Chapter 6 - Mary Crawford

[Choisya]

I like Mary too Leo - but then I always like the baddies.

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CallMeLeo wrote:

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LizzieAnn wrote:
I think it was the fact that Mary was speaking to relative strangers in a less than completely respectful way of her uncle, the man who had raised it. It's probably more tied into the social mores & code of conduct of the time.

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kiakar wrote:

Was it rude or ungracious of Mary to tell her thoughts on memories of a summer cottage. Was she really critizing her uncle? And I wouldn't call it disrepect to voice her opinion of the cottage. Maybe I am missing something.

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In carefully rereading the quote, Mary says: "It was no part of my education; and the only dose I ever had, being administered by not the first favourite in the world." Meaning her uncle was not her first favorite and, in short, she didn't like him. I agree with LizzieAnn and jd (thanks!) that speaking against family to non-family was probably considered an indiscretion. Yet, werent Edmund and Fanny (following his lead?) taking too high a moral ground against Mary? She's alot more fun than Fanny, and quite frankly, I enjoyed her Rears and Vices pun! Shame on me!

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[Laurel]

I need help! I'm listening to a recording and do not have the book, and I've fallen asleep a few times. Are Mary and Maria (whom my reader calls Mariah) two people?

[Melissa_W Moderator]

Mary is Mary Crawford, the one who's got her hooks out for Edmund, and Maria (pronounced the gentrified Mariah - Maria Lucas is pronounced the same) is Miss Bertram.

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Laurel wrote:
I need help! I'm listening to a recording and do not have the book, and I've fallen asleep a few times. Are Mary and Maria (whom my reader calls Mariah) two people?

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[Laurel]

Ah, Thanks! I thought there must be two of them! I need to go back to the beginning.

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pedsphleb wrote:
Mary is Mary Crawford, the one who's got her hooks out for Edmund, and Maria (pronounced the gentrified Mariah - Maria Lucas is pronounced the same) is Miss Bertram.

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Laurel wrote:
I need help! I'm listening to a recording and do not have the book, and I've fallen asleep a few times. Are Mary and Maria (whom my reader calls Mariah) two people?

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[ziki]

Hey Choisya, this is like our board here!

quote:
"There was a rabble going hither and thither, reminding me of a swarm of rats in a ruinous cheese-store. Some came, others went; some were scribbling, others were talking; some were drinking (coffee), some smoking, and some arguing;..."

[ziki]

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pmath wrote:I suggest including quotations in each message ....

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Hi Pmath, did you mean quotations of posts or quotations from the book (as you use them)?

ziki

[Choisya]

Yes, I recognise a couple of them.

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ziki wrote:
Hey Choisya, this is like our board here!

quote:
"There was a rabble going hither and thither, reminding me of a swarm of rats in a ruinous cheese-store. Some came, others went; some were scribbling, others were talking; some were drinking (coffee), some smoking, and some arguing;..."

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[Jansten75]

Thank you for the encouragement,PMath, I will do that. As I am in catch-up mode and trying to complete notes for my local book club-we are discussing P&P tonight-I will not be where I would like to be until next week. I am thrilled to be able to participate in discussion or at least read many of the excellent (and fun) comments on Jane Austen's books. She is my main focus for now and all the comments are helping to view passages and characters from several perspectives-fun, fun, fun! I am viewing comments on other works listed on the boards but, alas, cannot move in those directions for now.

[pmath]

Z, I meant quotations from MP: it's easy to forget and post comments on later chapters otherwise! There are a number of electronic versions available on the Web, for copying and pasting.

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ziki wrote:
Hi Pmath, did you mean quotations of posts or quotations from the book (as you use them)?

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pmath wrote:
I suggest including quotations in each message...

[Jansten75]

You are right. "Three Dollar Sixty Five Cent University" does not equate. Thank you for the greeting.

[pmath]

I like this:

When I had sat there for a while, and taken in my surroundings, I myself felt inclined for a cup of coffee.

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Choisya wrote:
Yes, I recognise a couple of them.

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ziki wrote:
Hey Choisya, this is like our board here!

quote:
"There was a rabble going hither and thither, reminding me of a swarm of rats in a ruinous cheese-store. Some came, others went; some were scribbling, others were talking; some were drinking (coffee), some smoking, and some arguing;..."

Message Edited by pmath on 04-11-200709:56 AM

[Jansten75]

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ziki wrote:
Hey Choisya, this is like our board here!

quote:
"There was a rabble going hither and thither, reminding me of a swarm of rats in a ruinous cheese-store. Some came, others went; some were scribbling, others were talking; some were drinking (coffee), some smoking, and some arguing;..."

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Good comparison of the rabble, etc. I laughed out loud, Ziki. Maybe Choisya can explain the meaning of "big booth of a cheap-jack".

[Choisya]

Here is another funny post about London by Ned Ward, who was an 18C journalist and publican:-

http://www.waits.org.uk/quotes/ward.htm

(A booth is a market stall and cheapjack is someone who sells shoddy goods.)

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Jansten75 wrote:

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ziki wrote:
Hey Choisya, this is like our board here!

quote:
"There was a rabble going hither and thither, reminding me of a swarm of rats in a ruinous cheese-store. Some came, others went; some were scribbling, others were talking; some were drinking (coffee), some smoking, and some arguing;..."

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Good comparison of the rabble, etc. I laughed out loud, Ziki. Maybe Choisya can explain the meaning of "big booth of a cheap-jack".

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Message Edited by Choisya on 04-11-200701:02 PM

[jd]

Mary and Fanny have parallel universes, both being raised by uncles and their educations a nuisance and each have their own devices to get by - fanny by taking the higher moral ground and Mary taking the more natural course. As I have read further Fanny does become a little more interesting. Mary so far stays the same.

[pmath]

Good point, Jan: their uncles are certainly different!

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jd wrote:
Mary and Fanny have parallel universes, both being raised by uncles...

[ziki]

nothing

Message Edited by ziki on 04-12-200701:19 PM

[ziki]

After this dry anemic beginning of listing these people I am ready to shelf the book forever. My first impression : Who the heck cares? It's as exciting as making a shoping list of eggs, bread and some carrots.

Ack, please tell me it gets better
ziki



About thirty years ago Miss Maria Ward, of Huntingdon, with only seven thousand pounds, had the good luck to captivate Sir Thomas Bertram, of Mansfield Park, in the county of Northampton, and to be thereby raised to the rank of a baronet's lady, with all the comforts and consequences of an handsome house and large income. All Huntingdon exclaimed on the greatness of the match, and her uncle, the lawyer, himself, allowed her to be at least three thousand pounds short of any equitable claim to it. She had two sisters to be benefited by her elevation; and such of their acquaintance as thought Miss Ward and Miss Frances quite as handsome as Miss Maria, did not scruple to predict their marrying with almost equal advantage. But there certainly are not so many men of large fortune in the world as there are pretty women to deserve them. Miss Ward, at the end of half a dozen years, found herself obliged to be attached to the Rev. Mr. Norris, a friend of her brother-in-law, with scarcely any private fortune, and Miss Frances fared yet worse. Miss Ward's match, indeed, when it came to the point, was not contemptible: Sir Thomas being happily able to give his friend an income in the living of Mansfield; and Mr. and Mrs. Norris began their career of conjugal felicity with very little less than a thousand a year. But Miss Frances married, in the common phrase, to disoblige her family, and by fixing on a lieutenant of marines, without education, fortune, or connections, did it very thoroughly. She could hardly have made a more untoward choice. Sir Thomas Bertram had interest, which, from principle as well as pride--from a general wish of doing right, and a desire of seeing all that were connected with him in situations of respectability, he would have been glad to exert for the advantage of Lady Bertram's sister; but her husband's profession was such as no interest could reach; and before he had time to devise any other method of assisting them, an absolute breach between the sisters had taken place. It was the natural result of the conduct of each party, and such as a very imprudent marriage almost always produces. To save herself from useless remonstrance, Mrs. Price never wrote to her family on the subject till actually married. Lady Bertram, who was a woman of very tranquil feelings, and a temper remarkably easy and indolent, would have contented herself with merely giving up her sister, and thinking no more of the matter; but Mrs. Norris had a spirit of activity, which could not be satisfied till she had written a long and angry letter to Fanny, to point out the folly of her conduct, and threaten her with all its possible ill consequences. Mrs. Price, in her turn, was injured and angry; and an answer, which comprehended each sister in its bitterness, and bestowed such very disrespectful reflections on the pride of Sir Thomas as Mrs. Norris could not possibly keep to herself, put an end to all intercourse between them for a considerable period.

[ziki]

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LizzieAnn wrote:
Here's an illustration of Edmund finding a crying Fanny sitting on the stairs in Chapter 2.

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What an unusual way to hold a hankie!

ziki

[ziki]

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kiakar wrote:I think this shows that he is a gentle person, at sixteen, this day and time, boys have no gentle side that I have seen, maybe with their girlfriends. And the fact he wants to study for the cleryman, also shows he is compassionate about others feelings.
He is quite the different lad from his older brother.

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Maybe he is the kind of man women wish men to be....considered, interested in their feelings. Is he the exception to the rule character in the gallery of all characters in this book? She is an outsider and inthat case he is, too, in his ability to care he isn't the same as the rest of the dysfunctional gang.

ziki

[LizzieAnn]

LOL! Trust you to notice that melodramatic affectation!

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ziki wrote:

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LizzieAnn wrote:
Here's an illustration of Edmund finding a crying Fanny sitting on the stairs in Chapter 2.

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What an unusual way to hold a hankie!

ziki

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