I'll just say it...I didn't mind the Agency model

[deesy58]

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Omnigeek wrote:

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DeanGibson wrote:

What's to stop each publisher from selling eBooks directly (via the Internet), and in ePub format???  What's to keep them from just cutting Amazon out of the loop for eBooks?  Remember what happened to Beta vs. VHS?  All it might take is for some publishers to offer some eBooks exclusively, and consumers just might decide that ePub and an inexpensive generic tablet is the way to go.  It seems that Google might be betting on that possibility, and I'd be astounded if the current publishing houses aren't considering that, as a backup plan ...

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Nothing -- this is what Baen does today.  I will note that Baen doesn't have the catalog that Simon & Schuster or Randomhouse do but that just gives them more strength.  When it comes to e-books, I'm not sure why the publishers even have to offer the e-edition through anything but their own website other than for the buyer's convenience.

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Very true!  But it is buyer convenience that has made companies like e-Bay, Amazon, B&N and others successful (not to mention the large brick and mortar retailers).  We want to be able to make our purchases at a single e-Commerce Web site, put our choices into a single shopping cart, and pay using a single checkout.  You know ... kinda like a store. 

[Gabriel32]

I always knew I was getting ripped off on ebooks. That's why my nook is collecting dust on my bookshelf while I buy my books from a used bookstore. I can buy 5 or so used books for the price of a single ebook.

[sirwillard]

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gobasso wrote:

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sirwillard wrote:

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DeanGibson wrote:
The business entry cost to an eBook content seller is remarkably low.  If B&N goes away (I don't think they will, but it matters not), and Amazon prices go up, someone else (perhaps many entrants) will enter the market.

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 The problem here is DRM. If Amazon can eliminate competitors through under pricing, they can then raise the prices with little worry that a competitor will enter the market to challenge them. The entry cost might be remarkably low, but since the competitor won't be compatible with the DRM they'll find it nearly impossible to persuade customers away from Amazon.

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Unless, of course, the competitor offers a best-selling, must read book and won't sell it on Amazon. Then all the Kindle customers will be out of luck.

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Yes, 90% of the market will be out of luck, and that 10% that's left will be crowing about the "must read book". Seriously, in this situation the book couldn't become best-selling, because the majority of the market will be locked in to Amazon. Even if a best-selling author, who's new book is likely to be a best seller, if they chose to not sell it on Amazon in this situation, wouldn't be able to sell a book. Why not? Because "everyone" owns a Kindle. The Kindle won't work with this non-Amazon book, because it wasn't sold through Amazon and doesn't have the Amazon DRM, so is not supported. So to buy this "must have book" most people would also have to buy another reading device. How likely do you think they are to do that?

[sirwillard]

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Gabriel32 wrote:
I always knew I was getting ripped off on ebooks. That's why my nook is collecting dust on my bookshelf while I buy my books from a used bookstore. I can buy 5 or so used books for the price of a single ebook.

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You're not getting ripped off with eBooks. How much have you spent on your used bookstore? I bet I've spent a lot less on eBooks and have a lot more books to show for it. It's quite possible we even have the some of the same titles. There are a LOT of cheap, very discounted and free eBooks available. I've got over 600 titles in my library now, and I've only purchased maybe 30 or so, and most of those at great discounts. If you want to read a best seller or new release, you're going to pay a dollar or two less (typically) for an eBook than what you're likely to be able to get the DTB for, because those typically aren't found in your used bookstore. So I simply don't buy the "I'm getting ripped off" argument, no matter what angle you come at it.

[AlanNJ Inspired Bibliophile]

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Gabriel32 wrote:
I always knew I was getting ripped off on ebooks. That's why my nook is collecting dust on my bookshelf while I buy my books from a used bookstore. I can buy 5 or so used books for the price of a single ebook.

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And you didn't check e-book prices prior to purchasing an e-reader?  You're not getting "ripped off".  Personally I haven't purchased a DTB since purchasing my first Nook.  If you don't like e-books that's fine but don't claim you're getting "ripped off" if you didn't check e-book pricing prior to purchasing the reader.

[sub_rosa]

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Omnigeek wrote:

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sub_rosa wrote:

The ebook industry blossomed in the retail-model (pre-agency) era, and it will thrive again.  It allows companies like Kobo to once again offer discounted prices to compete with the big boys.  $9.99 is probably a good price point for new releases - and the publishers and authors should just get used to it.  Music artists did, and people still make music.

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Just how often did Kobo offer ebooks under cost to compete with Amazon?  How much of that do you think they can support?

I happen to think creative people will find a way to thrive no matter which model is used but don't spread misinformation to support your philosophical point.

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Maybe you weren't around when the wholesale-retail model was in place.  I often shopped around all the different sellers for the best price.  Lots of time it was Kobo - they used creative sales discounts to lure me away from B&N and Sony.  Back then, shopping around made sense because retailers weren't having their prices dictated to them by the publishers.  Since the agency model was put in place, I don't think I've bought a single book from Kobo - no reason to.  Now that at least some of the publishers have agreed to stop their illegal practices, comparison shopping in the e-book market will once again make sense.

What "misnformation" are you referring to exactly?  And what is my "philosophical point?"  I'm not following you.

[javabird]

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gobasso wrote:

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Unless, of course, the competitor offers a best-selling, must read book and won't sell it on Amazon. Then all the Kindle customers will be out of luck.

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That's not likely to happen. 

[keriflur]

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javabird wrote:

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gobasso wrote:

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Unless, of course, the competitor offers a best-selling, must read book and won't sell it on Amazon. Then all the Kindle customers will be out of luck.

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That's not likely to happen. 

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With the way the tension is racheting up between Amazon and the pubs, it very well may happen.  We'll have to wait and see how this all plays out over the next few months.

I recall a pretty insane amount of drama around the Sookie Stackhouse book when Penguin and Amazon couldn't come to terms last time.

[Coaxial_Creatu…]

I didn't have a problem with the Agency Model, but I don't think the settlements are going to be the death of the publishing industry as the CEOs of the publishing houses would have us believe, either.

I'm not sure it'll be the death of Nook, either.   People who prefer Nook to Kindle seem quite loyal and vica versa.   Not only that, who says that all the prices will drop to loss leaders?   Does anyone truly believe that Amazon was going to lose money forever on eBooks?

[Coaxial_Creatu…]

Let's not forget that Amazon tried to fight the Agency Model, to the point that they weren't going to carry the books, and in fact cut off MacMillian.   The *customers* complained, to the point where they relented.   Amazon's big company statement is to be the most customer-centric company and they will listen when large masses of people say, 'we want our books at any prices'.   There's no doubt in my mind that they'll find a way to secure the bigger books, or enough of them that they keep the majority of the customers happy. It's what they set out to do.

It does give the publishers a little bit of leverage, as well.  

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keriflur wrote:

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javabird wrote:

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gobasso wrote:

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Unless, of course, the competitor offers a best-selling, must read book and won't sell it on Amazon. Then all the Kindle customers will be out of luck.

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That's not likely to happen. 

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With the way the tension is racheting up between Amazon and the pubs, it very well may happen.  We'll have to wait and see how this all plays out over the next few months.

I recall a pretty insane amount of drama around the Sookie Stackhouse book when Penguin and Amazon couldn't come to terms last time.

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