A few weeks ago, a colleague of mine on the marketing side of the publishing equation sent me a post from Jezebel.com and thought I might write around it a piece about how editorial content has evolved in the romance genre since the book, "The Road to Forever" by Jeneth Murrey was published by Harlequin in 1983.  Jezebel.com contributor Sadie contends that RTF hero Owen Tudor is the "Worst 80s Hero of All Time," or at least from the 20th C, and lays out her case.

While reading the post, "He Hardly Ever Called Her a Vicious Little B*tch Now..." I thought of an interview I'd done recently with a former Harlequin editor who told me in the 80s, she often was overruled in editorial confabs when she complained that some Harlequin heroes reminded her of the stalkers she was concerned she might meet in real life as a young, single woman in NYC.  She said she'd hear over and over from the team: This is fantasy and readers know the difference.

I agree.  Our negative and positive visceral impressions of books we read have everything to do with our experiences, whether or not we've evaluated them, and whether we've gone through or examined the things that allow us to understand where an author might have been coming from - or why a reader might have enjoyed a novel.  

When we reject out of hand old-school romance as dangerous or misogynistic - or any other label easily applied while living in the comfort of times when feminists give our romance reading their blessed seal of approval - we forget that in the 80s and long before, women wrote and read romance when feminists dissed both.

And definitely to put a fine point on things, those old-school romance readin'-and-scribin' women hadn't yet "found their voices." Many were trying desperately to surf the Second Wave, and - if they even understood they had some nasty fantasies -- hadn't the ways to articulate them; erotic fiction, and heck, even Anais Nin, weren't mainstays in their local libraries.

But Harlequin romances were available.

Now, I recently read an erotic romance that I adored, "Skin Deep  ," by Anna J. Evans, which spoke to some sexy elements I and so many romance readers love.  But I want you to understand that you and I have had years to read erom, know the language of sexuality and seduction and have been taught that it's ok to use them.  I mean, imagine the 50+ romance-reading demo in the 80s trying to articulate their bondage/humiliation fantasies!  

When a contemporary hero a la "Skin Deep" says to a heroine something akin to, "You're my dirty little b*tch, aren't you?" it's ok for us to get hot.  When the hero today who is a dominant kidnaps the heroine-even if he's conflicted -- it's cool for us to feel a nice, dirty thrill.  And when the hero humiliates the heroine in a bondage joint by bending her over and wailing on her pretty ass - with her permission, of course - we know she's the one with the real power, so we're "allowed" that sweet ol' body buzz.  

But remember this, girlfriends:  Today, in the 80s and always, the woman with the fantasy is the woman with the power.

Now, when you read the Jezebel.com post, you may want to go all, "But the hero loved his stepsister!  That's creepy!"  Well, maybe it is, and maybe it isn't, and I have my own opinions as a survivor of sexual abuse, and former child protection services worker.  But, again, remember what I said above about our experiences shading how we look at novels - and think about how that could color our feelings about what makes a romance "good."  

It's awfully easy to rip apart a book w/out trying to understand why it might have turned on readers.  And as a fan of all romance, I think it's more interesting to attempt to understand that every author who had the audacity to write a romance when it only was unpopular  - and every reader who bought a book when romance wasn't feminist- or smarty-pants approved  -- deserves our respect, and our gratitude.

What old-school romance did you love and still love?  What old school did your read that mortifies you today?  What are the best/worst things about how editorial content has evolved over the years in romance?

 

 

Sherri Kenyon visits Center Stage this week! Click here to dish w/ her bout "Bad Moon Rising!" Check out my exclusive interview with her here...

Message Edited by Michelle_Buonfiglio on 08-14-2009 10:48 AM
Comments
by Moderator becke_davis on ‎08-10-2009 12:09 PM

The older I get, and the more women I become close friends with, the more I think that whole generations of women were abused when they were young. And, over and over again, I've heard these same women say they were reclaiming their sexuality by reading and/or writing erotic romance. 

 

We all bring our own backstory into any book we read. I read a blog by an author who suffered a violent attack when she was young, and now she is impatient whenever a heroine doesn't watch her back or be constantly at the ready to defend herself.

 

Others have been beaten or degraded in a relationship, and those women will never put up with that behavior in a book. Many more suffered betrayal, and will not countenance any heroine ending up with a guy who cheats -- ever, no matter what the circumstances.

 

I remember reading Harlequins/Mills and Boons on buses and trains, and in work cafeterias back in the 1970s. There were always those who smirked, and the covers weren't even hot in those days. Most of the stories were all spark and sizzle, and the door closed on the bedroom -- or waves crashed.

 

I can still remember reading a book by -- I think -- Linda Shaw, a Superromance, if I remember, where the heroine got down on her knees (I'm only watching my words because this is B&N). I had NEVER come across that in a romance, and you better believe I made sure I bought every book that author wrote after that. I was also a big fan of Charlotte Lamb, who pushed the envelope a dozen different ways back in the day. She could wring emotion from a scene like few others could, and I still have most of her books on my shelf. Sandra Brown and Danielle Steel's books had a similar heat and emotional intensity, as did Janet Dailey's books (I'm talking 1970s and 80s).

 

The books I was embarrassed to be caught reading back then are like blancmange to today's romance reader. Erica Jong's Fear of Flying opened our eyes, and we haven't blinked since. 

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 12:38 PM
And we even look at the Jong as a little naive now, right?  I look at novels as 'period pieces,' and even the cover art from romance as the same.  Hquin did a really cool retrospective of cover art recently and folks lucky enough to attnd RWA national and the Hquin party there got glimpses of it.  Some schools of thougt about studying the arts encourage one to look at what was going on at the time a piece was created to better understand the appeal to the 'consumer' as well as why the creator might have made the work.

Reading romance certainly helped me reclaim aspects of sexuality and embrace others, becke, but I've always been a 'look issues in the face' kinda person.  So examining my emotions and reactions along w/ art/literature, etc. is second nature.  And I've met many women who've had similar experiences to mine who have no problem w/ old school bastardly heroes and have fond memories.  Yet I also won't donate novels I don't use to women's shelters because I don't assume every woman is at a place in recovery -- or even in recovery -- where she can separate fantasy from the reality of her abuse. And she may not ever be a woman for whom agression or agressive sexuality will be or become a turn on.

But I respect the right of any woman to have any fantasy and the belief  that so many woman enjoy sexual fantasies that they'd never want to experience in reality.
by Moderator becke_davis on ‎08-10-2009 01:16 PM
It's funny you should mention that -- I never donate romances to shelters, for that reason.
by Author Sabrina_Jef on ‎08-10-2009 01:51 PM

One of my favorite old school romances is Rebecca Brandewyne's Upon a Moon-Dark Moor. It's not as bad as some of the others, but the hero does rape the heroine at one point. I cringe when I read that, but I still love the book. Its follow-up, Across a Starlit Sea, is more PC, but I love them both.

 

I find that I can take just about anything in my erotica, but if it's a traditional romance, I don't want rape portrayed as seduction. I don't mind it if it's portrayed as rape (as in Whitney, My Love) and the hero comes to acknowledge his error, but even that I don't want in too many books. But then I was one of the people reading those early books and thinking, "I love these guys, but why do they have to be so mean?" I cheered when books changed and the alpha heroes were still alpha but not rapists, if you know what I mean. 

 

BTW, I tried to sign in as Sabrina Jeffries, but it tells me that name is already taken. Oh well. *G* 

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 02:06 PM

HI, Sabrina!  It's telling you your name is taken because they put aside authors' names so nobody who isn't you can take them for nefarious purposes! I'll let someone know so you can have yours!

I really enjoy hearing folks talk about the old-school reads that they've enjoyed. and the bottom line on the reactions is that 'tis a total trash/treasure, subjective call for readers.  I know lots of women who don't consider the Whitney scene rape, and many who do. But what I don't 'hear' you saying is "if a woman believes that scene's sexy, there's something wrong w/her choice.'  But you are clarifying here that you believe the interactions are scenes of rape, not that the author intended them that way, or that all readers see them that way.

 

I never can get right w/ Woodiwiss' "Flame and the Flower' and the 'hero mistakes the virgin heroine for a prostitute and takes her a second time, even after he knows the truth" beginning.  But it wasn't my fantasy. Yet I know a bunch of ridiculously sane, ardently feminist women who adore that book ,and the arc of that hero finding his way to redemption totally works for them.  And I celebrate that.

 

I'll never forget when I was very new to romance attending a local Romance Writers of America meeting, asking someone about Woodiwiss.  She said something like, "when I was in college, we passed around copies of 'the flame and the flower,' and 'the wolf and the dove,' under the table at our campus NOW meetings. We loved those books.  But we couldn't let anyone know we liked them, or they'd've kicked us out of the group."

by Lisa_Kroener on ‎08-10-2009 03:05 PM

Hey Sabrina *waves*, how cool to finally have someone from TGB here!

 

I have to admit I can't really join this discussion as I'm not old enough to having read those "old" romances. I started with Stephanie Laurens three years ago and since then have constantly expanded my reading field, but only with up-to-date authors and books. A friend once gave me some old Barbara Cartlands, which I found interesting to read as it showed the early years of romance, but not something I'd call a masterpiece.

 

Fortunately, I've never been on the receiving end of any kind of violence or abuse, a fact I'm very thankful for. Now I'm really wondering what I would feel when I read violent/humiliating/everythingsimilar scenes if it were different. I honestly don't know.

 

I've read Claiming the Courtesan only two days ago where the hero was quite obsessed with the heroine and also acted that way - he treated her very roughly, I don't know if I'd call it "rape", but it's certainly akin to it. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely adored the book (and the hero!), the whole scenery and writing style, but I'm still not sure how I'm feeling about those particular two or three scenes.

On the one hand, it gets me hot, the feeling to be desired so violently the hero couldn't stop himself. On the other hand, I - like Becke said - just thought "Hey, why are you behaving like some damn badass? Take a little care!".

 

~LisaK

by Moderator dhaupt on ‎08-10-2009 03:26 PM

Hi gang,

Michelle Woodiwiss's The Flame and The Flower that's the one I have trouble with too. We read that sometime last year at the romance club here. And I just HATED the rape and you can't call it anything other than that. But I didn't yell and scream when other fans didn't find fault with it.

I'm not a fan of erotica, I love a good spicy romance, but no bondage, no more than two people involved, people who happen to be in love, are falling in love or will fall in love as a result of their little bump and grind routine. However I LOVE paranormal romance and romance paranormal style can get way creative without being distasteful in my opinion. But and there's always a but I know, I feel everyone has the right to read and enjoy whatever they choose as long as they let me with my opinion and don't question or oppose what I choose. 

by Moderator dhaupt on ‎08-10-2009 03:27 PM

 BTW

There should be a comma between Michelle and Woodiwiss's above, sorry

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 04:50 PM

Oh, debbie, I'm goind to have to call the Grammar Police.   You seem to know what you like.  Comfort level, to me, is important; we set boudaries for ourselves, know how much and what kinds of sensuality we enjoy in ficiton.  Another boudary we can set if we choose is allowing other folks their interpretations.  I like the idea of giving readers a place where everyone has an opportunity to be heard in an environment where use of respectful language is stressed.  It's an easy way to learn about other view points and to have a chance to consider them.

Hey, LisaK! Welcome! Since I didn't read the old school back in the day, as I wrote earlier, I try to look at the period in which it was written to get a sense of what was going on.  If you get a flavor of the period, the, you know, zeitgeist :smileyhappy: it can give some clues as to why a certain kind of lit or style is popular.  I've written before that "Claiming the Courtesan' is one of the best books I've read for many of the reasons you've listed.  I felt it had a very 'old-school' authenticity about it, a fearlessness; Campbell allowed her hero to be exactly as you described, and wasn't afraid to leave the reader uncomfortable.  That it became a lightning rod for controversy is an example of my point w/in this post re reading novels through the lense of our resolved and unresolved issues -- and the  danger or appeal of assessing the worth of a novel based upon negative emotions dredged up while reading.  I like seeing how thougtful you're being and would be interested in the conclusions you come to. But sometimes it can take us years and re-reads before we know how we feel...

by Author Maria_Geraci on ‎08-10-2009 05:31 PM

I loved 'Claiming the Courtesan' (and love Anna as well!) I read the book before I heard any of the *buzz* about it and was actually kind of surprised that some romance readers had a problem with it. I mean, let's face it, the heroine was a glorified prostitute. Not a woman who anyone would really want to identify with in real life, but like 'Pretty Woman' we overlook things like that because we realize this is a fantasy. In real life would we condone a man kidnapping a woman he was sexually obsessed with? Heck no. Do we really believe vampires and shape shifters exist out there? Well, hopefully not. But all those characters, including the ultra hot alpha male, makes for hot romance.

 

My favorite 'old' romance is Judith McNaught's 'Whitney, My Love'.Controversial? Maybe,  but it obviously struck a huge chord with women everywhere, because it was a mega hit.

 

Maria

by JenPenny on ‎08-10-2009 06:16 PM

As a Jezebel reader/commenter and avid follower of Romance, I'd like to point out that the post in question is part of a series comparing some of the more misogynistic heroes from 80s romance novels and is not writing off the genre but maybe directing some snark its way. The number of "rapey" plotlines that the books had back then seems to be more frowned upon now in mainstream Romance. Yes, there are those especially in the erotic genre subset that have a bit more kink, but for the most part it seems like Authors don't go this route anymore. Were the women reading books like The Road to Forever limited by the types of books available? Would they have chosen to read those books if books more along the lines of today's romance available?

 

I guess my question is, what came first? Did greater sophistication in the readership lead to more sophisticated stories? Or did more sophisticated stories with less overt misogyny attract more sophisticated readers? 

by JenPenny on ‎08-10-2009 06:29 PM
I think the last part of my comment came across too judgey. I don't mean that women reading romance back in the day were unsophisticated. But clearly there was some reason why we no longer have the same number of books that tell those stories where the hero really seems to have no redeemable qualities (that's basically what the Jezebel post is laying out: these are heroes who at every turn belittle and humiliate the heroine). Is it just that feminism is more widespread and women now feel they have a greater choice?
by Moderator becke_davis on ‎08-10-2009 06:44 PM

Interesting question. I was in my mid-twenties when I discovered Mills & Boon; prior to that, I would have described myself as primarily a mystery reader. I read Woodiwiss, read Danielle Steel and Judith Krantz (and Erica Jong) and later discovered the hotties of the era -- authors like Bertrice Small and Diana Summers. I even read Harold Robbins, which was when I discovered I preferred my hot scenes written from a woman's viewpoint. 

 

I would say I was pretty unsophisticated then -- and, in some ways, I still am. But as I've gotten older, I've also become less defensive of my taste in books. My brothers joke about it, my kids laugh at the covers, my parents don't understand it at all, and my husband -- well, I'm the talker in this family. He may raise his eyebrows occasionally, but then he slides his glasses back up his nose and returns to whatever deep book he's reading.

 

One thing that hasn't changed -- people who don't read romance still don't "get" it. Instead of angsting over this, I now read what I want to read and pass on a lot of books to the uninitiated.  Turns out a lot of my friends were secret romance readers and I never knew it. Still other friends read hot ebooks online so their husbands and kids can't see what they're reading.

 

The big difference is now there are so many more books to choose from. For me, the abundance of romance titles is like manna from heaven. I think it's partly because we have so many more books/authors to choose from that the cream is rising to the top. And we're picking the books that give us heroes who are strong but caring and heroines who don't have to give up their identities to become part of a couple. We are making these choices every time we go back to buy another book by an author we like, because publishers and book sellers are paying attention. 

by on ‎08-10-2009 07:49 PM
You know in reading this blog and all your comments. All I can think is that thankfully there are now, many ways to find out a books contents before hand.
by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 09:43 PM

Yes, Maria, overlooked by lots of folks in "Courtesan" was the issue that the hero literally owned the heroine's body for, what, 2 years prior to action beginning in the book?  Looking at the book in historical context that Campbell is consistent in dealing w/ the conflict between his behavior, social mores and his own motivations, all of which play a role in the arc she creates for him to travel toward that 'redemption' we romance fans love so well. 

I don't believe a lot of the pnline negative criticism of the novel was discussed in a clear-headed way. An example is that some contend the hero's language was that of an abuser, but, again, that never was about Campbell's book,and always about the issues surrounding abuse for the person reading.  Perhaps saying, "when Campbell's hero says the words 'xyz,' it reminds me of the language of abusers, and makes me feel uncomfortable" is a responsible way to speak about a book -- and separates one's emotional responses from actual assessment of a book as a work of 'art' -- rather than, "the hero is a stalker and rapist and therefore the book is bad and Campbell's advocating the mistreatment of women." 

 

But what is true, so true, is what you've hit upon: The sales tell the tale, no matter what I may think is the value of a novel.  If women are buying it, they're digging the fantasy, not just because it's all that's offered, but because it's what they dig.

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 10:19 PM

Thanks for your thoughts, JenPenny and additional info about the jezebel.com series.  I appreciate your clarification  on the sophistication in readership and stories. 

 

What came first was the Second Wave.  30some years later, it's cool to think that our daughters have the choice whether to read aggressive sexual fantasy (sheesh, when they're old enough) with sister feminists not judging them. That's part of what feminism means: supporting our sisters in their choices, not only allowing them the ones we think are best for the home team.

 

And part of that support has been more women learning openly to talk about and explore sex and fantasy.  So you're right in saying that now the fantasy has changed and it's affected choices in romance storytelling.

 

That said, if the old-school books fulfilled fantasy for the readers, more power to 'em.  Remember, nobody forced anybody to read or write it and there certainly were other fiction choices.  If we look at old school as the 'industry forcing paternalistic, misogynistic rape fantasy' on unsuspecting women, we're guilty of the very thing of which we're accusing the industry: we're condescending in supposing we somehow know what was better for those 'unsuspecting' women than they did for themselves. 

 

It's all simple to judge in retrospect, and an easy laugh to score at the expense of an author and readers in the genre we love if we choose to make a spectacle of them. 

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 10:39 PM

becke, it concerns me that you, who've published several books, hundreds of magazine articles, taught classes and are an exceptionally well-read woman would term yourself unsophisticated in any way related to books,  especially romance fiction. And, oh, those poor,uninitiated friends of yours must not know what hit em.  Wasn't someone using the term 'book evangelists' around hear a couple days ago?

 

 

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-10-2009 10:42 PM
You know, tiggerbear, that's a terrific point.  since we have such varied tastes -- and there's so much offered -- it's great to know what one's getting.  It'd be cool if publishers could label everything in some way that helped us. But since that would really be ridiculously difficult, it's great when we find places we trust for direction.  I always like to look to readers for the best recommendations, and really enjoy the Rom Reads message boards.
by Moderator becke_davis on ‎08-10-2009 11:36 PM
Michelle, I meant unsophisticated in the academic sense. I don't have degrees in literature, haven't studied the genre in depth -- I just read a LOT of books, and try to write them, too!
by amyskf on ‎08-11-2009 01:40 AM

Where to start? Michelle, do you really think I'm ridiculously sane, even though I think The Flame and the Flower is one of my fave romances ever? You know I'm kidding -- because, I know you wouldn't judge me, no matter what I thought.

 

Isn't that kind of what we're talkin' about?

 

Sabrina! Your name could never belong to anyone else. Ever.

 

I have too much to say, and it's too late at night. But I loved Claiming the Courtesan -- on my keeper shelf. Probably because of how Anna made me believe in the worthiness of the hero, even after the heroine didn't. But, obviously, eventually she did.

by Moderator dhaupt on ‎08-11-2009 09:42 AM

I didn't mean to step on toes or heavens insult any romance reader. I am still an infant in my reading life as I only starting reading again in 06 so I really didn't read romance in the 70s, 80s or 90s to know the lay of the land and where the interest was. So if I insulted any one please forgive me.

 

I believe that romance and for that matter any reader should follow his own heart, and I don't believe there is such a thing as a bad book, and just because there are those books that I can't read doesn't mean that someone some where won't like them. 

by Blogger Michelle_Buonfiglio on ‎08-11-2009 10:38 AM

Deb, now we're gonna do the 'girly' thing and be all, 'oh, you didn't insult me, did I insult you?"  I think you were very clear in your first comment that you have your comfort levels and you respect others.  I'm entirely biased in that I love to hear readers say things like that, and especially appreciate the idea of what you've just written, that "there's no such thing as a bad book." Cause lemmee tell ya, there are books I've found tedious that've won awards.  So the tedium was all about me -- to which my friends readily will attest! 

 

 

by Moderator dhaupt on ‎08-11-2009 10:43 AM

Well thanks for that Michelle, but sometimes when I stand on the darned old soap box I get a little light headed from the height and things spill out that could be less sensitive then I like. So just so we're still BFF it's okay. ;-)

Deb 

by Author VanessaKelly on ‎08-11-2009 05:55 PM

Hi Michelle!  I've been thinking about your post all afternoon, trying to organize my thoughts - still trying!  I read very little old-school romance back in the day, especially when I was in grad school.  That was just beyond the pale, although I had a few friends who were studying romance from a post-feminist perspective.  Some of them even liked it and had the guts to say so, but most of the people in academia that I knew just thought romance was sexist garbage.

 

Although there's been real progress made in garnering respect for the genre, I still think we have a long way to go.  Maybe we'll get there and maybe we won't, but the readers of romance - including erorom and old school - will still love it.  What's not clear to me is if some readers (myself included) will ever completely rid ourselves of the shame, and that shame seems tied up (excuse the pun!) with our views on the power of women's sexuality.  Maybe we also need to get to the point where we no longer have to apologize for wanting a happy ending, no matter what shape that ending takes.

 

The discussion about Claiming the Courtesan continues to be fascinating.  Two things make that book really work for me.  The first is Anna's deep understanding of the period, and how the h/h would understand their respective places in the world.  The second is the absolute veracity of the emotions.  There is so much truth in how she portrays her characters - it's just amazing.

 

  

by Moderator becke_davis on ‎08-11-2009 08:39 PM
I remember that Charlotte Lamb got a lot of flak for writing about rape and child abuse. In one of her books -- Wounds of Passion, I think -- the heroine had been raped and she accused the hero of being her rapist. That is not a theme you'd find today, and I think she got some flak for it back then.