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Wordsmith
PJLLB
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Re: Google Play on nook!


DeanGibson wrote:
...

 

However, a basic root of the Nook Tablet (or Color, etc) will allow most of the apps to be visible, install, and work from Google Play.

 


Will this action of "a basic root" void the NT warranty?

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borlogs
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Re: Google Play on nook!

=test=

=test=

:catwink:

DeanGibson
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Re: Google Play on nook!


PJLLB wrote:

Will this action of "a basic root" void the NT warranty?


Technically, yes.

Nooks: 2 HD+/16GB, 2 HD/8GB: B&N 2.2.0 rooted; Color: B&N 1.4.3 rooted
    2 Touch (one Ltd. Ed.): B&N 1.2.1 rooted; 1stEd/3G: B&N 1.7.0 rooted
Dell Venue 8 Pro: Windows 8.1; Samsung Galaxy Tab2 7.0": Android 4.2.2 rooted
LG G Pad 8.3 Android 4.4.2; Acer Iconia A500: Android 4.0.3 rooted
Customer loyalty is earned, not commanded or deserved, and easily lost.
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justpink65
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎05-24-2012

Re: Google Play on nook!

what is CM7 ? just got my nook tablet and so frustrated.. Was told "your not restricted to just amazon like kindle u can get apps from anywhere. so far i cant figure out how. google play wont let me download anything and tells me its already installed.. like my facebook app. because i had a smart phone that came preloaded with it. I just want to be able to search and upload apps.. but nook store is so limited. and very few free apps. idk i may end up returning it and getting a kindle my son has less trouble with it. i went with nook tablet because of expandability. and i love my original nook.. :smileysad:

Wordsmith
PJLLB
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Re: Google Play on nook!


justpink65 wrote:

what is CM7 ? just got my nook tablet and so frustrated.. Was told "your not restricted to just amazon like kindle u can get apps from anywhere. so far i cant figure out how. google play wont let me download anything and tells me its already installed.. like my facebook app. because i had a smart phone that came preloaded with it. I just want to be able to search and upload apps.. but nook store is so limited. and very few free apps. idk i may end up returning it and getting a kindle my son has less trouble with it. i went with nook tablet because of expandability. and i love my original nook.. :smileysad:


You can either use an SD card that runs CM7 (a version of Anrdoid that works on the NT that can be purchased or downloaded from a number of companies such as AndroidForNook.com).  This will come with full access to the Google Play Store and other sources, such as the Amazon Apps for Android.   This provides a dual-boot capability that allows you to root either to CM7 or NT native.  Or "root" your NT using a variety of methods that allows use of google play, but this is more complicated and voids the warranty.  An external CM7 card does not.

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Reisnice
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Re: Google Play on nook!

[ Edited ]
To answer your original question, CM7 is a popular version of the, 'generic' Android operating system which has been adapted for many different smartphones and tablets. You typically buy a memory card and, once you insert it, your Nook Tablet will actually turn into a tablet, less the features, like cameras, that it doesn't have. You can download the Android Nook or Kindle readers to read, or many apps from non-Nook stores online. It will also allow you to switch back to looking like a 'normal' Nook Tablet. The two most popular cards are AndroidForNook and N2A, which you can find discussions of on the forum. If you are more adventurous, you can also download the files and create your own card for free.
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Computatoe
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Re: Google Play on nook!

when you root a device, doesnt that void any kind of warrenties you might have and if you have trouble with device would you still be able to go to any B&N store and have them help you? that is one of the reasons i choose NOOK over the Kindle (have a brick building i can go to for help)

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orb9220
Posts: 1,199
Registered: ‎06-16-2010

Re: Google Play on nook!

[ Edited ]

Computatoe wrote:

when you root a device, doesnt that void any kind of warrenties you might have and if you have trouble with device would you still be able to go to any B&N store and have them help you? that is one of the reasons i choose NOOK over the Kindle (have a brick building i can go to for help)


Nope as the SD card version like the N2A or Androidfornook versions. The OS is on the SD card. .And can dual boot to either the untouched B&N side or default is to boot to CM7 side. Or if you are not to technical inclined then the N2A buy option is for you.

 

Remove the SD card and you have a plain ole nook.

.

"All I Know is...Last Night the Tele-Tubbies came out of the wall and Held Me Down while they put Devices in my Head!"
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flyingtoastr
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Re: Google Play on nook!

Warranty Agreement, Section 2, part (d) "Restrictions":

 

Except as may be expressly permitted by this Agreement, you may not, directly or indirectly: 

...

(iv) bypass, modify, defeat, tamper with or circumvent any of the security features of your NOOK or the Service, including, without limitation, altering any digital rights management functionality of your NOOK or the Software;

 

I'm willing to bet bypassing the locked bootloader on a NOOK Tablet to run a boot off an SD card would trigger this clause.

 


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alienkid
Posts: 33
Registered: ‎07-03-2012

Re: Google Play on nook!

your not bypassing the BL as far as I know. It's a builtin part of the BL to attempt a SDboot isn't it?

flyingtoastr
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Re: Google Play on nook!


alienkid wrote:

your not bypassing the BL as far as I know. It's a builtin part of the BL to attempt a SDboot isn't it?


Not on the NT.

 

The NT will only boot off the SD card over the internal memory if the SD card has a specific key (hence the "locked" bootloader). Unless something has changed (and granted, I haven't even looked at how people are going about booting their NT's since January or so), you have to either reverse engineer that bootloader key (also against the TOU) or bypass it. Either way, breaking the warranty agreement, at least as I read it.

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fluffypiranha
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎06-27-2010

Re: Google Play on nook!

I agree. I prefer to purchase my books from Barnes & Noble but the selection of applications are lacking. While I am still loving my Nook Tablet, I would love to see Google and Barnes & Noble come to some agreement. I believe it would increase Nook sales
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BruceMcF
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Registered: ‎11-24-2011
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Re: Google Play on nook!

[ Edited ]

Computatoe wrote:

when you root a device, doesnt that void any kind of warrenties you might have ...


Certainly. Not with an SD card on a Nook Color, but for a rooted stock kernel on either an NC or NT, or CM7 install on a NC or an NT, or an SD card system on an NT, it voids the legal requirement to honor the warranty.

 


... and if you have trouble with device would you still be able to go to any B&N store and have them help you? ...


Pragmatically, yes, of course. If you want to hide from them the fact that the warranty has been voided, you would revert the system to stock (and/or remove the SD card) ... though if you've bollixed it up past your ability to fix it up (its very, very hard to bollix it up past AN ability to restore it to stock), you might have to look bashful and say, "aw shucks, I was doing something I saw online, and it didn't work right, can you fix it back up the way it was?"

 

C'mon, remember that these people work in a bookstore, where there are people who come in once a month and read a magazine and then go home, leaving it laying out to be reshelved ... if you ask nice, they'll fix up your gear.

 

And while corporate might not be able to say so, they know if your Nook is running, you're more likely to be buying some Nook books, so they have no real incentive to try to "crack down".

 


fluffypiranha wrote:
I agree. I prefer to purchase my books from Barnes & Noble but the selection of applications are lacking. While I am still loving my Nook Tablet, I would love to see Google and Barnes & Noble come to some agreement. I believe it would increase Nook sales

The question is whether it would increase sales of Nook books and Nook apps. Since Google is trying to also sell books, and movies, and music using Google Play, and not just Android apps, they are direct competitors with Barnes and Noble. Selling Nooks is a break-even exercise for B&N at best ~ they make their money on media sales to Nook owners.

 

That could be where speculation of the Tablet v2 running Windows8/RT comes from ... it would free B&N from having to have a dedicated app store, and thanks to their deal with Microsoft, the Metro store is not going to get into the business of selling ebooks, unless its B&N doing the selling.

Wordsmith
PJLLB
Posts: 288
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Re: Google Play on nook!


flyingtoastr wrote:

... 

The NT will only boot off the SD card over the internal memory if the SD card has a specific key (hence the "locked" bootloader). Unless something has changed (and granted, I haven't even looked at how people are going about booting their NT's since January or so), you have to either reverse engineer that bootloader key (also against the TOU) or bypass it. Either way, breaking the warranty agreement, at least as I read it.


I can't agree with your read of the warranty regarding booting from an SD card as it in no way touches or modifies the Nook software, unlike your rooting technique, which clearly violates the warranty.  I would think that the many, many people using an SD card to boot into CM7 would agree with me.

DeanGibson
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Re: Google Play on nook!

[ Edited ]

PJLLB wrote:

flyingtoastr wrote:

... 

The NT will only boot off the SD card over the internal memory if the SD card has a specific key (hence the "locked" bootloader). Unless something has changed (and granted, I haven't even looked at how people are going about booting their NT's since January or so), you have to either reverse engineer that bootloader key (also against the TOU) or bypass it. Either way, breaking the warranty agreement, at least as I read it.


I can't agree with your read of the warranty regarding booting from an SD card as it in no way touches or modifies the Nook software, unlike your rooting technique, which clearly violates the warranty.  I would think that the many, many people using an SD card to boot into CM7 would agree with me.


I agree.  FT and Bruce, note that the method used for booting an SDcard on the NT did not require reverse engineering the bootloader key.  The "brute force" technique used, was much simpler (embarassingly so).

 

Nooks: 2 HD+/16GB, 2 HD/8GB: B&N 2.2.0 rooted; Color: B&N 1.4.3 rooted
    2 Touch (one Ltd. Ed.): B&N 1.2.1 rooted; 1stEd/3G: B&N 1.7.0 rooted
Dell Venue 8 Pro: Windows 8.1; Samsung Galaxy Tab2 7.0": Android 4.2.2 rooted
LG G Pad 8.3 Android 4.4.2; Acer Iconia A500: Android 4.0.3 rooted
Customer loyalty is earned, not commanded or deserved, and easily lost.
Never suspect intent where incompetence will do.
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BruceMcF
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Re: Google Play on nook!


DeanGibson wrote:

I agree.  FT and Bruce, note that the method used for booting an SDcard on the NT did not require reverse engineering the bootloader key.  The "brute force" technique used, was much simpler (embarassingly so).


I didn't say anything regarding the method used to circumvent. Any action to circumvent is a violation of the warranty, strictly interpreted.

 

Except as may be expressly permitted by this Agreement, you may not, directly or indirectly: 

...

(iv) bypass, modify, defeat, tamper with or circumvent any of the security features of your NOOK or the Service, ...

 

It says is that any action by the user to get around the "security features" of the Nook is prohibited unless expressly allowed.

 

I've omitted the "including" because anything following "including" only strengthens the preceding language ... nothing in the phrase can relax the preceding language. Nothing in the warranty language says anything about how simple or complex the method to circumvent may prove to be.

 

OTOH, the stock Nook Color boots any bootable card, so refraining from booting a bootable card is clearly not a security feature of the Nook Color.

 

DeanGibson
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Re: Google Play on nook!

[ Edited ]

BruceMcF wrote:

DeanGibson wrote:

I agree.  FT and Bruce, note that the method used for booting an SDcard on the NT did not require reverse engineering the bootloader key.  The "brute force" technique used, was much simpler (embarassingly so).


I didn't say anything regarding the method used to circumvent. Any action to circumvent is a violation of the warranty, strictly interpreted.

 

Except as may be expressly permitted by this Agreement, you may not, directly or indirectly: 

...

(iv) bypass, modify, defeat, tamper with or circumvent any of the security features of your NOOK or the Service, ...

 

It says is that any action by the user to get around the "security features" of the Nook is prohibited unless expressly allowed.

 

....

 


Who says that booting an alternate OS is doing "any of that"?  Just because a separate OS is being booted, doesn't mean that any "security feature" is being "violated", any more than installing MS-DOS on your PC to co-exist with pre-installed Microsoft Windows is getting around the real security features of the latter (which are a bit more important than the so-called "security features" in Nook software).

 

The "security" of the Nook or B&N's servers is not being put at any risk;  the only thing that is at risk, is the lost income stream from media not purchased from B&N.

 

And while we are at it, let's look at the legality of B&N taking open-source software (u-boot), which was released under the GPL ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_U-Boot ).  The whole intent of that license is to prevent such software from being modified and then released in a form where subsequent users could not modify that software as they wished and continue to use the software in the released environment.  By digitally signing the copy of u-boot and making it difficult to modify and use in the released environment, they are in violation of the intent of the GPL.

 

As one who contributed some source code to u-boot in 2005, I take exception to B&N's high-handed tactics.  Fortunately, the level of greed in such a modification did not match the level of skill required to carry it off.

 

I am reminded of the "warranty" that Radio Shack imposed on the buyers of the TRS-80, saying that the warranty was voided if the customer opened up the computer to see the insides.  A court quickly invalidated that provision.

 

Nooks: 2 HD+/16GB, 2 HD/8GB: B&N 2.2.0 rooted; Color: B&N 1.4.3 rooted
    2 Touch (one Ltd. Ed.): B&N 1.2.1 rooted; 1stEd/3G: B&N 1.7.0 rooted
Dell Venue 8 Pro: Windows 8.1; Samsung Galaxy Tab2 7.0": Android 4.2.2 rooted
LG G Pad 8.3 Android 4.4.2; Acer Iconia A500: Android 4.0.3 rooted
Customer loyalty is earned, not commanded or deserved, and easily lost.
Never suspect intent where incompetence will do.
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deesy58
Posts: 2,486
Registered: ‎01-22-2012

Re: Google Play on nook!


DeanGibson wrote:

BruceMcF wrote:

DeanGibson wrote:

I agree.  FT and Bruce, note that the method used for booting an SDcard on the NT did not require reverse engineering the bootloader key.  The "brute force" technique used, was much simpler (embarassingly so).


I didn't say anything regarding the method used to circumvent. Any action to circumvent is a violation of the warranty, strictly interpreted.

 

Except as may be expressly permitted by this Agreement, you may not, directly or indirectly: 

...

(iv) bypass, modify, defeat, tamper with or circumvent any of the security features of your NOOK or the Service, ...

 

It says is that any action by the user to get around the "security features" of the Nook is prohibited unless expressly allowed.

 

....

 


Who says that booting an alternate OS is doing "any of that"?  Just because a separate OS is being booted, doesn't mean that any "security feature" is being "violated", any more than installing MS-DOS on your PC to co-exist with pre-installed Microsoft Windows is getting around the real security features of the latter (which are a bit more important than the so-called "security features" in Nook software).

 

The "security" of the Nook or B&N's servers is not being put at any risk;  the only thing that is at risk, is the lost income stream from media not purchased from B&N.

 

And while we are at it, let's look at the legality of B&N taking open-source software (u-boot), which was released under the GPL ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_U-Boot ).  The whole intent of that license is to prevent such software from being modified and then released in a form where subsequent users could not modify that software as they wished and continue to use the software in the released environment.  By digitally signing the copy of u-boot and making it difficult to modify and use in the released environment, they are in violation of the intent of the GPL.

 

As one who contributed some source code to u-boot in 2005, I take exception to B&N's high-handed tactics.  Fortunately, the level of greed in such a modification did not match the level of skill required to carry it off.

 

I am reminded of the "warranty" that Radio Shack imposed on the buyers of the TRS-80, saying that the warranty was voided if the customer opened up the computer to see the insides.  A court quickly invalidated that provision.

 


Booting to a different operating system is routinely accomplished by many computer owners, and this capability has been around for a very long time.  It voids no warranties that I am aware of.  In fact, it is a commonly-used recovery technique to boot the "Knoppix" live version of the Linux operating system from  a CD, DVD or Thumb Drive in order to repair a hard disk drive on a PC with a damaged Microsoft Windows installation.  

 

Wordsmith
BruceMcF
Posts: 802
Registered: ‎11-24-2011

Re: Google Play on nook!


DeanGibson wrote:

Who says that booting an alternate OS is doing "any of that"?


That was me. I said it, right there in the comment you are replying to. The legal distinction would be whether any circumventing action is required. On any PC I've ever had, specifying the device boot order is built into the BIOS, so, out of the box, its designed to boot off of alternative media, and there is nothing to circumvent. Ditto with the NC ~ given a bootable SD card, its designed to boot off of the SD card before booting off of the internal flash.

 

However, given that the training of the staff at B&N is to get the Nook back up and running or else replace it, it doesn't matter whether it violates the terms of the warranty, strictly interpreted. Indeed, attempting to train staff to strictly enforce the warranty would likely cost B&N more, in both training costs and in time on the job, than their current practice, in which case B&N has no particular financial incentive to change their current practice.

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Cerunan
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Registered: ‎05-15-2012
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Re: Google Play on nook!

for what it's worth not only are you potentially voiding the warranty (I'm no lawyer but it seems to be pretty plain to me to be the case) but you are certainly violating the Google play license (which is why B&N wo't and can't simply allow access- see http://source.android.com/faqs.html#if-my-device-is-compatible-does-it-automatically-have-access-to-... )