Why do free NOOKbooks require a credit card number when no purchase is necessary? [ Edited ]

[geertm]

I really do not get it.

Amazon has the most restrictive DRM available, but no-one complains.

B&N has the least restrictive DRM available, the only DRM that has no technical restrictions that prevent you from sharing the books. And not only do people complain, they even call the DRM draconian!

I suppose you can do nothing but admire Amazon's PR department

[NyTeMair]

I'm sorry I did not see your reply in another thread, I usually only have a short time online before I am forced to step away from the computer and being new to the forums here I need to re-find that thread.

Thank you for offering your assistance, are you with B&N? Yes I am 'griping' as I talked myself blue with B&N to no avail so 'griping' is all I have left. The system you speak of is unjust and not at all fully, or even partialy, explained to customers prior to purchase. So if you are kind enough, and have the ability to remedy this situation I will stop 'griping' and allow you to speak.

[NyTeMair]

I share your frustration as do MANY others I've talked to.

[Haleakala_LKB]

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Wylee wrote:
<snip>

Then i read on this discussion panel that if for some reason i get a new cc, all my previously purchased ebooks and apps will be gone.

<snip>

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This did not happen to me. All of my previously purchassed content is there. And as an added back up plan, I do have all downloaded onto my computer. 

[NyTeMair]

As long as you have a valid credit card on file with them you can have access to books you have purchased in the past.

[NyTeMair]

It is draconian in that they take away your access to books you have already purchased if at any point in the future they can't access your credit card! Seem fair to you?

[Ya_Ya]

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NyTeMair wrote:
It is draconian in that they take away your access to books you have already purchased if at any point in the future they can't access your credit card! Seem fair to you?

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They give it back when you do have a valid credit card again  And if your book files are backed up to a PC, they can't take access to them away.  You can always sideload and unlock with the (now invalid) credit card number on your account when you downloaded.  Your failure to back them up isn't B&N's fault.

There's nothing "draconian" about it.  If you prefer a different DRM, Kindle and all of the other epub sellers have options you might prefer.

[keriflur]

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NyTeMair wrote:
It is draconian in that they take away your access to books you have already purchased if at any point in the future they can't access your credit card! Seem fair to you?

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Yep.

You agreed to the terms of service, therefore anything B&N does within the ToS is fair.  If you don't like the terms you don't have to buy the books.  And if you backup, you don't actually have this problem.  So BACK UP YOUR BOOKS.

I have never had this problem.  I could pull my card off my account today, sync my nook with my account, and STILL have all my books.  Because I backed them up and can sideload them at will.  Like I've said to you ad nauseum, there are ways to get what you want within the system.  All you'd have to do to learn those ways is to stop complaining and start asking questions.

[NyTeMair]

I'm happy for you that you backed up your books to evade B&N's draconian DRM but my wife was simply using her Nook they way it was sold. It's interesting that you people rail along about how fair it is and yet you claim to circumvent the DRM... Whatever, we are still pissed and will make our feelings well known to the aformentioned government agencys as well as any other venue that will impact on B&N's business.

[NyTeMair]

No, not really, and it is admittedly our fault for not having an attorney explain in laymans terms all the fine print in every tos the public goes through every day. That having been said, we are still going to make our feelings well know.

[geertm]

We are not circumventing the DRM.

The reason you cannot download your books from B&N without a valid credit card is because without a credit card the books cannot be encrypted by the DRM system. And the publishers do not allow B&N to sell their books without DRM protection.

If you make a backup copy of you ebooks, those backup copies are still protected by the DRM and you can only read them if you know the credit card name and number to unlock those books.

This is not circumventing the DRM. B&N's social DRM has the big advantage that you can read those backup copies on as many devices as you want, without ever needing B&N or B&N's DRM server ever again.

You would not be able to do this with Kindle books. Because Kindle books are tied to the hardware ID of one specific device. And a backup copy of a Kindle  book can only be read on that specific device. If you want to read a Kindle book on another device, you will have to login that device to your Kindle account and download a new copy using Amazon's DRM server, tied to that specific device.

A backup copy of an Aobe DRM book can only be read on a device that is authorized for the same Adobe ID it was downloaded with, using Adobe's DRM server.

Now perhaps you see what is so great about B&N's social DRM. After downloading a book once, that book is yours to read forever (as long as a compatible hardware/software reader exists), without ever needing an DRM server or online connection again. Even if B&N and its DRM server would no longer exist, you would still be able to read your books on any compatible hardware/software reader.

By the way you need to backup your ebooks with every bookstore (no just B&N), because no bookstore (those annoying terms of service again) guarantees that your books will always be available for downloading.

[Ya_Ya]

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NyTeMair wrote:

... It's interesting that you people rail along about how fair it is and yet you claim to circumvent the DRM... 

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Now I understand the problem.  You can't read.  Nobody said they were circumventing the DRM.  We all are using the DRM - as intended and marketed - to our advantage.

If you don't like the credit card requirement, you have options with other sellers.  I don't mind the credit card requirement because the B&N DRM is the most flexible currently in common use - and with that credit card requirement, I can legally share books with those to whom I am close.

Go ahead.  Be "pissed", but know that being "pissed" and yelling about something you should have known reflects far more poorly on you than it does the intended target.   

[keriflur]

This seems to be the classic "I don't understand the system, therefore the system must be wrong" situation.

With the exception of making old .pdb files readable on the nook, there's very little reasonable activity that one can't do within (i.e. without circumventing) B&N's DRM.  You can share, backup, and sideload your books without ever breaking DRM.  You can read them on as many devices as you want (B&N says a limit of 6 but it's not enforced).  You can even read them on certain non-B&N devices, such as the Pandigital reader, and in applications for Android and ipad, meaning that you can read them on just about every tablet out there right now.

What you can't do - post the book on a torrent site for strangers to download for free (which is also illegal), change the file format, or re-download from B&N when you don't have a credit card on file (and geertm has explained why very well above).

It seems more important to you to complain than to learn, which is sad.  Don't cut off your nose to spite your face.  You've bought all these books; why not learn how to get the most from them?

[ProfReader]

It's apparent that reading comprehension is not a prerequisite for reading. This topic has been explained over and over and still does not penetrate.

[NyTeMair]

This is the last time I will bother, but the problem is they can take away what you have already paid for and downloaded to your Nook if at any time in the future they don't have access to ANY credit card. When asked they did not tell us anything about it other than it was required to setup the account and purchase boooks. Period.

[NyTeMair]

One last time, I don't care about sharing what we purchased, just reading it on the Nook. They don't require THAT same credit card to decode it, they just want access to ANY credit card even after you have downloaded it... And yes if you are making it so that if they take away your access to the books you already purchased and downloaded by keeping a copy elsewhere and not allowing your device subsequent wifi access, you are thwarting it.

[NyTeMair]

quite...

[keriflur]

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NyTeMair wrote:
And yes if you are making it so that if they take away your access to the books you already purchased and downloaded by keeping a copy elsewhere and not allowing your device subsequent wifi access, you are thwarting it.

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Um, again, NO.

And methinks DNFTT, so I won't anymore. 

[NyTeMair]

It would appear that I am not the only one who thinks that I am correct. The commitee at our church, hearing from me the issue we had as well as from people claiming it is all cool like you guys agreed with me and chose not to purchase 86 Nooks and went with another vendor. I went so far as to ask them to check out B&N's TOS as well as the alternatives as well as calling customer service to get a feel for how they treat people. Now is it that all these people are just stupid like me? Or maybe you just have not had the same dealings with B&N as we have, yet...

[kamas716]

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NyTeMair wrote:

It would appear that I am not the only one who thinks that I am correct. The commitee at our church, hearing from me the issue we had as well as from people claiming it is all cool like you guys agreed with me and chose not to purchase 86 Nooks and went with another vendor. I went so far as to ask them to check out B&N's TOS as well as the alternatives as well as calling customer service to get a feel for how they treat people. Now is it that all these people are just stupid like me? Or maybe you just have not had the same dealings with B&N as we have, yet...

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Wait...the committee heard from you and from a representative of B&N?  Or, you and just some other people in the congregation that think that having a valid CC on file is good business sense to use online media when the media is encumbered with DRM?

As far as your congregation purchasing ereaders, that's up to your congregation.  Not all products are designed to meet every need.  It's always best to be informed.  I hope your church got the product that they felt was the best value for them, irregardless of vendor.

I don't recall anyone calling you stupid.