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Distinguished Bibliophile
deemure
Posts: 3,933
Registered: ‎12-28-2009

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...


richardwrite25 wrote:

If we take "deviant" to mean what it means, i.e., "deviating from the norm," how can homosexuality NOT be considered to be deviating from the norm?  I mean, my brother is left-handed, and I'll admit that this deviates from the norm.


Of course you know there's a big difference between calling someone a deviant and saying someone deviates from the norm.  Deviant today connotes a malignant force that desires to do some harm with their perversity.  It is used to describe pedophiles and the like and to reference the lowest form of humans within our society.  Nobody wants to be called a deviant.  That is obvious.

"I still believe in spite of everything that people are good at heart." Anne Frank.
Inspired Wordsmith
yocalif
Posts: 817
Registered: ‎01-03-2011
0 Kudos

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...

[ Edited ]

Nice try bookgirlJJ, you already stepped in it when you decided to comment in the first thread, no one twisted your arm.  First let me acknowledge that I respect your status as a college prof. and the effort it takes to achieve such a position.  However that doesn't mean I have to agree with you. You will have to bear with me, I haven't the word smith skills to be brief or concise and most certainly not elegant.

 

In fact I think the misinformation that you are spouting is either gleaned from a very narrow specific view point, and actually is intellectually dishonest.  scosgt's example is  "Heather has two Moms", or "Daddy's Roommate", how about "Children of the Rainbow" are in various public school sex-ed curriculums, these are products of agenda driven effort which is "philosophical saturation" that "anything goes as long as it doesn't hurt anyone." 

 

No one said "erotica" was being taught, that was your clever alteration to distract from alternate lifestyles, which is being taught.  Further you hinge your next statement as a counter to the word deviant "biology has proven that homosexuality is NOT a form of deviance".  You did this for two reasons, first you historically understand the classification of deviant for certain kinds of behavior. You already know one does not have to go back too many years reading psychology text books or professional psychology reference books to know which acts were included as deviant.  Next to move your argument beyond judgment and opinion, you state that "science has proven that homosexuality is not deviant behavior", and "These are facts, regardless of your personal opinions".  Again while your claim is popular it is not science there are two scientific camps and one does not agree with you.  Thus for you to state one conclusion without mentioning the other is either intellectual dishonesty, or worse as a very educated person with mastery of words you intentionally mislead those not so informed knowing many cave-in this PC world.

 

Of course you couldn't help yourself from responding, it was your duty, just as you would stop someone kicking a dog, or beating a child, " I have seen young people destroyed by the kind of statements and implications in your post, so I could not help but respond."  After all allowing a bigot to spout his misinformation is a so dangerous that it destroys people.  A little drama never hurts a bad story.  Give us a break this isn't the Jenny Jones show (ref Scott Amedure), this is a comment that people took sides, a direct reflection of America.  It is so obvious which side is lacking tolerance.

 

Your final expertise as a master of manipulation was your Red Herring to divert attention from the discussion, adding to my other offenses that I am violating the intent of this forum with such discussions. 

" I was hoping that it would be a fun place to chat with others who share my love of reading and the Nook Color, but my experience here suggests otherwise."

 

The beauty of your expertise is that you conveyed so much with so few words.  I wish I had half your ability.

 

NOTE to all, thanks for keeping the discussion fairly open, if I offended anyone or was overly  derogatory, please PM me and point out my error.  

 

This bigot is off to bed  6am here

Inspired Wordsmith
beeyebickiebuy
Posts: 514
Registered: ‎03-21-2011

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...

You know, yocalif, you could have avoided all of this if you had used one or more emoticons to let us know that your original post was not a serious statement or thought.  

Inspired Wordsmith
yocalif
Posts: 817
Registered: ‎01-03-2011
0 Kudos

Re: Accused of PC.. in hate-filled world...

[ Edited ]

deemure, you wrung out of my comment every possible denigrating comment you could manage.  Further when I point out how really denigrating your comments are when drawn out, you explode with even more insults.  

 

Was the original comment controversial?  Yes!

Could I have exercised better discretion or taste?  Yes!

 

What could you have done better?

 

Notice deemure, I am not bothering to tear through your reply line by line.  I don't want to go tit for tat with 10 posts and your 10 replies.  I have stated previously I appreciate your opinions (even when I disagree), and even appreciate your responses on this topic including the over the top comments.  If you were my sister and we had this discussion I wouldn't think any less of you for your opinion on this topic, however that doesn't mean I agree with you.  Thus we agree to disagree, and I look forward to reading other posts by you in other threads.



Inspired Wordsmith
yocalif
Posts: 817
Registered: ‎01-03-2011
0 Kudos

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...

You know, yocalif, you could have avoided all of this if you had used one or more emoticons to let us know that your original post was not a serious statement or thought.  

 

True...

 

However often the best humor has a semblance of the truth.

 

As I open up in this tread each has to decide which is perception and which is reality.

Distinguished Bibliophile
deemure
Posts: 3,933
Registered: ‎12-28-2009

Re: Accused of PC.. in hate-filled world...


yocalif wrote:

deemure, you wrung out of my comment every possible denigrating comment you could manage.  Further when I point out how really denigrating your comments are when drawn out, you explode with even more insults.  

 

Was the original comment controversial?  Yes!

Could I have exercised better discretion or taste?  Yes!

 

What could you have done better?

 

Notice deemure, I am not bothering to tear through your reply line by line.  I don't want to go tit for tat with 10 posts and your 10 replies.  I have stated previously I appreciate your opinions (even when I disagree), and even appreciate your responses on this topic including the over the top comments.  If you were my sister and we had this discussion I wouldn't think any less of you for your opinion on this topic, however that doesn't mean I agree with you.  Thus we agree to disagree, and I look forward to reading other posts by you in other threads.




I have merely stated in as explicit a manner what I found offensive and you have repeatedly torn apart what all people have said and replied "tit for tat" as you call it, you have even done so with partial quotes of mine.  If you did respond in that manner with my posts you would not be able to show where I exploded with insults, because I did not. 

 

What is problematic is that you cannot see what was offensive in what you said since it was meant "humorously".  Many things are often said that way, but that does not mean they still are not offensive.  If you feed me rotten food, it does not taste any better if you smile while doing it.

 

I have pointed out what was problematic with what you said.  I have often posted things only to have you say you can't even bother to read my lengthy posts.  Pot, kettle.  I have posted in threads only to have you say that the thread has gotten way off topic and shouldn't have and that people shouldn't do such things or similarly that threads have gotten too political or what have you.  Pot, kettle.  You say I bloviate.  Pot, kettle.

"I still believe in spite of everything that people are good at heart." Anne Frank.
Inspired Wordsmith
yocalif
Posts: 817
Registered: ‎01-03-2011
0 Kudos

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...

Deviant today connotes a malignant force that desires to do some harm with their perversity.  It is used to describe pedophiles and the like and to reference the lowest form of humans within our society.

 

Prove IT!  You said it, now prove that is what is ment in Sociological viewpoints or definitions.

 

 I have yet to read anywhere in current definitions of the word deviant that says, deviance refers to behavior or persons that are defined as deviant by social norms, and is synonymous with behavior of the lowest of human acts.

 

Nice try deemure, sensationalize the word with a definition that is NOT even close to accurate.

 

Correspondent
retiefBD
Posts: 140
Registered: ‎04-15-2011

I need a new Emoticon .....

[ Edited ]

Sardonicus wrote:

roustabout wrote:

 

Now, the very prettiest of my sheep and I have a bucket of Crisco to attend to :smileyhappy:


:smileyvery-happy::smileyvery-happy::smileyvery-happy:

Stop it!

Ewe're going too far.




I have 2 words for you, Enumclaw Washington, go look it up, I'm too lazy.  And I've already heard all the stories, but I know none of the actors ......... (why, oh why, is there not a "Tsk-Tsk-Tsk emoticon when I need one?????)

Distinguished Bibliophile
roustabout
Posts: 3,687
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: I need a new Emoticon .....

[ Edited ]

YC (and I think RW?):  on the use of deviant:

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/deviant

 

The second group of definitions are important to at least remember that many use, whether you use or admit to using them yourself or not. 

 

"a person whose behaviour, esp sexual behaviour, deviates from what is considered to be acceptable "

 

In american political discourse, deviant almost always connotes a value judgement on what is acceptable.  That use is why some people simply don't believe political rhetoric which claims not to care what deviants do behind closed doors. The use of the term undercuts the claim of disinterest.

 

When the title of a post refers to "gay erotica"  and the first sentence of a post refers to "that crap," there's actually no way to get around the linkage.

 

If my reactionary uncle had said that to me, I would have known what he was saying from his tone. 

 

But he certainly wouldn't have pretended that he was not talking about sheep erotica when I brought it up and he said "would you please stop teaching that crap to my wife?"

 

Oh, and here is a quote worth masticating  over:

 

"There is no such thing as a value-free concept of deviance; to say homosexuals are deviant because they are a statistical minority is, in practice, to stigmatize them. Nuns are rarely classed as deviants for the same reason, although if they obey their vows they clearly differ very significantly from the great majority of people."

"no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution.
Inspired Wordsmith
yocalif
Posts: 817
Registered: ‎01-03-2011
0 Kudos

Re: I need a new Emoticon .....

All points are worth considering, and I have read them all carefully.

 

This is my final post on this thread, I think we covered it, and I had my chance to respond.

 

Time to move on to some lighter threads.

Inspired Wordsmith
beeyebickiebuy
Posts: 514
Registered: ‎03-21-2011
0 Kudos

Re: I need a new Emoticon .....


yocalif wrote:

All points are worth considering, and I have read them all carefully.

 

This is my final post on this thread, I think we covered it, and I had my chance to respond.

 

Time to move on to some lighter threads.


Nooooooo!  Don't leave us hanging like that!

 

 

Distinguished Bibliophile
deemure
Posts: 3,933
Registered: ‎12-28-2009

Re: Accused of a Hate Crime.. in PC world...

 


yocalif wrote:

Deviant today connotes a malignant force that desires to do some harm with their perversity.  It is used to describe pedophiles and the like and to reference the lowest form of humans within our society.

 

Prove IT!  You said it, now prove that is what is ment in Sociological viewpoints or definitions.

 

 I have yet to read anywhere in current definitions of the word deviant that says, deviance refers to behavior or persons that are defined as deviant by social norms, and is synonymous with behavior of the lowest of human acts.

 

Nice try deemure, sensationalize the word with a definition that is NOT even close to accurate.

 


Don't pretend that you meant the simplest, most benevolent version of the word.  That is beneath you.  You know how you meant it, everyone knows how you meant it.  You used it in the most common understanding of the word today.  And you know that.  Please.  You can't unring the bell. 

"I still believe in spite of everything that people are good at heart." Anne Frank.
Distinguished Bibliophile
phoneboy
Posts: 1,904
Registered: ‎12-04-2010

Re: Accused of PC.. in hate-filled world...


scosgt wrote:

When my daughter was in school, a private school that I paid for, she was INDOCTRINATED with that old classic: "Heather has two Moms".

 

Please give me a break, he is correct. It is crap. It is a group imposing its "morals" on the rest of us.

 

Rant over.



Sorta like prayer and the Pledge of allegiance in schools?

 

 

FWIW I don't care either way. There are SOOOO many influences in this world. Its up to the parent/parents to talk with their children and make sure that they can make an educated and informed choice on what they believe. (they being the children. Parents force their beliefs as well)

 

As to the reporting of ANY thread, WTH is it that makes people ignore the choice of moving to another thread if the content is not to their liking.  CHANGE THE CHANNEL

 

If someone is following you from thread to thread intentionally trying to offend that's a reporting issue.

 

Like a bunch of snotty little hall monitors

 

As always  JMHO

Don 't interfere with somethin' that ain't bothering you none. ~Unknown
Frequent Contributor
Mack_the_Knife
Posts: 297
Registered: ‎12-21-2010

Re: Accused of PC.. in hate-filled world...

 

    


♥ Children make you want to start life over
Inspired Wordsmith
chuck4prez
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎04-29-2011
0 Kudos

Re: if a coin lands on it's side, is it heads or tales?

[ Edited ]

The way I see it, both sides of this particular argument shifted from debating moral positions to playing tug of war with a word.  Words have multipule meanings. that's why the dictionary is so thick.  Sometimes both sides have to share a word.  So basically the two sides were arguing about something I would consider profound, though I'll stay firmly seated on the fence, and shifted to semantics. Why? because both sides are right and both sides are wrong. Both sides are supporting their cases with more opinions and less facts. I never understood the practice of that, but I'm a pretty liniar thinker.

 

The other thing I don't understand is how is it that people get so upset or offended over what other people say on the internet?  Why does it matter what other people think? call me anything you want, not hurting my fellings none. I could care less what you all think about me, especially since none of you even know my first name.:smileyindifferent:So I choose not to report anything. Nothing's bothering me. 

 

otoh, those of you that do report stuff, no judgement against you because the way I see it, you are entitled to your vote on what kind of community you want here, and reporting what you don't like is a good way of doing that.

 

So I'm going to go on saying whatever I like, and encourage others to do the same, and defending people I dont necessarily agree with just because the other side is just as wrong. The issue is about preference, not right and wrong, and when that point was made, it was overlooked by the opposing side.

 

I say this to everybody: Your opinions,tastes, preferences demographics, upbringing, influences, and beliefs DO NOT make you special, and DO NOT make you right. They ONLY make you unique. Know the differences.

 

And wake up mack! there will be no sleeping in my classroom!

 

ok, game on.

Wordsmith
Sardonicus
Posts: 380
Registered: ‎05-11-2010
0 Kudos

Shear terror

[ Edited ]

retiefBD wrote:
I have 2 words for you, Enumclaw Washington, go look it up, I'm too lazy . . .

 

:smileysurprised:
I did look it up.  Now, I think I'm a little spooked that you even knew about it.:smileyvery-happy:

 

Speaking of frightening, which is scarier?

That 17 states don't have laws against bestiality OR that such laws are needed in the first place?:smileyindifferent:

 

(That guy can try to re-define "deviant" all he wants. 

He won't pull the wool over my eyes!)

 

 

 





The people who live in a golden age usually go around complaining how yellow everything looks.

- Randall Jarrell








Distinguished Bibliophile
roustabout
Posts: 3,687
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

Re: Shear terror

Why are more laws "needed?"

 

The authorities in Washington had no cruelty case  I'm just not getting the need thing as evidenced by this case, although it was a case that was discussed with much hilarity in many corners of the internet when it was reported.

 

(One of my favorite slugs from the Wikipedia article is about the sherriffs being surprised that the Seattle Times would even report the cause of death of Kenneth Pinyan.) 

 

This is an excellent piece of local reporting: 

 

http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Content?oid=30811

"no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution.
Inspired Wordsmith
chuck4prez
Posts: 722
Registered: ‎04-29-2011
0 Kudos

Re: scissorphobia


roustabout wrote:

Why are more laws "needed?"

 

The authorities in Washington had no cruelty case  I'm just not getting the need thing as evidenced by this case, although it was a case that was discussed with much hilarity in many corners of the internet when it was reported.

 

(One of my favorite slugs from the Wikipedia article is about the sherriffs being surprised that the Seattle Times would even report the cause of death of Kenneth Pinyan.) 

 

This is an excellent piece of local reporting: 

 

(see original post for link)

 


Roustabout, that is the most distasteful yet hard to argue against article I have ever read. And in my own state!  A well earned laurel for you.

 

Inspired Scribe
Doreenpv
Posts: 1,872
Registered: ‎11-15-2010

Re: Accused of PC.. in hate-filled world...

Bingo +1 Phoneboy

 

"As to the reporting of ANY thread, WTH is it that makes people ignore the choice of moving to another thread if the content is not to their liking.  CHANGE THE CHANNEL"