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Re: HISTORY: Paris, Menalaus and Archbishop Makarios (353)

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Re: HISTORY: Ataturk reference (361)

[ Edited ]
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Re: HISTORY: Melina Mercouri (363)

[ Edited ]
Melina Mercouri:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melina_Mercouri

Message Edited by bentley on 07-01-2007 12:48 AM
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Re: HISTORY: Never on Sunday (364)

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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References - First, Thrace and Thracians


belimiami wrote:
Does anyone have any info. on Bityynios? I did come a cross an acient province called Bithynia located Turkey, is this related to Bithynios?




Sorry Belimiami..was so busy posting..going through my list of notes..I did not see you at first.

Let me try to start back at the beginning (I will break this down into separate posts because it might be difficult to follow):

Let us start by talking about Thrace and Thracians:

I think some of the connections start with the Thracians and Thrace. One of the many provinces they inhabited was Bithynia. By the 5th century BC, there were a lot of Thracians. They inhabited an area called Thrace. Thrace was a large area inhabiting many provinces including Bithynia.

The Greeks began to influence the Thracians as quoted below:

"In that period contacts between the Thracians and Classical Greece intensified which led to strengthening Greek influences in Thracian society, culture and handcrafts. Because their language had no written tradition, in some regions the Thracian aristocracy and administration adopted Classical Greek for an official language and Thracian merchants utilised it as a 'lingua franca' in their contacts with other tribes and peoples. As a result a level of Helenisation was observed in the following centuries and it was deeper imposed by the Macedonian conquests over the Thracian territory in 3rd century BC."

Here is a link which will explain these influences:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thracian

Next Point: Where was Thrace?

OK..today Thrace would have been located in Turkey, Greece, Bulgaria, Macedonia, Serbia.

Here is an excerpt:

"Thrace (Bulgarian: Тракия Trakiya, Greek: Θράκη Thráki, Attic Greek: Θρᾴκη Thrāíkē or Θρῄκη Thrēíkē, Latin: Thracia or Threcia, Turkish: Trakya) is a historical and geographic area in southeast Europe. Today the name Thrace designates a region spread over southern Bulgaria (Northern Thrace), northeastern Greece (Western Thrace), and European Turkey (Eastern Thrace). Thrace borders on three seas: the Black Sea, the Aegean Sea and the Sea of Marmara. In Turkey, it is also called Rumeli. Ancient Thrace (i.e. the territory where ethnic Thracians lived) also included present day southern Bulgaria, north-eastern Greece and parts of eastern Serbia and eastern Republic of Macedonia. Thracian troops were known to accompany neighboring ruler Alexander the Great, when he crossed the Hellespont which abuts 'Thracia' and took on the Persian Empire of the day. The portion of the Balkans peninsula nearest Istanbul is ancient Thracia, with Macedonia abutting on the west.

Here is the url to explain the above:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrace
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Re: HISTORY: Second: Thracians cont'd and location of Thrace today


belimiami wrote:
Does anyone have any info. on Bityynios? I did come a cross an acient province called Bithynia located Turkey, is this related to Bithynios?




OK..so we know about the Thracians and where Thrace was located and we know that Bithynia was one of the provinces of Thrace.

a) We know that the Greeks influenced the Thracians "greatly". And we know that the first Greek colonies in Thrace were founded in the 6th century BC.

b) The Thracians were militant and the kings of various provinces used them for fighting (including the province of Bithynia). Here is the excerpt:

"Owing to their martial reputation, the Thracian tribesmen were much used as mercenaries by the Greek kings of Syria, Pergamum, Bithynia, and other regions. Thracian mercenaries were always in demand, as they were fierce fighters, especially in rocky or hilly regions similar to their homeland. They were however considered a bit expensive at times, and liable to switch sides"

c) What happened to Thrace?

"In 1878, Northern Thrace was incorporated into the semi-autonomous Ottoman province of Eastern Rumelia, which united with Bulgaria in 1885. The rest of Thrace was divided between Bulgaria, Greece and Turkey at the beginning of the 20th century, following the Balkan Wars, World War I and the Greco-Turkish War. Today Thracian is a strong regional identity in Greece, Bulgaria and Turkey."

The url: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrace

d) There were many ancient Greek rulers/kings of the Thracian province of Bithynia including Nicomedes (Nicene Creed) and subsequently the places in the province were named after these rulers who preceded Alexander the Great. Then in history came the period of the Byzantine Empire (Roman Rule) and the names of the cities in the province of Bithynia changed over time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bithynia
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Re: HISTORY: Third: Cities of Bithynia

[ Edited ]

belimiami wrote:
Does anyone have any info. on Bityynios? I did come a cross an acient province called Bithynia located Turkey, is this related to Bithynios?




There are many cities of the ancient Thracian province of Bithynia which have changed names.

First, remember Nicaea became Iznik in Turkey.

Second, the ancient city of Prusa which became Brusa which became Bursa (we are familiar in Middlesex with the city of Bursa (right?). Bursa is a city and a province at this time.

"The valleys towards the Black Sea abound in fruit trees of all kinds, such as oranges, while the valley of the Sangarius and the plains near Bursa and Iznik (Nicaea) are fertile and well cultivated. Extensive plantations of mulberry trees supply the silk for which Bursa has long been celebrated, and which is manufactured there on a large scale." (Desdemona in Middlesex)

url on Bursa: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bursa%2C_Turkey

Third, prior to it being considered in Turkey if you go back further prior to the city being called Prusa it was called Cius or Kius. This was at one time an ancient Greek city.

Here is an excerpt:

"The earliest known site at this location was Cius, which Philip V of Macedonia granted to the Bithynian king Prusias I in 202 BC, for his help against Pergamum and Heraclea Pontica (modern Karadeniz Ereğli). Prusias renamed the city for himself, Prusa."

url included: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bithynia

Some more history of Cius: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03794a.htm
More of Kios/Cius: http://www.musesnet.gr/pages/kios/history.htm

There is a lot more but I hope this helps..I tried to shorten it; but there are many layers of history here.

Bithynios, Bithynia are the same thing (depending on either ancient Greek or more modern spelling)

Message Edited by bentley on 07-02-2007 12:40 AM
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Paul_Hochman
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Re: HISTORY: Third: Cities of Bithynia

Thanks again, Bentley. My searching of old maps proved fruitless.
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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)

On page 237 the author mentions a "blind pig." As in "they are breaking in the doors of the blind pig" or "people stream out of other blind pigs." What is a blind pig?
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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)

This sounds about right, lablover:

Blind pig
From Wikipedia

A blind pig, also known as a blind tiger or booze can, is an establishment that illegally provides alcoholic beverages.

The name originated in the United States in the 1800s, when blue laws restricted the sale of alcoholic beverages. A saloonkeeper would charge customers to see an attraction (such as an animal), and provide a "complimentary" alcoholic beverage, thus circumventing the law.

It was during the years of prohibition that blind pigs were most common in the U.S.

Estimates of the number of blind pigs in some major U.S. cities in the mid-1920s are:

Chicago, Illinois: 10,000
Detroit, Michigan: 15,000
New York City, New York: 30,000-100,000

The blind pig is a classic example of black market economics, and with the end of prohibition in 1933 most blind pigs had to either become legitimate establishments or close shop. Common current examples of the blind pig include the after hours club and the keg party.






lablover wrote:
On page 237 the author mentions a "blind pig." As in "they are breaking in the doors of the blind pig" or "people stream out of other blind pigs." What is a blind pig?


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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)

Paul H:

Still have a few that I did not have time to add..to help those folks who might stumble across this segment and be reading Middlesex for the first time.

Will add as I have time. It appears that a lot of people are using the links which is great.

What is going to be your next assignment? (lol) In terms of new moderation activities.

Regards,

Bentley
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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)

[ Edited ]
Hello Bentley,

Great. Add away. Your annotations have been wholly enlightening and have added a brand new dimension to the reading of the novel!

My next assignment has yet to be determined, but here's hoping you'll participate whatever it may be!

Paul



bentley wrote:
Paul H:

Still have a few that I did not have time to add..to help those folks who might stumble across this segment and be reading Middlesex for the first time.

Will add as I have time. It appears that a lot of people are using the links which is great.

What is going to be your next assignment? (lol) In terms of new moderation activities.

Regards,

Bentley



Message Edited by PaulH on 08-02-2007 04:38 PM
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Chaser
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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)

Hello bentley,

I don't know if you are still out there or not . . .

I have skimmed through all the links you have provided to take us deeper into many aspects of the novel, but I'm a little overwhelmed at this point.

I think re-reading the novel is an excellent idea and I would love to have these links handy, but I'm afraid they will not be here when I get around to doing that.

Any chance you have these all listed in one document? If not, please don't worry about it. But if you do, I would love to have all of these together for future reference.

Thanks for sharing all of that work (I feel out of breath just going through them!).




bentley wrote:
This thread will serve as an area for any ancient or modern history discussions which are referenced by Eugenides in the novel Middlesex.

Bentley


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Re: HISTORY: Historical Events and References (Ancient and Modern)



Chaser wrote:
Hello bentley,

I don't know if you are still out there or not . . .

I have skimmed through all the links you have provided to take us deeper into many aspects of the novel, but I'm a little overwhelmed at this point.

I think re-reading the novel is an excellent idea and I would love to have these links handy, but I'm afraid they will not be here when I get around to doing that.

Any chance you have these all listed in one document? If not, please don't worry about it. But if you do, I would love to have all of these together for future reference.

Thanks for sharing all of that work (I feel out of breath just going through them!).




bentley wrote:
This thread will serve as an area for any ancient or modern history discussions which are referenced by Eugenides in the novel Middlesex.

Bentley







Hello Chaser,

I have not put them into any document. In fact, I was rereading the novel myself. It is chock full of references which are valuable towards not only understanding the novel itself but also the history surrounding the events. I have noticed that the book clubs going back to the beginning of this year are still listed if you go into book clubs home and scroll down.

It was a lot of work to look up the references but it helped me understand the history and people better who were cited; otherwise I would have just been skimming over events, mythological gods and goddesses without a clue to their relationships to the book or to each other.

I am glad that it helped. And if I get a chance to put it into a document, I will let you know.

Regards,

Bentley
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