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We will continue to provide you with books that make you turn pages well past midnight, discover new worlds, and reunite with old friends. And we hope that you’ll continue to tell us how you’re doing, what you’re reading, and what books mean to you.

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CrediCardsSuck
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎12-23-2011
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Credit Card required (?)

I just bought my daughter a Nook and she is very happy with it.
I am not so happy.

I also bought her a gift card so whe could use to purchase books without having my credit card connected to the Nook.  But, B&N still requires that my credit card be connected to the Nook to even purchase a book with a gift card.

ITunes does not require that I connect my credit card to an account.
ITunes only requires a ITunes gift card. 

Why does B&N?

Is there anyway around this?

 

 

Frequent Contributor
readley
Posts: 45
Registered: ‎06-15-2010
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

I don't think there is any way around it. However, when I set up my daughter's nook (I haven't given it to her yet), I was able to require a password before any purchase. She won't be able to charge to my credit card without asking me to input the password. She is only 8, so I want to keep an eye on the books she is buying anyway. Another option might be to get a prepaid credit card and put that on your daughter's account.
Frequent Contributor
geertm
Posts: 1,188
Registered: ‎02-09-2010

Re: Credit Card required (?)


CrediCardsSuck wrote:

I just bought my daughter a Nook and she is very happy with it.
I am not so happy.

I also bought her a gift card so whe could use to purchase books without having my credit card connected to the Nook.  But, B&N still requires that my credit card be connected to the Nook to even purchase a book with a gift card.

ITunes does not require that I connect my credit card to an account.
ITunes only requires a ITunes gift card. 

Why does B&N?

Is there anyway around this?

 

 


B&N's DRM uses the credit card number and name to encrypt the books. B&N's DRM is a social DRM. That means there are no technical restrictions that prevent you from copying a book. But that anyone who want to read a book needs to know the credit card number and name the book was encrypted with. Information you probably do not want to share on the Internet.

The big advantage of this is that can your share your books with family and friends by just making a copy of the ebook file.

Unlike Kindle your books are not tied to the hardware of a specific device. And unlike Adobe DRM your books are not tied to an Adobe ID. After downloading them, your books do not depend on an DRM server anymore.

 

You can password protect shop purchases on the Nook device.

New User
CrediCardsSuck
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎12-23-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

Thanks for the detailed answer,
If I understand it correctly...

1. My credit card number is tied to the books I download.
2, There is nothing restricting my daughter from sharing the book with her friends.
3. There is nothing restricting her friends from sharing the book with their friends.
4  The "book" gets hacked and my credit card is comprimised.

Can I opt-out of the "social" DRM?
I don't think it is very smart to have a social DRM based on a credit card.


How does the I-Tuner DRM work?  Is it "social"?
I prefer it because it doesn't require a credit card.
I would gladly give up the "social" aspect to not have borrowed books tied to my credit card number.
I think we should at least have an option.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Frequent Contributor
geertm
Posts: 1,188
Registered: ‎02-09-2010
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Re: Credit Card required (?)


CrediCardsSuck wrote:

Thanks for the detailed answer,
If I understand it correctly...

1. My credit card number is tied to the books I download.
2, There is nothing restricting my daughter from sharing the book with her friends.
3. There is nothing restricting her friends from sharing the book with their friends.
4  The "book" gets hacked and my credit card is comprimised.

Can I opt-out of the "social" DRM?
I don't think it is very smart to have a social DRM based on a credit card.


How does the I-Tuner DRM work?  Is it "social"?
I prefer it because it doesn't require a credit card.
I would gladly give up the "social" aspect to not have borrowed books tied to my credit card number.
I think we should at least have an option.

 


Your credit card information is not included in the books, and also not stored on the device. Your credit card information is used to generate a key. That key is included in the books, and stored on the device. The key is generated with a one-way encryption process. The key cannot be used to generate the credit card details it was created with.

B&N's DRM is the least restictive, and most futureproof DRM available at the moment.

 

DRM is used to limit the sharing of a book. A social DRM uses information you probably do not want to share much (in this case your credit card information) to limit the sharing of a book, instead of technical limitations. The big advantage of this is that is allows you to share your books in a limited way with family and friends.

A Kindle book can only be shared by letting people connect their Kindle to your Kindle account (where they will have access to your full account). An Adobe DRM book can only be read on a device authorized with your Adobe ID. A device can only be authorized to one ID, and you can only authorize a device six time.

As far as I know the Apple DRM ties your books to your Itunes account. You can only read the books on a Apple device that is registered to your Itunes account.

Distinguished Bibliophile
RHWright
Posts: 1,613
Registered: ‎10-21-2009

Re: Credit Card required (?)


CrediCardsSuck wrote:

Thanks for the detailed answer,
If I understand it correctly...

1. My credit card number is tied to the books I download.

 

"Tied," in the sense that it is the master key to unlock the DRM on the book. The CC info is not included in the download, so there is no way for it to be reverse engineered or hacked.

 

2, There is nothing restricting my daughter from sharing the book with her friends.

 

If by share, you mean send around an unreadable file, then yes. That's the point of the social DRM/credit card rationale. You would need to trust your daughter with your CC#. She in turn would need to be foolish enough to share that with her friends.

 

3. There is nothing restricting her friends from sharing the book with their friends.

 

See response above.


4  The "book" gets hacked and my credit card is comprimised.

 

No.


Can I opt-out of the "social" DRM?

 

No.


 



At least that's my understanding of how the DRM works. I haven't "popped open the lid" to remove it or just to confirm how it works. But based on discussions here and elsewhere, your CC information should remain secure. Well, as secure as that sort of thing can be in this day & age.

Frequent Contributor
MarvinQ
Posts: 69
Registered: ‎10-18-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

[ Edited ]

Easy solution, buy a prepaid credit card then.

 

 

Frequent Contributor
thatdbaclk
Posts: 33
Registered: ‎12-26-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

Pre-paid is the Easy solution but not all and it to me (an over 10 year Online shopper).the best!

 

When I purchased in lat 2010 B&N has since added the second CC option due to this issue! No one thought to think of  this in the initial design?

             Credit Cards Expire, Get Canceled, or let alone you don't use it anymore or have a new account! Even worse gets hacked/stolen (been there, done that too..Why I won't store my CC on WALLY WORLD any more and I'm particular about ONLINE SHOPPING Sites where I CAN)!

 

1. You Buy Pre-Paid CC (the Catch here is to put as little as possible, because Monthly fees could be associated with it!).

2. You add the Gift Card,  then money will be taken from it first, if the account is set up correctly)......

 

Then you Drain the Pre-Paid Gift Card! But guess what you going to need it later!

 

When you Archive a Book then  you even need a Valid CC to UnArchive (so use/get a device to store your books and invest in learning this software...bottom line you going to need another computer)

Calibre (http://calibre-ebook.com/) which is available for Windows (Supported version as of 2012), APPLE OS X, and LINUX. Has very Good Review and comes highly rated! for management of you library (books).

 

I have yet to decide how I'm going to deal with the firmware updates and Application Software...but I'm going to start keeping that too!....So my advice is that you review and clearly know what to expect when firmware updates become available! Mines would be do I need it before do I want it but for I install it!

 

I would also check and insure that the Lend Feature does not require use of the CC (I don't plan on using this), crazy I know but B&N didn't want lose their money in the air! Not to mention I suspect this may also deal with how they applied DRM to are epubs!

 

Technology is a Wonderful thing, but sometimes people can just go too far in holding your hand on using it!

Another Android Device (Nook Color)! Looking forward to the day I can use One Device Big Enough Screen Wise for: Phone and Surfing the Net.....this NC is Just Right!
Frequent Contributor
thatdbaclk
Posts: 33
Registered: ‎12-26-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)


Correction here: "you review and clearly know what to expect when firmware updates become available! My questions would be: 1. Do I need it?  2.  Or is just do I just want it? before I install it!...

Technology is a Wonderful thing, but sometimes people can just go too far in holding your hand on using it!


 

Another Android Device (Nook Color)! Looking forward to the day I can use One Device Big Enough Screen Wise for: Phone and Surfing the Net.....this NC is Just Right!
Contributor
NyTeMair
Posts: 19
Registered: ‎07-24-2012
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

[ Edited ]

Another big problem is that talking to customer support then their supervisor I am made aware that at random 'your' nook will check to see if you have a valid credit card and deny you access to books you have already purchased!! Not archived, currently reading! That is taking away ownership and/or usage rights from me and giving it to B&N! This was not explained to us prior to 'purchasing' a book from B&N, they are only renting you the book and the device.

 

I plan to file complaints with the BBB, and both our state and federal AG's offices. Other companies are much less invasive. My wife is in dialysis and spends most of her time there reading her nook, the damned thing locked up the other day and we had to go get it replaced. I thought it was great it was under warrenty, she goes in to do her dialysis and can't access her books because our credit card was stolen and we are waiting for them to send a new one. So now she is out of luck for the next couple weeks and can't read any of the books we purchased/rented for her. In talking to B&N they refuse to do anything to help other than tell us to get a valid credit card! I'm done with them, and pissed enough to cause a lot of trouble...

Correspondent
Strayer
Posts: 653
Registered: ‎05-28-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

Any company would freeze the account. The cc that's on the account now is invalid, if the cc has been stolen. With a stolen cc, someone can run up charges and you'd have to untangle that mess. You have to have a new cc that is valid on your account in order to have access. Once you enter the cc card number and it is valid, you will have everything back.
Contributor
NyTeMair
Posts: 19
Registered: ‎07-24-2012
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

We canceled the credit card, and the problem isn't putting new charges on the card it is simply having access to ALREADY purchased books. They don't need to have a valid credit card available to them so that I can read my book I bought 5 months ago!
Distinguished Scribe
Ya_Ya
Posts: 3,334
Registered: ‎09-29-2010
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Re: Credit Card required (?)


NyTeMair wrote:
They don't need to have a valid credit card available to them so that I can read my book I bought 5 months ago!

And if you have all of the books backed up onto your PC and know the (now invalid) card number, you can read them without ever putting a valid card on your account.

Inspired Scribe
kamas716
Posts: 1,386
Registered: ‎09-28-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)


NyTeMair wrote:

Another big problem is that talking to customer support then their supervisor I am made aware that at random 'your' nook will check to see if you have a valid credit card and deny you access to books you have already purchased!! Not archived, currently reading! That is taking away ownership and/or usage rights from me and giving it to B&N! This was not explained to us prior to 'purchasing' a book from B&N, they are only renting you the book and the device.

 

I plan to file complaints with the BBB, and both our state and federal AG's offices. Other companies are much less invasive. My wife is in dialysis and spends most of her time there reading her nook, the damned thing locked up the other day and we had to go get it replaced. I thought it was great it was under warrenty, she goes in to do her dialysis and can't access her books because our credit card was stolen and we are waiting for them to send a new one. So now she is out of luck for the next couple weeks and can't read any of the books we purchased/rented for her. In talking to B&N they refuse to do anything to help other than tell us to get a valid credit card! I'm done with them, and pissed enough to cause a lot of trouble...


I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your credit card. That sucks.  And, it is very annoying not having access to your "purchases".  But, from B&N point of view, not having a valid credit card  on file is good business practice not to authorize any more activity.

 

But, you might not get too far with the BBB.  The Terms of Service state B&N is basically just leasing the books/magazines to you and can change the terms at will.  This is why it's always good practice on the users part to back up their files.  I personally have my eBooks backed up on my laptop in a separate file from where Nook for PC stores them, and on a flash drive.  Some people also strip the DRM from their files so they don't have to worry about being locked out by any particular vendor (the legality on this is murky, so act on your own risk).

 

Hope things work out for you and your wife.

http://www.goodreads.com/kamas716
Bibliophile
bklvr896
Posts: 4,781
Registered: ‎12-31-2009

Re: Credit Card required (?)


NyTeMair wrote:

Another big problem is that talking to customer support then their supervisor I am made aware that at random 'your' nook will check to see if you have a valid credit card and deny you access to books you have already purchased!! That doesn't make sense because the currently downloaded books will be attached to another cc. If you turn off the wifi it cant check. You could side load the books and unlock with the stolen card number until you get a new card.

Frequent Contributor
readley
Posts: 45
Registered: ‎06-15-2010
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

I can understand why you are frustrated. In addition to downloading the books to your computer and side-loading them (calibre is a good program for that--you can find it online), you could also add a prepaid credit card with a small amount of money on it to your account. That way, you could access your current books with no problem and even continue to download the BN free friday books if you wanted.
Contributor
NyTeMair
Posts: 19
Registered: ‎07-24-2012
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

Thank you for kind words. Can you point me to the terms of service online so I can research it? Thank you!
Inspired Scribe
kamas716
Posts: 1,386
Registered: ‎09-28-2011
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Re: Credit Card required (?)


NyTeMair wrote:
Thank you for kind words. Can you point me to the terms of service online so I can research it? Thank you!

here's a place to start

 

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/include/terms_of_use.asp

 

 

 

http://www.goodreads.com/kamas716
New User
TrishPel
Posts: 1
Registered: 3 weeks ago
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Re: Credit Card required (?)

I also take issue with the requirement of a credit card on file. Especially in this day and age of identity security. I notified Visa and was told the following: To report merchant practices that you feel are inappropriate, you may wish to contact the Global Customer Care Services at 1-800-VISA-911 (1-800-847-2911). Please advise them that you were referred to file a complaint. The staff will be able to initiate a complaint form over the phone.
Correspondent
Byteguy
Posts: 572
Registered: ‎06-10-2011

Re: Credit Card required (?)


TrishPel wrote:
I also take issue with the requirement of a credit card on file...

Then, get a pre-paid credit card and use that.  B&N HAS to have a CC on file to create the protection lock that the publishers require them to put on books or else they can't sell you the e-book.  It's not that B&N is being mean (as has been pointed out many times over the years) it's that they need SOME way to connect a purchase to a person so Penguin can sue you if they see you posting all your books for everyone to read for free.

 


TrishPel wrote:
...Especially in this day and age of identity security....


Sorry, I had to laugh at that.  I have had two cards compromised; one by my supermarket and one BY THE BANK THAT ISSUED THE CARD.  B&N is the least of your worries.  If you see unusual charges, dispute them in a timely manner and you aren't responsible.  Credit cards are much safer and easier to deal with than debit-cards when it comes to issues like this.