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Frequent Contributor
hicetnunc
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
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Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

I read this book much too fast first time around..sort of like when I drink a cold beer on a very hot day..
The first read, Connie's character really spoke to me...fully engrossed me. As I read the book again, I fell in love with Jessica on chapters 9&10...(which in my opinion is the first real breakthrough in the mother/daughter relationship)

While my mom and I have a loving and close relationship...I realize there are so many unspoken words between us. Never, not once has there been any conversation, about sex/love/partners regardless of who has been in my life, short or long term. Until now I took it as her way of accepting/respecting my personal choices, no questions asked. (which within her own capacity, it probably is, but this isn't about her, it's about me...
I never realized, until now, how much it bothers me. In some ways it has left me feeling as if she's denied some very important aspects of my life?
So, now I know there are still monsters in my closet, as it relates to my relationship with my mother. Question for me is, where do I go from here after this profound revelation...

So I was wondering about the women here, Any.. knock you on your butt.. type of personal revelations about your own relationship with your mother?

T..who's very glad she uses women's clubs.
Frequent Contributor
LizzieAnn
Posts: 2,344
Registered: ‎10-19-2006
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

I too enjoyed these chapters. I love the way Connie & Jessica are coming together as adults. It did make me think of my own relationship with my daughter. I realized that she & I are able to talk about things in a better & more open way than my mother & I ever did or do. That's not to say that we discuss everything - we are not there yet (fingers crossed). Learning to deal with each other as adults (she's in her early mid-20s) is an experience for both of us, but we actually get along better now than we did when she was younger.
Liz ♥ ♥


Some books are to be tasted, others to be swallowed, and some few to be chewed and digested. ~ Francis Bacon
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Meems
Posts: 9
Registered: ‎02-24-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

My relationship with my mom has been pretty good since I stopped trying to make her part of my life. She is now passed. She spent a pretty unhappy, though "privileged" life as a majorly bipolar, addicted personality. As one therapist pointed out to me, "Meems, you being the third child probably never really saw any of what was really your mom, just the side effects of illness and addiction". I can't tell you how comforting that was, because I'd kept looking for myself in her and couldn't find me!

I had one child, a daughter. I can't even speak of the miracle of that without great big happy tears, but I was supposedly incapable of reproducing. WALLA! Don't believe everything docs tell you.

My relationship with my daughter is honest and layered, filled with the pitfalls of moms/daughters, but there is a kindness that pervades every moment, and the result of that is absolute trust and love that never changes no matter what the hurdles are. I still feel a tug when she drives away after coming over to my house, but I'll keep that to myself and treasure the fact that I love someone that much.

Out of chaos and hurt and emotional abuse can come the most beautiful of all things, and never doubt it for a minute! YOU design your life, once you acknowledge what was and what you want, and then BAM, you will start living the life you have decided upon.
Author
KrisRadish
Posts: 72
Registered: ‎02-23-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

You should all know that the mother-daughter relationship was a very interesting journey for me as well. I have a 17 year-old daughter and those of you with daughters will know where I am at. I keep a beautiful photo of her when she was about 2 years-old in this adorable fleece jacket, smiling at her mommie, just to remind me that inside of my tall daughter there is still that little girl. I wanted to play out a mother daughter relationship in this novel in a way that addresses my relationships with my daughter and my mother and all the mothers I have had and to address that moment when a mother and a daughter see the possibility of true adult friendship. It is not always possible but I write all the time about issues that I address in my own life and I think that is why so many of you find them to be real. My mother and I have been on a see-saw and there are many things we do not talk about but I would say that we are still close - and I feel very lucky to still have her in my life. This is a big topic with many side roads attached and every day I get a new road map ........


Kris
Contributor
marleneo
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎03-05-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

My relationship with my daughter is great. She has been my friend and uplifter for many years, with only a few disagreements, and I have learned to be her listening post as she has found her own answers through her former marriage and divorce. We have a great time together and she jumps in to help her brother and I raise her neice. She's a wonderful role model for Meredith, except maybe for the former marriage part. She now tells Meredith not to consider marriage until she's 30.

My relationship with my own mother was fair; she was always trying to make up to me for walking out on me as well as my dad when I was 5. I have understood why she couldn't stay in the marriage and why she thought she couldn't raise us. We could never seem to get to real sharing about it all. She was more materialistic and couldn't understand my willingness to give up so much of myself to others. I did take one trip with her to Washington, D.C. and talked to her regularly until before her death, Alzeimer's took away her thoughts to converse about.

My aunt became my "mother" of my grade school years. I've always been grateful to her as I believe the person I am (whom I like very much now) is due in a large part to her love and values. My relationship with my stepmother was good at times, though strained, mostly nonexistent now unless I initiate it.
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hicetnunc
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

Trying to understand my own relationship with my mother has put me in a 'stuck' mode quite a bit, throughout the last 10 years or so.
I do not have any particular defining moments, like Connie and Jessica, in which my relationship with my mother started changing. All I know that in the process of 20 years I transitioned (painfully slow at times)from being a pimple in my mother's butt...to being one of her O'Briens. And my mother transitioned from being the 'place' I ran away from, to the 'place' I run to. Hells bells be rung... if that ain't a magnificent revelation!..

I so love how this book tweaks my part of 'daughter brain' if that makes sense...
One of the reasons I get often get 'stuck' these days, isn't so much because of fear, it's mostly out of a deep need to understand all meaningful relationships in my life. I have learned to accept that brain and heart, are not always in synch. While the heart may want to let go...brain is saying, oh no nonono ya gonna get burn.

The most significant gift/skill gained, during this wonderful journey into maturity (well maybe not always wonderful often kicking and screaming)
has been...patience. Knowing that all things will be revealed, just not necessarily according to my own time line...
Author
KrisRadish
Posts: 72
Registered: ‎02-23-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

.....oh the patience thing is huge and i think the older i get - and the wiser - i just relax more about relationships and why someone comes into my life or leaves it and sometimes things really do just h a p p e n......do you know what i mean? and if the brain and heart were together in all of this mess there would be a lot less loving i think - i am really the heart type - like you can't figure that out - and yes, it gets me in trouble, but what great trouble it is......i am also wise enough to knwo when i need to look to my brain for more than a little help.....

kris





hicetnunc wrote:
Trying to understand my own relationship with my mother has put me in a 'stuck' mode quite a bit, throughout the last 10 years or so.
I do not have any particular defining moments, like Connie and Jessica, in which my relationship with my mother started changing. All I know that in the process of 20 years I transitioned (painfully slow at times)from being a pimple in my mother's butt...to being one of her O'Briens. And my mother transitioned from being the 'place' I ran away from, to the 'place' I run to. Hells bells be rung... if that ain't a magnificent revelation!..

I so love how this book tweaks my part of 'daughter brain' if that makes sense...
One of the reasons I get often get 'stuck' these days, isn't so much because of fear, it's mostly out of a deep need to understand all meaningful relationships in my life. I have learned to accept that brain and heart, are not always in synch. While the heart may want to let go...brain is saying, oh no nonono ya gonna get burn.

The most significant gift/skill gained, during this wonderful journey into maturity (well maybe not always wonderful often kicking and screaming)
has been...patience. Knowing that all things will be revealed, just not necessarily according to my own time line...


Frequent Contributor
hicetnunc
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

nah..never would have guessed about the Radish being the heart type.

Your novels give you away. Readers DO get a real glimpse into your heart, that is why the stories, characters touch us...reach us...hell, they can even stir stuff we didn't even know, or are afraid to recognize... we tucked away?....for whatever reason.

Patience and that wonderful anticipation of things to h a p p e n....i know what you mean indeed.
I agree, too, that some people are meant to stay in our lives, some are meant to come and go. And I refused to close me heart, even if it was left a bit bruised? that comes with being alive.
Most times, the experience, has been WELL worth the bruisin'..





KrisRadish wrote:
.....oh the patience thing is huge and i think the older i get - and the wiser - i just relax more about relationships and why someone comes into my life or leaves it and sometimes things really do just h a p p e n......do you know what i mean? and if the brain and heart were together in all of this mess there would be a lot less loving i think - i am really the heart type - like you can't figure that out - and yes, it gets me in trouble, but what great trouble it is......i am also wise enough to knwo when i need to look to my brain for more than a little help
Frequent Contributor
clarepayton
Posts: 427
Registered: ‎10-19-2006
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Re: mother/daughter relationships

I think one of the things I've found is that, ultimately, it is so much easier to be the mother than the daughter. (Well, mine is just 5 so far.) But, at least as the mother I feel more in control of creating a positive experience and a loving relationship than I did as a daughter because as a child, you experience life symbiotically alongside your mother. If your mother is happy and healthy, then great! But, if she is not, as mine was not, then you get a skewed portrait of the world. You are in the passenger's seat to someone else's life, and sometimes you have to wait a long time to drive!

But, don't give up on your mothers. While she still lives, there's still a chance to create new paths to understanding. Or, to find a place of peace in your differences. Don't give up! It ain't over til it's over.

Godspeed!
____________________________________________
Clare Payton, Moderator
Barnes & Noble Book Clubs
Contributor
marleneo
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎03-05-2007
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Re: mother/daughter relationships

I find it harder to be the mother because like Connie, we're always asking ourselves if we've done enough, been transparent enough so that our children know we've always loved them unconditionally. Finally, with all mine in their 40's, they say they do know that. We like to think it's always entirely on us, but it's not. I have asked my oldest son if I could have done something different to get through when he was in his experimental years. He says there's not because he was going to do what he was going to do. He did not doubt my love.

Connie, I think, felt some guilt for how her divorce and necessary subsequent lifestyle affected Jessica. I wonder still if their emotional health paths would have been easier I had let go of my marriage.

Since I did not live with my mother, I found it easier to let her "should's" fly over my head. I think my controlling has been with at least with a softer approach.
Frequent Contributor
hicetnunc
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
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Re: mother/daughter relationships

ha!...this is a topic with a lot of substance. Clare, I think that in a few years, if we were to discuss this topic again?..you'd probably have an entirely different answer/response/comment. Wait till your daughter hits those teen years...it's a whole new different ball game. I think it is a rite of passage of sorts? rebellion...Matters not how skilled mom may be at being in the driver's seat of your life...fact is most teenagers do not want their mother doing the driving. Teenagers think they know it all and can do everything better...period.
As teenagers we generally tend to go against everything our parents want for us.
Then as we become adults...we find ourselves embracing all those values our parents instilled in us..
Being very involved in raising two boys...I know that I must embrace all that they are? By that I mean I can't pick and chose what I'll love about them? I must love all their layers...I believe that with time and patience...hopefully, together we will peel away some of those more negative...and most certainly transitional layers...

well ok...sometimes patience....sometimes tequila...:smileywink:



clarepayton wrote:
I think one of the things I've found is that, ultimately, it is so much easier to be the mother than the daughter. (Well, mine is just 5 so far.) But, at least as the mother I feel more in control of creating a positive experience and a loving relationship than I did as a daughter because as a child, you experience life symbiotically alongside your mother. If your mother is happy and healthy, then great! But, if she is not, as mine was not, then you get a skewed portrait of the world. You are in the passenger's seat to someone else's life, and sometimes you have to wait a long time to drive!

But, don't give up on your mothers. While she still lives, there's still a chance to create new paths to understanding. Or, to find a place of peace in your differences. Don't give up! It ain't over til it's over.

Godspeed!

Author
KrisRadish
Posts: 72
Registered: ‎02-23-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

never say never - i mean really - someone just recently re-entered my life and it was like getting slammed into a moving bus - and coming out with a new dress on - time and place and people and circumstances and well - life .... i am thinking now if i would not have answered the email and always wondered that my life would be less - so get over it already - that is what i tell myself and what i want to tell so many other people as well.........






KrisRadish wrote:
.....oh the patience thing is huge and i think the older i get - and the wiser - i just relax more about relationships and why someone comes into my life or leaves it and sometimes things really do just h a p p e n......do you know what i mean? and if the brain and heart were together in all of this mess there would be a lot less loving i think - i am really the heart type - like you can't figure that out - and yes, it gets me in trouble, but what great trouble it is......i am also wise enough to knwo when i need to look to my brain for more than a little help.....

kris





hicetnunc wrote:
Trying to understand my own relationship with my mother has put me in a 'stuck' mode quite a bit, throughout the last 10 years or so.
I do not have any particular defining moments, like Connie and Jessica, in which my relationship with my mother started changing. All I know that in the process of 20 years I transitioned (painfully slow at times)from being a pimple in my mother's butt...to being one of her O'Briens. And my mother transitioned from being the 'place' I ran away from, to the 'place' I run to. Hells bells be rung... if that ain't a magnificent revelation!..

I so love how this book tweaks my part of 'daughter brain' if that makes sense...
One of the reasons I get often get 'stuck' these days, isn't so much because of fear, it's mostly out of a deep need to understand all meaningful relationships in my life. I have learned to accept that brain and heart, are not always in synch. While the heart may want to let go...brain is saying, oh no nonono ya gonna get burn.

The most significant gift/skill gained, during this wonderful journey into maturity (well maybe not always wonderful often kicking and screaming)
has been...patience. Knowing that all things will be revealed, just not necessarily according to my own time line...





Frequent Contributor
hicetnunc
Posts: 29
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

if 'my someone' that could make me feel that bus thingy, re-entered my life..hell if I didn't think about it...actually, there would be more than just thinking, surely.

In my case my 'someone' didn't work out then because of time, people, circumstances, life...fear.
I will not make that mistake again. I will regret and work very hard to fix collateral hurt and I know there will be a lot on both ends. I just don't think I would let those conditions be an obstacle second time around..

(btw i understand that the context of our 'someones' is most likely, totally different...impact-bus thing? exactly.

KrisRadish wrote:
never say never - i mean really - someone just recently re-entered my life and it was like getting slammed into a moving bus - and coming out with a new dress on - time and place and people and circumstances and well - life .... i am thinking now if i would not have answered the email and always wondered that my life would be less - so get over it already - that is what i tell myself and what i want to tell so many other people as well
Contributor
MuvverDawn
Posts: 10
Registered: ‎02-24-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

I've gone back and read and reread these chapters....and I don't get it, perhaps because I've never achieved it. I'm not whining here, but I've never been particularly close to my mother. I was not a difficult child. In fact, I've been told I was an "easy" teen to raise. So I'm not sure why we never clicked. But we didn't.

I was horribly sad when she moved away, but I've only just given myself permission to NOT feel guilt over the fact that I don't miss her much. I really thought I was a bad person for his, but what I've come to realize (thanks to the example of a dear friend in Pasadena) is that I am OK as I am. Facts are facts. I love my mom, but do not miss her. I am not defined by my relationship with her. And that's more than ok.

What I do miss is the fact that we kids were closer as siblings when she and my dad lived here. We gathered at their house for every celebration of family - Every Sunday for brunch after we all attended church together - Every game day for Packers football. Every birthday, for all of us kids, our spouses, and our progeny on the actual birthday (not the "convenient" day) - Every holiday - Everything.

I miss walking with her in her gardens and listening to her stories of planting and weeding and cultivating. But I miss the garden and the comfort of my childhood home more than the woman. Which makes me sad, but not bad....am I making any sense here???

I was given 2 beautiful sons to raise. They are the apples of their grandma's eyes. go figger!!
Author
KrisRadish
Posts: 72
Registered: ‎02-23-2007
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Re: Chapters 9&10 question for fellow readers about mother/daughter relationships

Hey you.....
do not feel bad about this - just because she is your mother does not mean you have to have a close and fabulous relationship - we all connect in ways that are just for us.....start talking about mother-daughter relationships and I want to pour more wine -

Kris




MuvverDawn wrote:
I've gone back and read and reread these chapters....and I don't get it, perhaps because I've never achieved it. I'm not whining here, but I've never been particularly close to my mother. I was not a difficult child. In fact, I've been told I was an "easy" teen to raise. So I'm not sure why we never clicked. But we didn't.

I was horribly sad when she moved away, but I've only just given myself permission to NOT feel guilt over the fact that I don't miss her much. I really thought I was a bad person for his, but what I've come to realize (thanks to the example of a dear friend in Pasadena) is that I am OK as I am. Facts are facts. I love my mom, but do not miss her. I am not defined by my relationship with her. And that's more than ok.

What I do miss is the fact that we kids were closer as siblings when she and my dad lived here. We gathered at their house for every celebration of family - Every Sunday for brunch after we all attended church together - Every game day for Packers football. Every birthday, for all of us kids, our spouses, and our progeny on the actual birthday (not the "convenient" day) - Every holiday - Everything.

I miss walking with her in her gardens and listening to her stories of planting and weeding and cultivating. But I miss the garden and the comfort of my childhood home more than the woman. Which makes me sad, but not bad....am I making any sense here???

I was given 2 beautiful sons to raise. They are the apples of their grandma's eyes. go figger!!


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