LOTR: Prancing Pony: Off-topic chat

[oldBPLstackden…]

A Very Good Afternoon To Everybody...

This has actually been my first look back at this site since I left off with my plaintive lament of the other day...

Dagor - I knew you hadn't actually "left us" - I know you like to take your time, do your research, and

"report in" only when you feel that the time is right. I, on the other hand, have a tendency to post multiple times at once and often, whether I have given my little essays all that much forethought or not.

As a personal aside - I just wanted to mention some feelings in common vis-s-vis those old copies of Tolkien's books. When I wasstill growing up, ( in that period when the "Tolkien Phenomenom" was taking off

- from 1967 - until about 1974 or thereabouts ) I used to spend a lot of time at the Used- Book Store

( the one I spent the most time at was named "Pellucidar", incidentally ( it no longer exists ) - and I guess you could say it had sort of Sci-Fi/ Fantasy "bent"  although there were probably almost as many used paperback Sci-Fi/ Fantasy books available at the other Used-Book Stores ) - Anyway - I often used to look longingly at the copies of Tolkien's books available on the shelves there -

a selection that often included the hardback editions - just like the ones that I would check out from the library

( although the hardcover copies in "Pellucidar" always seemed to be missing their book-jackets ) ---

There were also the usual "Ballantine Books" paperback editions - and once, there were even some copies of the old "ACE" pirated paperback editions. But I never had much spending money for such things in those days - I think the used hardback LOTR books ran in the four dollar range - and atthe time, even a mere five dollars seemed like an enormous fortune to me!

So, I simply continued to check out my reading copies from the library, and never did own my own personal copies at the time.

Eventually, I did pick up a copy of "The Tolkien Reader" and a book called:

"The Road Goes Ever On" - which contained some of Tolkien's songs taken and set to sheet music.

( On down the line, I did wind up selling off "The Road" when I got desperate for some cash )...

Many years on down the road ( say in the late 1990's ) I managed, in short order, to stumble across those same old "Ballantine" paperback editions of "The Hobbit" and all three volumes of LOTR -

[ with that same ludricrous, but still lovable, cover art by "BREM" ]

in the "free bins" of a couple of our local libraries!!!

ROTK was a little bit dingy ( with one fragment of a page missing ) - but ( needless to say ) I scooped up these beloved, old, treasured gems and took them home with me...

Unfortunately for me, I allowed my then teenage daughter to run off with my copy of "Two Towers"

( when she went off to visit he great-aunt far away ) and I never got it back.

However - I have my copy of [ H ] and FOTR right beside me here.

I don't keep my precious copies in the deep-freeze, however ( perhaps I should! )

I do keep them in a platic "baggie", however.....

A.W. 

[oldBPLstackden…]

Hello Again, Eveybody ( One More Time ) ---

First, I would like to apologize for all the words I squeezed together, my grammatical error and my spelling mistakes in my previous letter just before this one. ---

TiggerBear ---

I'm not sure if I would ever want to see Tolkien's books become any kind of "required reading" in the schools

[ at least, not on the Elementary Level - and maybe not even on the Secondary Level, either ]      

I know what we've been doing here has been to study, "disect", interpret, theorize upon and otherwise examine Tolkien's stories -  but, it always seemed to me, [ when we used to do that kind of thing in school, with selected works of literature ] that the books and stories that were "given" to us in class [ in order to

"disect" and examine and write essays on ] were always just a wee bit less enjoyable than almost anything that one may have "discovered" on one's own - and read in the spirit of pure enjoyment and self-entertainment - without the onus of the brain-straining for class discussion and required essays, etcetera,,,

[ in spite of whatever the quality of the literature that was being "offered" in the classroom ]

Ardo    

[oldBPLstackden…]

One More Time... ---

I noticed, recently, going over the shelves of the second-hand books ( mainly at the Thrift Store - but I think this was true [ to a certain extent ] at the Used Book Stores, as well ) - that there seemed to be more copies of "The Fellowship" available than either one of the next two volumes in the LOTR "Trilogy" ...

The feeling I got from this was that, perhaps, after the immense popularity of the LOTR movies, and the exposure of so many people to the stories - that many people felt "inspired" to read the books that the movies were based on - but then ( possibly ) gave up at one point or another while attempting to read

FOTR - or even after they finished reading that first volume...

Perhaps they became "disenchanted" with the book ( because it seemed so different from the movies ) --

Perhaps they simply grew tired and "gave up" - considering the complexity and great length of the story. --

"The Two Towers" seemed to have the fewest number of used copies available ( especially at that Thrift Store - they had zero copies there! ) ---

However, I doubt if all those hundreds of Book Club members all live in our locale - and all rushed out to grab up their copies of TT in order to keep up with the discussions...

[  thereby causing this TT "shortage" ]   

Note to Dagor -

I guess I must have my furry feet planted fairly firmly on both sides of the fence - I'm often that "Gee, I wish I were a hobbit", socializing kind of Book Club correspondent - but I enjoy the serious side of studying the subject, as well...

It's fortunate we have "The Prancing Pony" available for "The Lighter Side Of Things"...---

Ardo

[TiggerBear]

I'm not sure if I would ever want to see Tolkien's books become any kind of "required reading" in the schools
[ at least, not on the Elementary Level - and maybe not even on the Secondary Level, either ]
I know what we've been doing here has been to study, "disect", interpret, theorize upon and otherwise examine Tolkien's stories - but, it always seemed to me, [ when we used to do that kind of thing in school, with selected works of literature ] that the books and stories that were "given" to us in class [ in order to
"disect" and examine and write essays on ] were always just a wee bit less enjoyable than almost anything that one may have "discovered" on one's own - and read in the spirit of pure enjoyment and self-entertainment - without the onus of the brain-straining for class discussion and required essays, etcetera,,,
[ in spite of whatever the quality of the literature that was being "offered" in the classroom ]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh it wasn't a suggestion.
But in the history of literature, a great many of those that stand the test of time. Do so because they have shown up in textbooks.
In retrospect was Poe made any worse, simply because you read it in middle school?
I remember my delight when in a overly humid fall afternoon class, I flipped the text book page to stumble upon H.P. Lovecraft's "Dunwitch Horror" as the next story we would be reading out loud. I knew it by heart.
Every girl in my class had to get a copy of "Wuthering Heights" so we could finish it.

(shrug) All a matter of how a author was presented I guess.

[lorien]

Actually, I think we have managed (by accident usually) to structure this board for everybody. The newbies and second-time readers (like me) have the read-along chapters where they can move slowly through the books and won't have the plot ruined (well, most of the time).

Then we have a few "fun" threads, the Prancing Pony for totally off topic chats, the Introduce Yourself for the newcomers, and then the subject threads for those who want to go into deeper issues. These are more for the experts and the more serious reader. Anyone can start a "Subject" thread on any subject. People can go back and start with the Hobbit--the door is always open. Maybe we should start a "newbies" thread for new people with basic questions about Tolkien.

Any ideas on how we can improve this board and attract more participants? Maybe even the silent majority might want to offer their views, after all we regulars "know" our board is "perfect".

[oldBPLstackden…]

Hi, TiggerBear ---

Well, yes, I do recall also, "The Road Goes Ever On" Song/Poem {  from [ H ]  }  showing up in a Fourth

Grade "Reader" { & being quite excited to see it there, having already read the book itself many times }  - I think it's probably OK to have some "bits and pieces" like that pop up in English or Literature Class - but I just think maybe having an entire one of the books turned into "Required Reading" would be a bad idea...

I guess nobody necessarily gets any particular author or their works of literature "ruined" by having had to disect it in the laboratory of the classroom - there may even be cases where someone's interest has been piqued by being introduced to a particular author [ I do also recall we were "required" to read "Siddhartha" in my Ninth-Grade English class - & I was interested enough to go on and read a couple of other books by Hesse, as well ]  ---

I do think Tolkien's works will stand the test of time as being great literature, but it also seems to me to be

primarily great "escapist" fun, as well - and, until one feels like "examining" it for themselves, maybe it is better off remaining un-examined, and simply enjoyed for its own escapist, entertainment value...

( perhaps even as an "escape" from the boundaries of the classroom and homework, as well, even )... Ardo

[Dagor]

RE Ardo's -- "[ with that same ludricrous, but still lovable, cover art by "BREM" ]"

LOL! Since I associated the paperback BB art with my first experiences in reading JRRT, it still has a special place in my heart, vol. two, Two Towers, is my absolute favorite! Of course, JRRT thought the cover art absurd...

Re Ardo's "Note to Dagor - I guess I must have my furry feet planted fairly firmly on both sides of the fence - I'm often that 'Gee, I wish I were a hobbit', socializing kind of Book Club correspondent - but I enjoy the serious side of studying the subject, as well...
It's fortunate we have 'The Prancing Pony' available for 'The Lighter Side Of Things'..."

Yeah, that's a healthy attitude, keeping a liberal mind about multi-functionalism allows more choices, different ways and levels of interacting with the material. Those sites that offer "choices" usually tend to last longer. Sigh, my own bent is still decidedly toward the quasi-academic, but I have been known to dabble in role-play, quiz formats, and casual banter from time to time -- but please excuse me from efusions regarding "the way hot Legolas/ Orlando!" LOL!

RE Tiggerbear's "but, it always seemed to me, [when we used to do that kind of thing in school, with selected works of literature] that the books and stories that were "given" to us in class [in order to 'dissect' and examine and write essays on] were always just a wee bit less enjoyable than almost anything that one may have 'discovered' on one's own - and read in the spirit of pure enjoyment and self-entertainment..."

Yeah, as a "required reading," trimmed to a set of teachers' notes to TELL the students what they should be getting from the text, LotR would be a grim experience, not the pleasant voyage of self-discovery!

[Dagor]

---

lorien wrote:
Actually, I think we have managed (by accident usually) to structure this board for everybody. The newbies and second-time readers (like me) have the read-along chapters where they can move slowly through the books and won't have the plot ruined (well, most of the time).

Then we have a few "fun" threads, the Prancing Pony for totally off topic chats, the Introduce Yourself for the newcomers, and then the subject threads for those who want to go into deeper issues. These are more for the experts and the more serious reader. Anyone can start a "Subject" thread on any subject. People can go back and start with the Hobbit--the door is always open. Maybe we should start a "newbies" thread for new people with basic questions about Tolkien.

Any ideas on how we can improve this board and attract more participants? Maybe even the silent majority might want to offer their views, after all we regulars "know" our board is "perfect".

---

You have made some excellent points here, Lorien! Off-topic Chat, and a flexible format that allows old threads to be updated gives this forum a potential for being used in many different ways by many different people with quite different levels of text-experience. Maybe some quiz-threads -- short simple answers for those not interested in putting together long analytic posts -- might help? You answer a question correctly, then you get to pose the next one? Then, Role Play threads work well on some sites, I think Fanuidhol was especially good at giving a comedic-serious touch to such endeavors.

[TiggerBear]

(chuckle) guys, we know we like it. And we know we're happy with it the way it is. All I'm saying is EVERYONE who does NOT normally post. We'd like you to join in! And we're open to suggestions.

[lorien]

"The Road Goes Ever On" song book.

I actually do have a copy of this. I picked up used. It was in my stack of unread books from the Fellowship. I really would have liked to have gotten the CD recording but no such luck, especially at a bargain price.

I don't remember now why I got it but I did notice that there may be a "specific religious" topic that I might be able to bring up here in the hymn "A Elbereth Gilthoniel" which actually does tie in with the present chapters under discussion because of Sam's similar invocation to Elbereth that is coming up. I will first have to dust it off and look at it tonight.

[lorien]

Since I posted the start of the comic strip for "Waiting for Bilbo" I thought I would also post the archive one that was published for "Waiting for Frodo" when that movie was due to come out. It might give you a grin:

http://www.electricpenguin.com/waitingforfrodo/archives.html

It seems it goes from bottom to top chronologically.

[TiggerBear]

Oh that was way too cute, thanks!

[oldBPLstackden…]

This is just too silly to send to any of the other Threads, so here goes ---

When my wife and I were watching the LOTR movies, it kept bugging me that the CGI-created character of

"Gollum" was reminding me of something or someone, but I couldn't quite put my finger on what it was...

It finally dawned on me that "Gollum" [ especially in the look of his face, and with some of his facial expressions ] sometimes reminded me of David Hyde Pierce [ in his role as brother "Niles" on the "Frazier" Sit-Com ]... I hope Mr. Pierce would not feel insulted [ if he were ever to get wind of this, somehow ] as I really do feel fond of him, and I don't mean this to be insulting in any way  [ it just struck me as funny ] ---

Ardo   

[TiggerBear]

Ardo

Even more funny, Pierce did the voice work for Abe in the first Hellboy movie. Now when I see Frasier reruns, I a fishman in tweed suits.(chuckle)

HAPPY FOURTH OF JULY EVERYONE!

[oldBPLstackden…]

Greetings, TiggerBear ---

I really like that new "title" that you have "bestowed" upon me [ "Peace-Maker" ] ...

I would like to add that to to my list of other "titles"...

"Ardo The Overwordy" - "Ardo The Fancifier" - "Ardo The Anglophile" ---

and also: "He who eats mushrooms [  steamed or sauteed ] and drinks Near-Beer" ---

and finally - "He who uses way too many quotation marks and parenthesis" ---

I Have The Honor To Remain,

At Your Service,

Ardo Whortleberry 

[TiggerBear]

Oh Yuck, Near Beer. I'd thankfully forgotten that stuff. (chuckle)
You're welcome to any of that that come my way in my lifetime, Ardo. But not my mushrooms.(smile)


But could I add these titles
Heartfelt
Humble
Amusing

[oldBPLstackden…]

Hi, TiggerBear!

I know one of the actors on "Cheers" [ I believe it was George Wendt ] complained later on that all that

 "Near Beer" they used to have to swill on the set while they were filming episodes was awful stuff - but I'll bet the stuff they had to drink was all pretty flat and tasteless [ especially all the gallons of it that had to be kept around "on tap" ]... I've encountered some of that kind of N.A. Beer on some occaisons...but, there really is some tasty, quality Non-Alcoholic Beer available nowadays...

((( Sigh )))

It really is starting to feel like the "Summer Doldrums" down here at the BookClub...

And here we all are, approaching the "denoument" of LOTR ( with ROTK )...

I guess everyone has run off to the mountains, or the beach, or gone on their European vacations, or whatnot...

Actually, I [ for one ] have already used up most of my "best material" already - and talked too much already [ and have often done that "Spoiler" thing - getting so excited and over-anxious about everything ]

and "projects" that I was inspired to begin here have gone mostly unfinished - having run out of steam...

The warm days of Summer have always tended to melt my brains and made my mind sluggish, for the most part...

I'm still hoping to see some more "fresh ideas and new material" from other readers/correspondents, again...

Thanks Again, For Everything ! ---

Ardo

[TiggerBear]

Yep, it does look like everyone is on vacation. (shrug) Us, with work summer means OVERTIME and working weekends. We go on vacation in the fall or winter.

I'm not out of thoughts, but I hesitate to begin with so few people responding.

[macross]

Well I get to ask for vacation when I want, but I rarely take the summer for vacation. Usually around april or near the end of the year. An favorite vacation spots? I love travelling, I usually go the the US for vacation, maybe I should go to California sometime.

[oldBPLstackden…]

Hello Dagor! ---

Somehow I must have overlooked your reply [ #167 ] ---

It must have been that Ballantine Books contracted "BREM" to do the cover art for LOTR - and that "BREM" had to produce the work in a hurry, and apparently did not have time to read the entire book itself - or perhaps just skipped around and thumbed through the chapters - or merely read the sypnosis, or something like that...

At the same time, "BREM" somehow did manage to catch the "spirit" of the "Trilogy" - even if all the details were mixed up and many of the items that were depicted really had nothing to do with the story itself, whatsover [ like black flamingo birds? ]...

There was something, however, to just the color scheme of the whole layout - starting off with a calmer scene, and that serene night-sky, deep, dark blue background that slowly changes into that violet of a sunrise or sunset [ TTT ] - and finally, transforms into the violent red of the last panel, with the exploding volcano, and that storm of activity... ---

The entire "triptych" made a nice "wrap-around" device on the cardboard book-casing that the three books were sometimes sold in - and I seem to recall a large poster on the wall at "Pellucidar" of the whole layout in all its glorious color [ and I think I attempted my own copy, as well, but on a smaller scale ]... 

Ardo