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Inspired Bibliophile
deesy58
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


patgolfneb wrote:
MDM7, I am not sure why you ressurected this thread? I missed the constitutional right to lowest price evey time clause. This issue has spawned multiple threads in the past. Those who have made carefull comparisons have found instances where different sellers, not just BN or Amazon have the lowest price or availabilty. BN occasionally is much more. I feel expectations are unreasonable on this issue. Is there any other product or retail channel where a seller has the best price every time? If you live in a place with multiple grocery chains are their prices identical? I expect generally competitive pricing, I feel BN meets this test. Just like grocery stores there are booksellers with coupons or price match policies if that is your priority. Of course just like ads, googleing, or comparison trips you are paying with your time, your choice though.


Whether it's actually true or not, I don't know, but most Americans seem to believe that Wal-Mart always has the lowest prices.  :smileyindifferent:

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afalcao
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

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Ya_Ya
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

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Irishelf
Posts: 242
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

I still find B&N ebooks to be generally more expensive than Amazon.  I have found many free ebooks on Amazon and other book sellers that B&N charges for (Perception, Island of Fog 1, Hollowland, and Oddily, to name a few).  I am really into YA and animal fantasy (especially cats), and most often Amazon's prices are lower (sometimes significantly, as in the Hunger Games trilogy) and has more availability of titles (especially in the animal fantasy category).  Plus, when browsing for free books, Amazon has much less Erotica and short stories (which I don't think should even be called ebooks).  And B&N's website is often sluggish and sometimes doesn't work correctly (says no ebook available when you put in the title, but comes up if you put in the author or if you attempt a search again).  And B&N wonders why they are losing money!

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afalcao
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

[ Edited ]

______________________________________________

Ya_Ya wrote

This article is three years old. 

__________________________________________________________

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. Just go to the New York Times web site and compare the prices on the best seller list, or compare any book I guess, the sad thing is, all books that I'm interested are cheaper for the Kindle .

 

I almost bought the nook book bellow, but when I compared the prices I gave up

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians.

Nook - $10.99

Kindle - $7.99

 

I have three Nooks and I'm very disapointed.

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keriflur
Posts: 6,832
Registered: ‎01-05-2010

Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


afalcao wrote:

______________________________________________

Ya_Ya wrote

This article is three years old. 

__________________________________________________________

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. Just go to the New York Times web site and compare the prices on the best seller list, or compare any book I guess, the sad thing is, all books that I'm interested are cheaper for the Kindle .

 

I almost bought the nook book bellow, but when I compared the prices I gave up

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians.

Nook - $10.99

Kindle - $7.99

 

I have three Nooks and I'm very disapointed.


Maybe you should have done your homework before buying three(!) nooks.  Just sayin'.

Doug_Pardee
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


afalcao wrote:

 

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians.

Nook - $10.99

Kindle - $7.99


As I've pointed out numerous times over the past 3-1/2 years, B&N's e-book business concentrates on fiction. Non-fiction titles are limited and not particularly well-priced.

 

Not to say that fiction pricing is always the best, but it's better than non-fiction e-book pricing at B&N.

 

[What was that company that B&N bought to start its e-book business? Oh yeah, it was Fictionwise.]

 

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Ya_Ya
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


afalcao wrote:

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. 


It's not in the slightest accurate.

 

While the books you want may still be less expensive for Kindle than anywhere else, Amazon can longer sell ebooks at a loss willy nilly.  They will need to at least cover their cost on ebooks and the agreements referenced in that article are null & void.

 

Your observation that those books are less expensive is valid, timely and accurate.  This article as proof/evidence/possible cause isn't.

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deesy58
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

[ Edited ]

Ya_Ya wrote:

afalcao wrote:

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. 


It's not in the slightest accurate.

 

While the books you want may still be less expensive for Kindle than anywhere else, Amazon can longer sell ebooks at a loss willy nilly.  They will need to at least cover their cost on ebooks and the agreements referenced in that article are null & void.

 

Your observation that those books are less expensive is valid, timely and accurate.  This article as proof/evidence/possible cause isn't.


Why do you say this?  It is certainly NOT true that Amazon can no longer sell books at a loss willy nilly.  In fact, ANYBODY can sell books at a loss if they choose.

 

If you believe that Amazon might somehow be bound by the court ruling in the DOJ v. Apple Computer case, I don't think that Amazon was a party to the suit, or to any agreement or settlement.

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Tim40744
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

[ Edited ]

afalcao wrote:

______________________________________________

Ya_Ya wrote

This article is three years old. 

__________________________________________________________

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. Just go to the New York Times web site and compare the prices on the best seller list, or compare any book I guess, the sad thing is, all books that I'm interested are cheaper for the Kindle .

 

I almost bought the nook book bellow, but when I compared the prices I gave up

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians.

Nook - $10.99

Kindle - $7.99

 

I have three Nooks and I'm very disapointed.


BTW, Amazon now has the book at $10.44.

 

I was going to say, Google Play has it for $7.99...I'm not certain it's the same book.

 

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sygram
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Re: Why Nook eBooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

I've had luck with getting prices lowered by emailing B&N customer service to notify them of the price difference.

I, of course, get the auto-form letter saying they don't price match, etc but then with in a week or so the price is lowered.  Coincidence or because I and possibly others email them, I can't say.


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keriflur
Posts: 6,832
Registered: ‎01-05-2010

Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


deesy58 wrote:

Ya_Ya wrote:

afalcao wrote:

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. 


It's not in the slightest accurate.

 

While the books you want may still be less expensive for Kindle than anywhere else, Amazon can longer sell ebooks at a loss willy nilly.  They will need to at least cover their cost on ebooks and the agreements referenced in that article are null & void.

 

Your observation that those books are less expensive is valid, timely and accurate.  This article as proof/evidence/possible cause isn't.


Why do you say this?  It is certainly NOT true that Amazon can no longer sell books at a loss willy nilly.  In fact, ANYBODY can sell books at a loss if they choose.

 

If you believe that Amazon might somehow be bound by the court ruling in the DOJ v. Apple Computer case, I don't think that Amazon was a party to the suit, or to any agreement or settlement.


Actually, no, Amazon cannot.  FT explains the situation well in reply 16 in this thread:

 

http://bookclubs.barnesandnoble.com/t5/NOOK-Talk/Amazon-announces-Kindle-MatchBook/m-p/1472989#M3699...

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afalcao
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

My point is, regardless DOJ's antitrust lawsuit or Amazon can sell ebooks at a loss, BN eBooks are more expensive for now and most people compare prices before they buy. The book I mentioned above has a price difference of $3.00 for a relatively low price book, I'm providing the links for anyone double check.

 

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians

Amazon price..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0195325419/ref=s9_wish_gw_d8_g14_ir02?ie=UTF8&colid=3BEB5ANZPWSKB&c...

 

BN Price

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/fall-of-the-roman-empire-peter-heather/1005789237?ean=9780195325416

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Tim40744
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

[ Edited ]

afalcao wrote:

My point is, regardless DOJ's antitrust lawsuit or Amazon can sell ebooks at a loss, BN eBooks are more expensive for now and most people compare prices before they buy. The book I mentioned above has a price difference of $3.00 for a relatively low price book, I'm providing the links for anyone double check.

 

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians

Amazon price..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0195325419/ref=s9_wish_gw_d8_g14_ir02?ie=UTF8&colid=3BEB5ANZPWSKB&c...

 

BN Price

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/fall-of-the-roman-empire-peter-heather/1005789237?ean=9780195325416


I'm glad you posted this, I was looking at the wrong book. This book is available from Google Play for $7.99. BTW, Doug is correct, B&N has never been particularly competitive with nonfiction books. I usually end up purchasing at another vendor for those.

 

Edit: I finally solved the confusion (on my part). This edition was published by Pan Books in 2010 and the other edition was published by Oxford in 2005. Oddly, Amazon is still selling both editions. You see that a lot in paper books, I don't recall seeing it happen with ebooks.

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Irishelf
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

I have seen that nonfiction books tend to be more expensive than fiction books compared to other sellers.  But how does B&N  get away with charging for ebooks that are supposed to be free?  I have found many ebooks (especially in the YA category) that other sellers offer for free, yet B&N charges for them.  I paid for an ebook from B&N, only to have it stated in the first few pages that it was a FREE copy.  After that, I started comparison shopping when I saw an ebook that looked promising.  On many occasions, only B&N was charging for the book-the other sellers offered it for free (including Apple).  Perception, Island of Fog, Oddily, and Hollowland are some examples of this.  And of course, there was also the big difference in price between Amazon and B&N for the Hunger Games trilogy (B&N charged the most, while most other sellers prices ranged in between).  I now most often buy my ebooks through Amazon.  Usually the only time I buy from B&N is when the price is the same, but that is mostly because it's hard to find Amazon gift cards where I live and I don't like to use my credit card to buy ebooks!

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bklvr896
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


afalcao wrote:

My point is, regardless DOJ's antitrust lawsuit or Amazon can sell ebooks at a loss, BN eBooks are more expensive for now and most people compare prices before they buy. The book I mentioned above has a price difference of $3.00 for a relatively low price book, I'm providing the links for anyone double check.

 

The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and the Barbarians

Amazon price..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0195325419/ref=s9_wish_gw_d8_g14_ir02?ie=UTF8&colid=3BEB5ANZPWSKB&c...

 

BN Price

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/fall-of-the-roman-empire-peter-heather/1005789237?ean=9780195325416


I don't comparison shop before I buy for a couple of reasons.  I find it much more convenient to have all my books in one place, it saves me from accidentally buying a book I already have (which I have done on more than one occasion) and, I refuse to buy ebooks from Amazon.  I would rather pay a little more and try and help to ensure we have choices in where we buy eBooks, than feed the greedy Amazon machine and find myself one day with no choice.

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deesy58
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


keriflur wrote:

deesy58 wrote:

Ya_Ya wrote:

afalcao wrote:

 

The article is three years old and it still accurate. 


It's not in the slightest accurate.

 

While the books you want may still be less expensive for Kindle than anywhere else, Amazon can longer sell ebooks at a loss willy nilly.  They will need to at least cover their cost on ebooks and the agreements referenced in that article are null & void.

 

Your observation that those books are less expensive is valid, timely and accurate.  This article as proof/evidence/possible cause isn't.


Why do you say this?  It is certainly NOT true that Amazon can no longer sell books at a loss willy nilly.  In fact, ANYBODY can sell books at a loss if they choose.

 

If you believe that Amazon might somehow be bound by the court ruling in the DOJ v. Apple Computer case, I don't think that Amazon was a party to the suit, or to any agreement or settlement.


Actually, no, Amazon cannot.  FT explains the situation well in reply 16 in this thread:

 

http://bookclubs.barnesandnoble.com/t5/NOOK-Talk/Amazon-announces-Kindle-MatchBook/m-p/1472989#M3699...


Cannot what?  Cannot sell at prices below cost?  Just because FT asserts something, does that make it a fact? 

The only things I was able to find about retail pricing in the settlements with the publishers were the following:

"Under the settlement agreements, the publishers must end their e-book agency agreements with Apple within seven days of final judgment. They must also end any contracts with other e-book retailers that prevent them from setting their own prices or include most-favored nation (“MFN”) clauses that guarantee that retail competitors are not receiving better terms. Additionally, under the settlements, distribution provisions limiting retailers’ ability to set e-book pricing are banned for several years."

http://www.mydistributionlaw.com/2012/09/court-approves-doj-antitrust-settlement-with-three-e-book-p...

Also:

"Under the proposed Penguin e-book settlement, Penguin "will be prohibited for two years from entering into new agreements that constrain retailers' ability to offer discounts or other promotions to consumers to encourage the sale of the Penguin's e-books," and must submit to "a strong antitrust compliance program" that includes telling federal officials about any joint e-book ventures or any communications with other publishers, Justice Department officials said."

http://www.topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/lawsuit-news/3255-doj-settles-with-penguin-in-e-b...



Or, in the DOJ's own words:

"Under the proposed settlement agreement with Hachette, HarperCollins and Simon & Schuster, they will terminate their agreements with Apple and other e-books retailers and will be prohibited for two years from entering into new agreements that constrain retailers' ability to offer discounts or other promotions to consumers to encourage the sale of the publishers' e-books.  The settlement does not prohibit Hachette, HarperCollins and Simon & Schuster from entering new agency agreements with e-book retailers, but those agreements cannot prohibit the retailer from reducing the price set by the publishers."

http://www.justice.gov/atr/public/press_releases/2012/282133.htm


Tell me where it says in these reports that Amazon, or any other retailer, for that matter, is not free to set its own prices -- at any level they wish! 

FT cited no sources whatsoever for his assertions, making it appear likely that they were simply pulled from the air (or some other dark place) and you chose to believe them ... 

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bklvr896
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

 

 

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-199921.html

 

http://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/print/20121217/55163-retailers-now-offering-agency-2.html

 

 

 

While retailers can apply discounts at any time under so-called Agency 2, new agreements mandate the “aggregate amounts of the discounts during any twelve (12) month period must be less than or equal to the total commission earned on sales of the publisher’s e-books in such twelve month period.” A retailer called it a “cumulative maximum discount; you can’t go below cost. I can sell e-books for 99% off for a time as long as I stop before I go over 30% off over the course of a year’s sales.” The retailer said the settling publishers are also setting up shorter periods, from a month to 90 days, during which time they will monitor any retailer price discounts to prevent overdiscounting.

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deesy58
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?


bklvr896 wrote:

 

 

http://www.mobileread.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-199921.html

 

http://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/print/20121217/55163-retailers-now-offering-agency-2.html

 

 

 

While retailers can apply discounts at any time under so-called Agency 2, new agreements mandate the “aggregate amounts of the discounts during any twelve (12) month period must be less than or equal to the total commission earned on sales of the publisher’s e-books in such twelve month period.” A retailer called it a “cumulative maximum discount; you can’t go below cost. I can sell e-books for 99% off for a time as long as I stop before I go over 30% off over the course of a year’s sales.” The retailer said the settling publishers are also setting up shorter periods, from a month to 90 days, during which time they will monitor any retailer price discounts to prevent overdiscounting.


Thanks for the links.

 

It appears that both of these articles refer to a newer form of "agency model," rather than to the previously-used "wholesale model."  Why should retailers agree to any sort of agency model at all?  This new so-called "Agency 2" model is still an attempt by publishers to dictate retail prices and, as such, is probably just as illegal as the first one. 

 

The Department of Justice's own words state that publishers "... will be prohibited for two years from entering into new agreements that constrain retailers' ability to offer discounts or other promotions to consumers ..."  In addition, the DOJ says that "agreements cannot prohibit the retailer from reducing the price set by the publishers."

 

There appears to be nothing in this language about any cost averaging, quarterly prices or anything else.  If any single publisher offers such a contract to any individual retailer, such a contract might be legal.  If all of the publishers offer the same terms to all retailers, then that sounds an awful lot like the same sort of collusion that got them into hot water in the first place.

 

The precise language of the consent agreements does not seem to be readily available on the Internet at this time.  If you have found it someplace, I'd be interested in seeing it. 

 

Selling below cost is an American tradition.  I am not aware of any agreement or judge's approval that can change American law, and it has never been illegal to sell below cost.  I suppose that the Congress and the President could change this, but I wouldn't hold my breath ... 

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bklvr896
Posts: 4,818
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Re: Why Nook ebooks are more expensive than Amazon Kindle?

The agency model isn't illegal in and of itself, in fact, the DOJ  states that somewhere, it was the "collusion" that was illegal.  There's nothing inherently illegal about the publisher being the seller and using the retailer as the agent or distribution channel and paying a commission.

 

i would guess the retailers have agreed to this new model because both BN and Amazon still state that the publisher is the seller.

 

i also believe the agreement with DOJ allows them to return to the agency model in five years If they want to.