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Distinguished Bibliophile
Paul_Hochman
Posts: 2,801
Registered: ‎03-23-2007
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Re: The Obscure Object

Not only dating myself but also once a patient of Dr. Raskind.



bentley wrote:


marcialou wrote:
I think it's my mistake for confusing an outcast with an outsider. The original word we used was outsider, which does not imply being shunned like an outcast. So I agree with both of you. Truman Capote certainly must have been an outsider, if not to some degree an outcast, in Monroeville Alabama.

Lots of us are outsiders in one way or another. Members of racial, religious, and sexual minorities, even when they are 99% integrated into the larger society, are outsiders on some occasions. This doesn't make us outcasts. Cal was an outsider not an outcast.

Furthermore, it's not surprising that outsiders should often be innovators and artists. It takes an outsider to see things differently from more conventional insiders.

Sorry. I thought I was being clever, but I wasn't. I hope the conversation was at least a little interesting.

Marcia

Message Edited by marcialou on 07-17-2007 05:23 PM




Very interesting Marcia and definitely no need for any apologies..but I think Paul has dated himself because I did not have a clue who Renee Richards was? (lol)

And that was interesting in of itself!

And mediocrity is always more of the same..so innovators and artists always stand out and may be standing on the fringes or ahead of the pack. I guess being different is not bad depending upon what being the same as everyone else connotes?


Frequent Contributor
bentley
Posts: 2,509
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
0 Kudos

Re: The Obscure Object



PaulH wrote:
Not only dating myself but also once a patient of Dr. Raskind.



bentley wrote:


marcialou wrote:
I think it's my mistake for confusing an outcast with an outsider. The original word we used was outsider, which does not imply being shunned like an outcast. So I agree with both of you. Truman Capote certainly must have been an outsider, if not to some degree an outcast, in Monroeville Alabama.

Lots of us are outsiders in one way or another. Members of racial, religious, and sexual minorities, even when they are 99% integrated into the larger society, are outsiders on some occasions. This doesn't make us outcasts. Cal was an outsider not an outcast.

Furthermore, it's not surprising that outsiders should often be innovators and artists. It takes an outsider to see things differently from more conventional insiders.

Sorry. I thought I was being clever, but I wasn't. I hope the conversation was at least a little interesting.

Marcia

Message Edited by marcialou on 07-17-2007 05:23 PM




Very interesting Marcia and definitely no need for any apologies..but I think Paul has dated himself because I did not have a clue who Renee Richards was? (lol)

And that was interesting in of itself!

And mediocrity is always more of the same..so innovators and artists always stand out and may be standing on the fringes or ahead of the pack. I guess being different is not bad depending upon what being the same as everyone else connotes?







Very interesting Paul.

A write-up on a surgery she did:

http://www.putnamhospital.org/press/press_release.cfm?PressID=338
Distinguished Bibliophile
Paul_Hochman
Posts: 2,801
Registered: ‎03-23-2007
0 Kudos

Re: The Obscure Object

She actually just came out with another memoir (see below):

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbninquiry.asp?ISBN=0743290135&pdf=y&z=y




bentley wrote:


PaulH wrote:
Not only dating myself but also once a patient of Dr. Raskind.



bentley wrote:


marcialou wrote:
I think it's my mistake for confusing an outcast with an outsider. The original word we used was outsider, which does not imply being shunned like an outcast. So I agree with both of you. Truman Capote certainly must have been an outsider, if not to some degree an outcast, in Monroeville Alabama.

Lots of us are outsiders in one way or another. Members of racial, religious, and sexual minorities, even when they are 99% integrated into the larger society, are outsiders on some occasions. This doesn't make us outcasts. Cal was an outsider not an outcast.

Furthermore, it's not surprising that outsiders should often be innovators and artists. It takes an outsider to see things differently from more conventional insiders.

Sorry. I thought I was being clever, but I wasn't. I hope the conversation was at least a little interesting.

Marcia

Message Edited by marcialou on 07-17-2007 05:23 PM




Very interesting Marcia and definitely no need for any apologies..but I think Paul has dated himself because I did not have a clue who Renee Richards was? (lol)

And that was interesting in of itself!

And mediocrity is always more of the same..so innovators and artists always stand out and may be standing on the fringes or ahead of the pack. I guess being different is not bad depending upon what being the same as everyone else connotes?







Very interesting Paul.

A write-up on a surgery she did:

http://www.putnamhospital.org/press/press_release.cfm?PressID=338


New User
Nightheart
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎08-13-2007
0 Kudos

Re: The Obscure Object

[ Edited ]
Hi guys,

I am just about to write a paper on Cal´s and T.O.O´s relation in the novel itself and in the short story "The Obscure Object". Did any of you read the SS ? It was published in the New Yorker in 2002.
I read the SS first and I was wondering if anyone shared my impression that in this version it doesn´t become clear that Cal really is a hermaphrodite. When I read the novel I was surprised that the whole book is about Cal being/becoming a hermaphrodite.
The whole relation with T.O.O. suddenly becomes so much more important.
Or did I overlook things in the SS? What do you think?

Message Edited by Nightheart on 08-13-2007 07:49 AM
Frequent Contributor
bentley
Posts: 2,509
Registered: ‎01-31-2007
0 Kudos

Re: The Obscure Object



Nightheart wrote:
Hi guys,

I am just about to write a paper on Cal´s and T.O.O´s relation in the novel itself and in the short story "The Obscure Object". Did any of you read the SS ? It was published in the New Yorker in 2002.
I read the SS first and I was wondering if anyone shared my impression that in this version it doesn´t become clear that Cal really is a hermaphrodite. When I read the novel I was surprised that the whole book is about Cal being/becoming a hermaphrodite.
The whole relation with T.O.O. suddenly becomes so much more important.
Or did I overlook things in the SS? What do you think?

Message Edited by Nightheart on 08-13-2007 07:49 AM




Elsewhere, it was posted (interviews with Eugenides) that the book went through changes in direction etc. and development over a number of years culminating in the Pulitzer prize novel Middlesex. I have never read the SS only the novel. Not sure what the reason for the change in focus but obviously it was an author related decision. What is clear within the novel is that Calliope was an hemaprodite at birth although not a known one even to herself until much later. The Obscure Object plays an important role in the puzzle. Good luck with your paper.
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