Since 1997, you’ve been coming to BarnesandNoble.com to discuss everything from Stephen King to writing to Harry Potter. You’ve made our site more than a place to discover your next book: you’ve made it a community. But like all things internet, BN.com is growing and changing. We've said goodbye to our community message boards—but that doesn’t mean we won’t still be a place for adventurous readers to connect and discover.

Now, you can explore the most exciting new titles (and remember the classics) at the Barnes & Noble Book Blog. Check out conversations with authors like Jeff VanderMeer and Gary Shteyngart at the B&N Review, and browse write-ups of the best in literary fiction. Come to our Facebook page to weigh in on what it means to be a book nerd. Browse digital deals on the NOOK blog, tweet about books with us,or self-publish your latest novella with NOOK Press. And for those of you looking for support for your NOOK, the NOOK Support Forums will still be here.

We will continue to provide you with books that make you turn pages well past midnight, discover new worlds, and reunite with old friends. And we hope that you’ll continue to tell us how you’re doing, what you’re reading, and what books mean to you.

Reply
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



Auror_in_Training wrote:
Now, if you poisoned the Master of the Elder Wand and stole the wand out from under him as he was dying, that would be a defeat, too. But, if you waited until he was dead to take his wand, you would not become the new Master of the Elder Wand because you waited too long to take it... -- Psychee


I don't think that is completely accurate Psychee, in the tales of beetle the bard the wand master was killed in his sleep and the guy took the wand and was master because he'd killed the first guy




The thief first took the wand and then, for good measure, slit the eldest brother's throat. The brother had let down his guard as he "lay wine sodden upon his bed", or something like that...

In any case, the order of taking the wand first and killing the person later is important.
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



macross wrote:
Here is a question. Waht happend to Fluers sister?




The guests at the wedding were all able to escape without injury, so, presumably, Fleur's sister is still in France attending school.
Frequent Contributor
mrsronaldweasley
Posts: 3,373
Registered: ‎07-26-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Okay, who can explain to me this (who else)

The pensieve. If I have one, and I put a memory in it do I:

Forget about that memory>?
Or is a pensieve device for wizards to literally look into their thoughts and review it?
Right?

I was wondering. If dd left the pensieve to ss, then snape could’ve easily looked into the pensieve and knew all of dd’s secrets.
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



mrsronaldweasley wrote:
Okay, who can explain to me this (who else)

The pensieve. If I have one, and I put a memory in it do I:

Forget about that memory>?
Or is a pensieve device for wizards to literally look into their thoughts and review it?
Right?

I was wondering. If dd left the pensieve to ss, then snape couldâ  ve easily looked into the pensieve and knew all of ddâ  s secrets.




One consciously puts specific memories into the Pensieve.

But the question about what remains in your head of those memories is difficult because we have potentially contradictory evidence. When Snape put his secret memories into the Pensieve to protect them from accident exposure to Harry during his occlumency lessons, we are left to presume that those memories are no longer in his head, or why would he bother?

On the other side of the issue is the case of Slughorn... he gave his memory threads up twice, once in amended form, and then again in pure form. His first sample was never returned to him, so we have to presume that when he gave his first memories, he retained a pure copy in his head.

So, that leads me to believe that the spell used to get the memories out comes in two forms -- one form only yields a copy of the memory (which can be seen in the Pensieve) and the second form takes the entire memory out (which also can be seen in the Pensieve).

But memories in the Pensieve can also be returned to one's brain. I gather that from Snape's use of it -- for we saw the extracted schoolyard memory twice and in his case, we know that the first time he put it in the Pensieve he extracted the whole memory. So, he must have put it back in his head, right?

I think Dumbledore would have only put copies of his memories in the Pensieve, as it would be rather dangerous for him to ever go around with amnesia for stuff he has placed there. The purpose of putting copies of memories in there would just be so that he could review them in a more thorough fashion, seeing aspects that he missed while he was living those episodes in his life.

I really doubt that Dumbledore left his memories lying about when he died. The only reason Harry was able to intrude on his memories was because Dumbledore had been interrupted as he was using the Pensieve; he failed to secure the Pensieve during the distraction.
Distinguished Correspondent
Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Yikes, a person doesn't check the board for a mere 24 hours and has to scramble to catch up.

Every time I think I have the whole hallows thing figured out, something else crops up. Oh well.

Dumbledore may not have intended Harry to unite the hallows, but he knew Harry had the cloak, he bequeathed him the snitch/stone hallow, and he, himself was in possession of the elder wand. A pretty close association, given that he was tutoring Harry. As you know, I distrust Dumbledore's manipulative side now, and I'm not so sure Dumbledore didn't envisage Harry coming into possession, or mastery of all the hallows. Just because Dumbledore misued the hallows to try to conquer death, didn't mean Harry would. Dumbledore, again the manipulator, didn't entrust Snape with the information, apparently, that his wand was the Elder Wand of legend. So how was Snape supposed to know he was supposed to take it? If Dumbledore had confided this bit of intel to Snape, Snape could have either done an Accio Dumbledore's wand during the flight from the tower with Draco, or later, when Snape was Headmaster, have removed the wand from Dumbledore's tomb. In the Snape pensieve memories, when Snape is going on about how Dumbledore confides more in Harry, and then Dumbledore tells him that Harry must die, if Dumbledore had only mentioned in some fashion, the significance of the wand, Snape could have easily taken the Elder Wand from Draco, before or after AKing Dumbledore.

Sorry, I feel a Dumbledore rant coming on again, I'll get off that track. I think it is possible that Dumbledore did envisage Harry uniting the Hallows, but thought that Harry was the better man who would use the hallows more cautiously.



Psychee wrote:


Mollywobbles wrote:
Right again, Psychee. I just read the line again, in King's Cross, and it says Dumbledore had intended for Snape to "end up" with the Elder Wand. Do you think Dumbledore intended for Harry to unite the hallows? He seems to imply it near the end of that chapter. "You are the worthy possessor of the hallows"...You are the true master of death." So, if Dumbledore thought Harry could become the master of death he would have had to conquer the wand in some way. If Snape had merely ended up with the Elder Wand, how would Harry become its master? Voldey takes the wand from Dumbledore's tomb, but isn't its master, by pure happenstance. Since Dumbledore had talked Snape into killing him, even though he was dying already, wouldn't that have made Snape the master of the elder wand if Draco hadn't gotten there first? I'm really confused now.






Snape's AK of Dumbledore at Dumbledore's request was not a "defeat" of Dumbledore, consequently, even if Draco had not entered into the picture mucking things up, Mastery of the wand would not have gone to Snape via that act. Dumbledore would have died undefeated, and since no one could then defeat the Master, he would have been its very last Master.

Dumbledore never intended for Harry to be Master of all three Hallows, as it was a fool's quest, and didn't lead to immortality as he had once thought. He always intended for the Elder wand's power to be neutralized at the time of his death. He DID want Harry to have use of the Stone to call his parents for emotional support as he walked to his death, though, and he knew that Harry already had the cloak. AND, he also wanted Harry to understand the power of the wand, as he knew that Voldemort would search for it. He needed to understand about the wand, but not seek it....


Distinguished Correspondent
Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Fair point, Auror, the ring/horcrux curse was an all purpose curse, not directed at Dumbledore, so it wouldn't count.



Auror_in_Training wrote:
If DD had died as a result of the curse on the horcrux ring it would have been of his own doing, that curse wasn't intended for DD it was a random curse thrown out there for anyone who put the ring on. To defeat someone you have to intend to inflict defeat.






Mollywobbles wrote:
Interesting. So if Dumbledore had just died as a result of the curse on the horcrux ring, would that have counted as a "defeat" since the curse had been put on by Voldemort? If Grindelwald could become the master of the wand by mere theft, wouldn't a curse work too?





Psychee wrote:


Mollywobbles wrote:
Right again, Psychee. I just read the line again, in King's Cross, and it says Dumbledore had intended for Snape to "end up" with the Elder Wand. Do you think Dumbledore intended for Harry to unite the hallows? He seems to imply it near the end of that chapter. "You are the worthy possessor of the hallows"...You are the true master of death." So, if Dumbledore thought Harry could become the master of death he would have had to conquer the wand in some way. If Snape had merely ended up with the Elder Wand, how would Harry become its master? Voldey takes the wand from Dumbledore's tomb, but isn't its master, by pure happenstance. Since Dumbledore had talked Snape into killing him, even though he was dying already, wouldn't that have made Snape the master of the elder wand if Draco hadn't gotten there first? I'm really confused now.






Snape's AK of Dumbledore at Dumbledore's request was not a "defeat" of Dumbledore, consequently, even if Draco had not entered into the picture mucking things up, Mastery of the wand would not have gone to Snape via that act. Dumbledore would have died undefeated, and since no one could then defeat the Master, he would have been its very last Master.

Dumbledore never intended for Harry to be Master of all three Hallows, as it was a fool's quest, and didn't lead to immortality as he had once thought. He always intended for the Elder wand's power to be neutralized at the time of his death. He DID want Harry to have use of the Stone to call his parents for emotional support as he walked to his death, though, and he knew that Harry already had the cloak. AND, he also wanted Harry to understand the power of the wand, as he knew that Voldemort would search for it. He needed to understand about the wand, but not seek it....








Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Mollywobbles, that was the whole purpose of asking Snape to kill him -- it was the only way to insure that the wand's power would be neutralized. Dumbledore didn't trust anyone with the power of the wand, not Snape and not Harry.

On the other hand, he knew that Voldemort would eventually figure out that it was, in fact, the Elder Wand that he had been using all those years, and because Snape had killed him, it would LOOK like Snape had won mastery of it, when in fact, he never did.
Distinguished Correspondent
Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

So, the only person Dumbledore figured was smart enough to figure out the wand thing was Voldemort? The guy who fractured his soul, the guy who didn't believe in the power of love? Only Voldemort, evil incarnate in the wizarding world, would understand the significance of the wand? All the more reason to do something different with the stick of death. I know Dumbledore understood that to neutralize the power of the wand, the owner had to die a natural death. It still seems like a huge risk to hope that Snape would end up in possession of the wand, and trust that Snape was too dumb to realize its significance.



Psychee wrote:
Mollywobbles, that was the whole purpose of asking Snape to kill him -- it was the only way to insure that the wand's power would be neutralized. Dumbledore didn't trust anyone with the power of the wand, not Snape and not Harry.

On the other hand, he knew that Voldemort would eventually figure out that it was, in fact, the Elder Wand that he had been using all those years, and because Snape had killed him, it would LOOK like Snape had won mastery of it, when in fact, he never did.


Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

[ Edited ]

Mollywobbles wrote:
So, the only person Dumbledore figured was smart enough to figure out the wand thing was Voldemort? The guy who fractured his soul, the guy who didn't believe in the power of love? Only Voldemort, evil incarnate in the wizarding world, would understand the significance of the wand? All the more reason to do something different with the stick of death. I know Dumbledore understood that to neutralize the power of the wand, the owner had to die a natural death. It still seems like a huge risk to hope that Snape would end up in possession of the wand, and trust that Snape was too dumb to realize its significance.



Psychee wrote:
Mollywobbles, that was the whole purpose of asking Snape to kill him -- it was the only way to insure that the wand's power would be neutralized. Dumbledore didn't trust anyone with the power of the wand, not Snape and not Harry.

On the other hand, he knew that Voldemort would eventually figure out that it was, in fact, the Elder Wand that he had been using all those years, and because Snape had killed him, it would LOOK like Snape had won mastery of it, when in fact, he never did.







No one knew that Dumbledore had it. No one knew that Grindelwald had it. The last person who admitted having had it was Gregorovitch, who never knew the identity of the boy who stole it. The only people who were interested in it were those on the "quest", and they all thought the track had gone cold...

Dumbledore knew, though, that Voldemort had been stumped by the fact that his wand was useless against Harry. He knew that Voldemort would go to a wandmaker and demand something better, and the only thing better was this legendary Elder Wand. Dumbledore knew that wandmakers would know of Gregorovitch's claim, and he knew that Voldemort would turn the world upside down to follow the clues from there, just so that he could kill Harry with that wand. So, yes, Voldemort was the only person whose motivation for the wand and willingness to do anything to get the wand would figure things out.

I'm not sure what you would have had Dumbledore do with the wand, pother than what he had tried to do. He couldn't destroy the wand and even if he could, he needed it right up until the time of his death, didn't he?

Message Edited by Psychee on 11-13-2007 06:51 PM
Frequent Contributor
allenctynimrod
Posts: 614
Registered: ‎05-07-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Wow Psychee this is like flash backs to your and my discussion on the Elder Wand right after we finished the book. I guess my only question to all of it would be if Draco hadn't messed everything up would the power have died with Snape really? I know DD had planned that he should be killed by Snape but not "defeated" so that the Elder Wands run would end but what if DD was wrong? It's just one of those odd little things I thought of.

Also as for DD getting all of the Hallows to Harry I seriously think that the main reason he left the Resurrection Stone to Harry was so that when Harry "sacrificed" himself as DD had conditioned him to do he could at least speak to his parents and such before hand to get reassurance (even if it was false). I think DD knowing Harry as well as he does knew this would help and fully expected Harry to die so that someone else could kill LV later on. The only thing (in my opinion as I have made known on here several times) that upended DD's plan was the fact that Harry was the Master of the Elder Wand and therefore could not be killed in a duel by anyone, LV included. That's also my reasoning on why the curse at the end rebounded on LV but I know several other people see that differently.
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



allenctynimrod wrote:
Wow Psychee this is like flash backs to your and my discussion on the Elder Wand right after we finished the book. I guess my only question to all of it would be if Draco hadn't messed everything up would the power have died with Snape really? I know DD had planned that he should be killed by Snape but not "defeated" so that the Elder Wands run would end but what if DD was wrong? It's just one of those odd little things I thought of.

Also as for DD getting all of the Hallows to Harry I seriously think that the main reason he left the Resurrection Stone to Harry was so that when Harry "sacrificed" himself as DD had conditioned him to do he could at least speak to his parents and such before hand to get reassurance (even if it was false). I think DD knowing Harry as well as he does knew this would help and fully expected Harry to die so that someone else could kill LV later on. The only thing (in my opinion as I have made known on here several times) that upended DD's plan was the fact that Harry was the Master of the Elder Wand and therefore could not be killed in a duel by anyone, LV included. That's also my reasoning on why the curse at the end rebounded on LV but I know several other people see that differently.




Yeah, it is just like old times, isn't it?

There was no precedent for Dumbledore to go by, obviously, in thinking that his plan to sacrifice himself to Snape would in fact end the power of the Elder Wand. On the other hand, his guess was based on the fact that (1) there can only be one Master of the Elder Wand at a time, (2) New Mastery is gained through the defeat of the former Master. The wand would still have power, but would not have a Master, therefore, for all intents and purposes, it would be neutralized into a regular wand, similar to what Voldemort got.

Dumbledore's guesses are usually right, lol...

I'm one who disagrees with you about Dumbledore believing that Harry would die. His "gleam of triumph" when he learned of the blood borrowing indicates that he believed that Harry had gotten protection from death IF Voldemort tried to AK him from that point onward. His insistence to Snape that Voldemort HAD to be the one to try to kill Harry is also an indication of his belief in that regard. His insistence that Harry walk to his death without fighting was twofold -- (1) he guessed once again that Harry's sacrifice would protect everybody else from that time forward and (2) without fighting, no other Deatheater would enter the fray, killing Harry by accident. The blood connection only protected Harry from his mother's murderer, not from anyone else.

I do agree with you, though, that the Mastery of the Elder wand also served to protect Harry, and that this was a secondary protection that Dumbledore had not planned for. I believe that that aspect might have actually caused Voldemort to lose consciousness -- the Wand was punishing him in a way for attempting to kill its Master.

I also agree that Dumbledore left the Resurrection Stone to Harry so that he could get the emotional support he needed from his parents at the moment he was facing his death. He needed it!

One thing we might discuss is this: by arranging for Harry to talk to his parents before he took that crucial step, there was a built-in insurance policy. Spirits have knowledge that Dumbledore did not have until he died. If Dumbledore's plan was going to go awry because he had guessed wrongly before he died, don't you think Harry's parents would have advised him not to go through with the plan? I think Dumbledore might have counted on that last minute divine guidance for Harry...
ABI
Frequent Contributor
ABI
Posts: 2,577
Registered: ‎07-19-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

What if, theoretically, the wand was picked up by another after Dumbledore's death, just picked up? And then THAT person was defeated by another, and the wand passed to him/her as the true master? Or would that not work because the first owner would have had to been a qualified "master" and so would have had to defeat the original owner?

And wouldn't this have occurred more than once in history? Someone dying on some other pretext without having been defeated by another?
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
Distinguished Correspondent
Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Dumbledore knew he possessed the elder wand, and knew Voldemort would go after it for the reasons you cite. I think that's what bothers me about Dumbledore's plan to have Snape end up with the wand. Dumbledore was taking a big risk in assuming that the wand would know that Snape killed Dumbledore by agreement and that it was not a genuine defeat. Further, what did Dumbledore expect Snape to do with the wand once he "ended up" with it? Forget for the moment Draco's interference. Snape didn't know the significance of the wand. He could have left it (as he did and it ended up being buried with Dumbledore), but Snape could just as easily have taken the wand as a trophy to present to Voldemort, like Dorothy presenting the Wizard of Oz with the broomstick. Snape, in his ignorance, might have thought this would further enhance his standing with Voldemort,enabling him to continue with his double agent duties. By intending that Snape end up with the wand, wasn't Dumbledore just putting Snape in even more danger if Voldemort ever figured out that the master had to be defeated? Voldemort would not have known about the death pact between Dumbledore and Snape, and he would have targeted Snape right off the bat for mastery of the wand.

Dumbledore also doesn't seem particularly concerned about the fact that Draco was, unwittingly, the master of the wand. Yes, I know Dumbledore is dead, but his portrait was fairly busy giving Headmaster Snape advice about the Gryffindor Sword. He didn't seem too concerned about warning Draco that Voldemort might figure out that Draco was really the master of the wand. There were other death eaters on the tower, and Greyback, all of whom knew that Draco had disarmed Dumbledore. I know that Voldemort probably thought death was a more significant defeat than disarming, but he learned through his visit to Grindelwald that the wand could change masters without their being a death. Draco could have as easily been in Voldemorts sights.

As to what Dumbledore could have done differently-how about just hiding the thing and using another wand. Dumbledore must have had another wand before he came into possession of the elder wand, why not go back to using that one? Dumbledore knew he was dying, and whether he died as a result of the curse, or died at someone elses hand, he would not have been holding the elder wand, which could have remained hidden.



Psychee wrote:

Mollywobbles wrote:
So, the only person Dumbledore figured was smart enough to figure out the wand thing was Voldemort? The guy who fractured his soul, the guy who didn't believe in the power of love? Only Voldemort, evil incarnate in the wizarding world, would understand the significance of the wand? All the more reason to do something different with the stick of death. I know Dumbledore understood that to neutralize the power of the wand, the owner had to die a natural death. It still seems like a huge risk to hope that Snape would end up in possession of the wand, and trust that Snape was too dumb to realize its significance.



Psychee wrote:
Mollywobbles, that was the whole purpose of asking Snape to kill him -- it was the only way to insure that the wand's power would be neutralized. Dumbledore didn't trust anyone with the power of the wand, not Snape and not Harry.

On the other hand, he knew that Voldemort would eventually figure out that it was, in fact, the Elder Wand that he had been using all those years, and because Snape had killed him, it would LOOK like Snape had won mastery of it, when in fact, he never did.







No one knew that Dumbledore had it. No one knew that Grindelwald had it. The last person who admitted having had it was Gregorovitch, who never knew the identity of the boy who stole it. The only people who were interested in it were those on the "quest", and they all thought the track had gone cold...

Dumbledore knew, though, that Voldemort had been stumped by the fact that his wand was useless against Harry. He knew that Voldemort would go to a wandmaker and demand something better, and the only thing better was this legendary Elder Wand. Dumbledore knew that wandmakers would know of Gregorovitch's claim, and he knew that Voldemort would turn the world upside down to follow the clues from there, just so that he could kill Harry with that wand. So, yes, Voldemort was the only person whose motivation for the wand and willingness to do anything to get the wand would figure things out.

I'm not sure what you would have had Dumbledore do with the wand, pother than what he had tried to do. He couldn't destroy the wand and even if he could, he needed it right up until the time of his death, didn't he?

Message Edited by Psychee on 11-13-2007 06:51 PM


Distinguished Correspondent
Mollywobbles
Posts: 2,931
Registered: ‎06-15-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Why did Griphook act so treacherously? If it was just the distrust between Wizard and Goblin, why did he agree to help HRH burgle the Lestrange vault? I know he wanted the gryffindor sword, and in the first part of the burglary, he seems to be acting in good faith-warning the kids that the gringott's staff were suspicious etc. But all of a sudden, once the cup is located, Griphook lunges for it and "in that instant Harry knew that the goblin had never expected them to keep their word". I wonder why Griphook went along with the scheme if he didn't think they would keep their word. Griphook did owe Harry for rescuing him from the Malfoy manor, and he had seen how much regard Harry had for Dobby-so why the about face?
Frequent Contributor
mrsronaldweasley
Posts: 3,373
Registered: ‎07-26-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

I think it’s because Griphook was a greedy goblin. I do think he sincerely think Harry is a good wizard. However just like elves, they have a different mentality, just like Dobby, who has adjusted and accepted the importance of freedom for being enslaved by wizards. Goblins on the other hand, put real importance on their gold. I think they have a big issue about insecurity ,. They ‘almost’ act like wizards. Most wizards, as displayed by Ted Tonks and Co., converse with Goblins as if their human, because wizards acknowledge their intelligence, unlike the way most of them treat giants, elves, and werewolves. Goblins, knowing this information think they should be given more credit for their wonderful creations such as swords, etc. I think Griphook wanted to help HRO get to the vault. He of course knew the dangers within Gringgotts if one dare to trespass, so it wouldn’t make sense to go that far and not be sincere in helping HRO. but I do think it’s his greediness that got him to take the sword and leave HRO like that .

Goblins can’t accept that humans can afford to do whatever they can, buy whatever they have , and take whatever they want. Goblins want to be able to do the same, but unfortunately can’t. so Griphook, thinking Harry is a great wizard and all is still a wizard and cannot be fully trusted. But I bet griphook felt sorry after doing what he did. He’s an annoying goblin, I swear. Maybe he did it for prestige: he lent a hand on Harry Potter’s mission to defeat the Dark Lord, and he retrieved the missing sword of gryfindor .
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



Mollywobbles wrote: (in part)
br>
As to what Dumbledore could have done differently-how about just hiding the thing and using another wand. Dumbledore must have had another wand before he came into possession of the elder wand, why not go back to using that one? Dumbledore knew he was dying, and whether he died as a result of the curse, or died at someone elses hand, he would not have been holding the elder wand, which could have remained hidden.





Hiding it would not have worked. Using another wand would open up the chance that he would be defeated while still alive and that mastery of the wand would then transfer to another person. Remember, the Master did not have to be using the wand for the wand to know that the master had been defeated. Harry defeated Draco when the wand was still hidden away in Dumbledore's tomb.

But I agree about the Snape situation, Mollywobbles. Snape had no notion, insofar as we know, that he was going to look like the Master of the Elder Wand when Voldemort finally figured things out. And that left him vulnerable because he could not anticipate Voldemort subsequently killing him.

On the other hand, Dumbledore's portrait might have explained things to him about this outside our viewpoint. It still would have been a done thing, though, too late to change after the fact.
Frequent Contributor
mrsronaldweasley
Posts: 3,373
Registered: ‎07-26-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

Psyche I cant find the answer. Whats the name of bella’s husband again? Rodolphus isn’t it?
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



Mollywobbles wrote:
Why did Griphook act so treacherously? If it was just the distrust between Wizard and Goblin, why did he agree to help HRH burgle the Lestrange vault? I know he wanted the gryffindor sword, and in the first part of the burglary, he seems to be acting in good faith-warning the kids that the gringott's staff were suspicious etc. But all of a sudden, once the cup is located, Griphook lunges for it and "in that instant Harry knew that the goblin had never expected them to keep their word". I wonder why Griphook went along with the scheme if he didn't think they would keep their word. Griphook did owe Harry for rescuing him from the Malfoy manor, and he had seen how much regard Harry had for Dobby-so why the about face?




I know Griphook's behavior was treacherous from a human perspective, but was it also dishonorable from a Goblin's perspective?

Think about it. The deal was that if Griphook helped them get into the vault and retrieve the cup, the sword would be earned. There was nothing in that contract that said that Griphook should also help them get OUT safely. Griphook honored his contract and nothing more. Once the cup was found, Griphook took off with his "pay".

Harry should have dealt with Griphook in the same exacting manner he had learned to deal with bad Kreacher. But he didn't. He assumed that Griphook would see things the way a human did, and he erred in that regard.
Inspired Bibliophile
Psychee
Posts: 7,307
Registered: ‎04-17-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway



mrsronaldweasley wrote:
Psyche I cant find the answer. Whats the name of bella’s husband again? Rodolphus isn’t it?




"Rudolphus" is the way it is spelled. Think of the "red-nosed reindeer" and add a "us".
Frequent Contributor
mrsronaldweasley
Posts: 3,373
Registered: ‎07-26-2007
0 Kudos

Re: Tiny questions that don't matter but I'm asking anyway

[ Edited ]
yeah I already found the thread and spelling, thanks mah dear. :smileysurprised:
one thing ive learned elves are more lovable than goblins. lol

Message Edited by mrsronaldweasley on 11-14-2007 02:57 PM
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o