemort all on his own-mostly I think because he was humiliated by the fact that daddy dearest had been tossed in Azkaban. He also seemed to long for the cachet that becoming a Death Eater brought him with his buddies.

 

I don't know that had Draco not been so thoroughly frightened by the events which transpired because of his actions, including being responsible for Dumbledore's death, that he would have changed his ways much.  In that sense, Draco was lucky-he got "scared straight".  

 

 


Stewies_Mom wrote:

Mollywobbles, I'm sorry to disagree with you, but the 17-year old Voldemort was evil.  Heck, he was evil at the age of 11!  To clasify Draco as evil, just because he is a bully and shares some of the same traits (controlling people, gathering cronies around himself, trickery, etc.) as Voldemort just proves that he is a bully, but it seems a bit of a stretch to clasify him as evil.  Draco was a product of his parents beliefs. 

 

Your post made me think that your position is that the Malfoy family's trouble was because of Dracos actions.  I think that Dracos trouble was a result of the entire Malfoy family's actions.  Don't get the wrong idea, I do not think "poor Draco"; he was not a kind or generous person, just a misguided one.  However, I do not think his actions would qualify him as evil.  (I can't say the same about Lucious.) 

 

We should consider compassion towards Draco, because he did seem to have a change of heart in DH.  I am not suggesting that he was spurned to become a valiant hero, or anything, but he did change.  I believe (okay, maybe I want to believe) that Narcissa and Lucious may have changed, as well.  Draco's curt nod to Harry at the King's Cross in the epilogue of DH leads me to believe that although he and Harry never become chums, they did at least make peace with their past and let go of their grudges.  I can't believe that the adult Harry would have left Draco to his evil ways, if he was, indeed, evil. (afterall, doesn't Harry eventually head the Auror's dept.?)


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Stewies_Mom
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Mollywobbles, I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that Draco had no choice in the joining of the DE.  The text in HBP does lead one to understand that Draco has replaced his father as a DE.  This suggests, to me, that Draco had no choice, he was chosen.  I'm not buying the idea that he caused the family's problems.  Lucius(sorry for the earlier spelling error), the family member who seemed the most "evil" and in Voldemorts' good graces early on, blew it big time at the MoM in OotP.  His error was what caused him to go to Azkaban and caused Draco to be named as his replacement.  Draco certainly felt smug and superior for this inclusion at the beginning of HBP, but by the middle of the book, his bravado has failed and his is shown for the scared boy that he is.  I am just not convinced that he caused the family problems, they caused the problems and he is part of the family!


Mollywobbles wrote:

Don't worry about disagreeing Stewies_Mom, it's what makes this board so interesting!

 

It is difficult to fully compare Draco with Voldemort because we only see young Draco, whereas we see young and adult Voldemorts and know what the latter became, which I agree is completely evil.  But what distinguishes Draco and Riddle at the same ages?  Tom bullies the kids in the orphanage, Draco bullies kids at Hogwarts-both are concerned with power-both seem to have a taste for blood.

 

I think Draco did cause the severe problems for his family by voluntarily joining the Death Eaters.  He was inclined that way beause of Lucius' involvement and the kind of "pure-blood" upbringing he had, but he nonetheless took the step to join Voldemort all on his own-mostly I think because he was humiliated by the fact that daddy dearest had been tossed in Azkaban. He also seemed to long for the cachet that becoming a Death Eater brought him with his buddies.

 

I don't know that had Draco not been so thoroughly frightened by the events which transpired because of his actions, including being responsible for Dumbledore's death, that he would have changed his ways much.  In that sense, Draco was lucky-he got "scared straight".  

 


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Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

I get a different impression from the text Stewies_Mom.  In the Slug Club chapter of HPB, when Harry under the invisibility cloak, is eavesdropping on Draco and the other Slytherins on the train, Draco is hinting that he may have more important things to do than finish his education, that he may be joining "HIM".  Now this could just be simply teenage bravado, but it doesn't suggest coersion at all.  Draco I think has already volunteered, but can't keep the secret to himself, he has to give little hints to his Slytherin pals.  I believe we find out later in HPB that Draco has been learning tricks from Aunt Bella-like Occlumency-and this had to have happened during the summer break.  So why would Draco be seeking out info and assistance from Aunt Bella if he hadn't planned on signing up with the dark side?

 

Perhaps you're thinking of the Spinner's End chapter, when Narcissa and Bella and Snape are speaking of the task that Voldemort has chosen Draco to perform.  But how do we know which came first, Draco volunteering, or Voldemort assigning him the task. Was it eagerness on the part of Draco to assume Lucius' place, or Voldemort's intent to punish Lucius by assigning his son an impossible task..I'm not sure we can pin this down.

 

I think it's possible the answer lies somewhere in between.  Draco was in a snit because of Lucius' imprisonment and was eager to hit back, and Voldemort was in a snit because of Lucius' failure and lured Draco into volunteering.

 

I'm still interested, though, in how you distinguish degrees of evil in young Riddle and young Draco at the same age-say 16/17.  Why is Riddle evil and Draco , what, misguided? 

 

 


Stewies_Mom wrote:

Mollywobbles, I may be wrong, but I am pretty sure that Draco had no choice in the joining of the DE.  The text in HBP does lead one to understand that Draco has replaced his father as a DE.  This suggests, to me, that Draco had no choice, he was chosen.  I'm not buying the idea that he caused the family's problems.  Lucius(sorry for the earlier spelling error), the family member who seemed the most "evil" and in Voldemorts' good graces early on, blew it big time at the MoM in OotP.  His error was what caused him to go to Azkaban and caused Draco to be named as his replacement.  Draco certainly felt smug and superior for this inclusion at the beginning of HBP, but by the middle of the book, his bravado has failed and his is shown for the scared boy that he is.  I am just not convinced that he caused the family problems, they caused the problems and he is part of the family!


Mollywobbles wrote:

Don't worry about disagreeing Stewies_Mom, it's what makes this board so interesting!

 

It is difficult to fully compare Draco with Voldemort because we only see young Draco, whereas we see young and adult Voldemorts and know what the latter became, which I agree is completely evil.  But what distinguishes Draco and Riddle at the same ages?  Tom bullies the kids in the orphanage, Draco bullies kids at Hogwarts-both are concerned with power-both seem to have a taste for blood.

 

I think Draco did cause the severe problems for his family by voluntarily joining the Death Eaters.  He was inclined that way beause of Lucius' involvement and the kind of "pure-blood" upbringing he had, but he nonetheless took the step to join Voldemort all on his own-mostly I think because he was humiliated by the fact that daddy dearest had been tossed in Azkaban. He also seemed to long for the cachet that becoming a Death Eater brought him with his buddies.

 

I don't know that had Draco not been so thoroughly frightened by the events which transpired because of his actions, including being responsible for Dumbledore's death, that he would have changed his ways much.  In that sense, Draco was lucky-he got "scared straight".  

 



 

Frequent Contributor
matrim
Posts: 79
Registered: ‎05-12-2009

Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

It's interesting to compare Draco with Voldy as they shared similar qualities on the surface. 

However, there were differences between them, big ones.

 

First, the bully issue. I think we'd better exclude the period when Voldy became a Hogwarts 

student. In the orphanage he was undoubtedly a bully whereas in Hogwarts he turned into a 

"model" student: handsome, modest, top of every class and the favorite of almost all the 

teachers (except DD). Though he caused Moaning Myrtle's death and committed murder but they 

remained undetected. It's hard to believe, therefore, that he was a bully then. Back to the

orphanage, Voldy bullied the children for the sake of control and brought about real damage

to them (the two children he frightened were never right again) which indicated cruelty. 

Draco did it to show his superiority of pureblood and wealth. He mainly used verbal insults 

instead of curses which would induce more harm (as I remember, other than against Harry, the

only curse he used was the leg locker curse on Neville). As a bully, Draco was not much worse

than James.

 

Second, the thirst for power. Voldy consciously planed to gather a group of students around 

him who were the forerunner of Death Eaters which showed his lust for power and extraordinary 

leadership. As for Draco, it's a totally different story. Besides his constant show-off of his family's connection with ministry, I see no real plan he had made to obtain power,

 and apart from Crabbe and Goyle, no other Slytherins would readily take his order which was 

an evidence that he had no genuine thirst for power and no capacity to get it. Come to think 

of it, I think he was even no rival to young DD on ambition.  

 

I suppose the essential distinction between Draco and Voldy was that there still existed love 

and compassion, however minimal, in Draco whereas in Voldy, there's none. Otherwise, it would 

be difficult to believe that only by being scared thoroughly could he cared about his family, 

Crabbe and Goyle's safety and was reluctant to identify Harry in Malfoy Manor. And I agree 

with Psychee that Draco stayed in Hogwarts to avoid being close to Voldy in the battle rather 

than to catch Harry. If he really wanted Harry captured, why wouldn't he identify the trio in 

Malfoy Manor? That would be a much easier way which could also free his family from humiliation. 

His true motive was to get away from Voldy as long as possible and kept Crabbe and Goyle as 

company would be a perfect coverup. DD's remark implied JKR's attitude towards Draco: "The 

boy's soul is not yet so damaged." His inability to kill DD and reluctance to torture others 

explained a lot of his nature: he wasn't a killer and nor did he had the making of a real Death Eater who wouldn't hesitate to kill and torture others. 

Probably that's why he was spared by JKR in the end and got no punishment.

 

All in all, I feel Draco was depicted as a pitiful and troublesome snob of pureblood but had

no idea of the appalling reality of the dark power. His remaining conscience kept him from 

completely falling into the dark side but his cowardice and prejudice also discouraged him 

from joining the right side, which left him in a rather awkward position. 


Mollywobbles wrote:
It's difficult for me to muster much sympathy for Draco.  If we think of Voldemort as evil, why not Draco?  Sure Draco got in over his head, but Voldey and Draco share certain qualities.  They were both bullies, both were into controlling people, both gathered cronies around them, Voldemort actually killed people, but Draco was eager to see Buckbeak killed (an early sign?) both were into trickery and coersion to get what they wanted, both abused positions of power..I could go on.  While in no way am I making excuses for Voldemort, he had a much harder start in life than Draco did.  Draco chose to associate himself with the dark side and the fact that he bit off a lot more than he could chew and put his family in jeopardy doesn't make me feel terribly sorry for him.  Regulus Black was raised with a similar background to Draco Malfoy, and also got in over his head, but Regulus made an incredible sacrifice at the end.  The only redeeming things that Draco seemed to do were 1. having some concern for Crabbe or Goyle (never can keep those two straight) when caught up in the Fiendfyre, and 2. he did try to avoid identifying Harry when the kids were captured and taken to Malfoy manor.  Why should we feel anymore compassion for for a 17 year old Draco than we do for a 17 year old Tom Riddle? 
Frequent Contributor
matrim
Posts: 79
Registered: ‎05-12-2009
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

Sorry about the format. :smileysad:Due to my pathetic typing speed and the length of my reply, I pasted it from a word document. Could someone help me to fix it?
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

I've had that problem myself from time to time... Connie might be able to fix it, but it's no big deal! 

 

Nice analysis!

 


matrim wrote:
Sorry about the format. :smileysad:Due to my pathetic typing speed and the length of my reply, I pasted it from a word document. Could someone help me to fix it?

 

Frequent Contributor
matrim
Posts: 79
Registered: ‎05-12-2009
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Re: Draco Malfoy, dupe, or dope.

[ Edited ]

Thanks, Psychee!

 

Off topic...

In China, quite some HP fans-presumably teenagers- swarm the boards to acclaim how cool and stylish Draco was. I suspect they are more referring to the Draco in the movies than  the one in the books. I wonder if it's the same here?


Psychee wrote:

I've had that problem myself from time to time... Connie might be able to fix it, but it's no big deal! 

 

Nice analysis!

 


 

Message Edited by matrim on 06-19-2009 08:12 AM