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treadlefish
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎08-16-2010

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

I was looking at the Nook Tablet for 2 reasons 1. It could be sideloaded and 2. I dearly loved my version 1 Nook.

 

DH bought me an NT for Christmas and gave it to me a week early. It allowed him to download a 3rd party app that he wanted, so he went out Friday and bought one for himself.  His came in with 1.4.1, so he couldn't load his app. He took it back. Unfortunately, I let trade my Nook 1 in on his.

 

My NT upgraded itself before I could stop it. I understand there is a hack out there to restore it and I may try that, but I am REALLY steamed with B&N over this!  I am seriously considering taking it back and getting another tablet that won't get in my way or upgade itself without asking.

 

 

Distinguished Correspondent
AdamOutler
Posts: 70
Registered: ‎12-20-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

[ Edited ]

There is no effort that can enable sideloading on 1.4.1. This is the problem. Without sideloading, we cannot develop.

 

Without development, the platform goes stale. Regardless of the business model, the platform has condemned itself to being a stale platform The problem can be corrected easily. Barnes and Noble needs only to give us back what we purchased in the first place, and stop taking away what is rightfully ours. By blocking this method of adding apps, they are encouraging other development to work around the bugs which they have implemented in their platform. 

 

I can assure you that once I've finished... and I take this personally... I'm going for their Netflix certification.  I'm going to find a loophole in the entire OMAP platform.. I'm going for their pocketbook because they took away my liberty which I purchased fair and square.

 

Now that it's open, I think I like this Nook Tablet.
Mark_OB1
Posts: 1,580
Topics: 23
Kudos: 1,259
Registered: ‎12-14-2010

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

roustabout commented:

 

> I think the HTC flyer is still running Gingerbread, <

 

It is.

 

> but it too will probably be a much more difficult device for managing libraries once it is downgraded with Honeycomb or ICS. <

 

It would, however there is no requirement to do so, that I'm aware of.  AFAIK, you can leave it at GB as long as you like.  I certainly have no intention of changing OS on my EvoView4G.  What HTC has done with it is already better than HC in many ways.  Besides, I already have 2 other tablets with HC, if I care to play with that environment.

 

- Mark

 

BN_AlexG
Posts: 473
Topics: 68
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Solutions: 40
Registered: ‎09-19-2011
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Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

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droidzach
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎12-25-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

The fact that the EULA says that Barnes and Noble can push updates automatically is not the point here. It is that they removed a feature of the device without users consent. What would happen if you had an automatic Windows Update and it removed your ability to connect to the internet, and you had no way of reversing it? Pretty pissed off? To say the least....Just because it may be legal for what they did, that does not mean it is right, or that they will not lose customers or potential customers for it. Bad Move B and N very bad move!!

Reader 4
catsigh68
Posts: 2
Registered: ‎02-16-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

What a Grinch kind of deal B&N, you've stolen the joy of my Nook Tablet that I received as an Xmas present. Thanks for nothing. Who ever made this decision should be fired.

This is an example of the same attitude that drove RIM into the ground over the last several years.

Repeat after me, "THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT". Keep repeating it until you either get it & get with the program or until you finish driving the company into the ground.

One or the other is  guaranteed in the very near future.

 

Sign me Highly Disappointed

Distinguished Correspondent
Tom51
Posts: 103
Registered: ‎11-17-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

[ Edited ]

AdamOutler wrote:

Without sideloading this device is worth $50 at most.

 

I'll give it $99 - the price for Nook simple Touch as an eReader. :smileyvery-happy:

 

If there is no announcment of reenableing sideloading within 2 weeks, I will release my guide on how to turn the Nook Tablet into a Dedicated Netflix PVR and have it spammed across every technical board I can find..  I may even write a Cross-platform, open-source, Java app to go along with it. Some may call this cyberterrorisim...  I call this justice...  Either way, I want my $249.00 + shipping of nook tablet.  This is America, and in America, when someone takes our freedom, we don't take that shit.

 

I encourage every Tablet owner to consider if you are one of the two owner types - (1) Technical savvy as Adam and several others, or (2) Not technical savvy but pissed by B&N like myself.  If you are a type (1) owner, join Adams & gangs to develop and make Tablet a complete FREE device, so all present and future Tablet owners can live without the nightmare from B&N's updates FOREVER.  If you are a type (2) owner, go taking advantage of the holiday return/refund policy and return your Tablet .  Let the returns be significant enough to impact B&N's bottom line and show our voice through out financial power.

 


 

Distinguished Bibliophile
roustabout
Posts: 3,609
Registered: ‎03-31-2011

developer commitment at last, complete with deadline

Adam paints his face blue, hikes up his kilt and before screaming "freedom" says

 

"If there is no announcment of reenableing sideloading within 2 weeks, I will release my guide on how to turn the Nook Tablet into a Dedicated Netflix PVR"  

 

Cool.  A commitment to actual development on the nook tablet. And part of it is within the scope of development Adam outlines on his dev page (http://code.google.com/u/104711040110222472212/)  

 

When I mentioned that I had reservations about your candor, I was referring to your introductory remarks in this thread.  Although you may be the person who pressed the "buy now" button for your NT, your NT was purchased for you with funds raised by others.  Thus, your construction struck me as less than candid.  (Not to mention, less persuasive to me than something along the lines of "people so want to love this device, they bought me one to see what could be done.  For the average user, I'm afraid the answer is nothing unless BN reconsiders.") 

 

Less candid still, though, was the assertion that your NT was updated without your permission.  When I read that, I asked myself how dumb you thought the audience here and at BN (since obviously BN is part of the audience you're writing for) was, exactly.   Someone using your handle earlier posted a "how to block the update" over in NT support.  that person - and I swear I thought there was just the one Adam Outler here, and that was the same guy as the one on XDA - manually updated and rolled back an NT more than once, and gave a method for blocking the auto-update, as have several others, myself included. 

 

It may be good to be aware of how slowly BN can make decisions (and how quickly) and how communicative they are or are not.

 

When the Nook Color was announced, one of the advertised features was landscape mode for reading of all content.  The feature was quiely dropped, including a reedit of the website, a few months later.  The feature was finally delivered with the 1.4.1 update to the NC, more than a year later. 

 

Another feature which was being demanded but had never been advertised was parental controls.  It took, IIRC, around 9 months to begin seeing those delivered on the stock firmware.)

 

Finally, there was a content element, a sample of a cookbook, which was pushed onto the device in April or May.  

 

That sample drew tremendous ire from a lot of folks - frankly, they were as bent out of shape about that as people are now about the lack of easy sideloading.  One fellow claimed that he'd been in touch with the FTC to discuss the matter.  

 

The sample cookbook was withdrawn in the next firmware release, about 4 months later.  

 

Only one of these changes, landscape reading, was announced ahead of the release of the feature.  And landscape reading might not have been announced ahead of time had it not also been a feature of the Tablet OS - the landscape reading was essentially part of the marketing push for the NT. 

 

So, I hope you're moving well on getting the PVR stuff up, I genuinely do.  BN may announce that they've reconsidered sideloading, but their past history suggests that they probably won't announce it ahead of time (and that it'll take longer than your expected delivery date.)

 

But I hope you don't follow Mel's lead in all areas of your life. :smileyhappy:

"no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution.
New User
alreadytakenback
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎12-26-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

You're absolutely right.

Barnes and Noble were quick to refund my money when I told them they were breaking the their own policy when they disabled the sideloading.  It plainly states that I can load content not bought from B&N.

I'm just taking them at their word.

 

Distinguished Correspondent
mohawkx
Posts: 95
Registered: ‎12-21-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

[ Edited ]

roustabout makes a good case through example that the wheels of B&N spin ever so slowly, even when there are obvious glitches and fixes to be made.  What perplexes me is the speed they exhibited in plugging the sideloading gap they left in the original release.  This tells me they have a foundational policy of walling in the Tablet and they went to "Battle Stations" with their update to plug the hole.

What bothers me the most is there are already reports of people recieving nook tablets out of the box that have 1.4.1 already installed.  They don't even have the option of reverting back to 1.4.0.  This will kill the future of the machine for sure, IMO.  The average buyer of the nook T has a smart phone and access to a plethora of apps.  They will expect the same from the Tablet.  Once they find out that the B&N store looks like a Russian Bread line in winter they will become disenchanted with the device very quickly.  When the only place to buy product is at the "Company Store" and the shelves are empty, people will desert the field. 

Me....I'll hold out a little longer and see if the devs come up with a solid work around or  B&N come to their senses.  If not, it will go back and I'll get a Fire.  It appears the two devices are headed in the opposite direction.  The Fire updates are resulting in actual bug fixes and smoother operation of the device while the Nook Tablet updates are resulting in a system that is chained to an empty market for the average android user.

Distinguished Wordsmith
MWorrell
Posts: 307
Registered: ‎04-05-2010

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

My Nook Tablet is sitting here with the receipt waiting to go back to the store. I'll be ordering a Kindle Fire.

 

To those of you who continually jump up and start lecturing disappointed customers on this board by pointing to this or that policy or consumer agreement or whatever else, I have only this to say:

 

There is no piece of paper or stated policy that will win and keep a customer. Customers are kept because companies meet or exceed expectations. Having spent the past two years as a Nook owner (married to a Kindle owner), I can say that B&N is a company that ROUTINELY plays up expectations and then disappoints. The fine print will not keep customers coming back.

 

Amazon has MET, with their Kindle Fire's available content (Comixology app), the expectations I had for the Nook. I looked to B&N to secure the best content for their devices, and they failed. Sideloading was the only corrective available for their UTTER FAILURE, and they can't even see that. CLUELESS.

 

Bye, B&N.

 

 

Wordsmith
TnTexas
Posts: 883
Registered: ‎10-22-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

MWorrell: There is no piece of paper or stated policy that will win and keep a customer. Customers are kept because companies meet or exceed expectations. 

 

Very true. At the moment I'm content with my updated Tablet since I've already sideloaded the apps I really wanted but couldn't find in B&N's store. But electronic devices don't work forever; and when mine dies, I already have one foot out the door because of this issue. Buying another Nook product is not an automatic guarantee for me at the moment - whereas beforehand that is exactly what I had assumed I'd look for when the time comes. 

Contributor
_the_
Posts: 25
Registered: ‎11-16-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken


MWorrell wrote:

 

There is no piece of paper or stated policy that will win and keep a customer. Customers are kept because companies meet or exceed expectations. Having spent the past two years as a Nook owner (married to a Kindle owner), I can say that B&N is a company that ROUTINELY plays up expectations and then disappoints. The fine print will not keep customers coming back.

 


Very true.  I'm disgusted with how this played out and extremely disappointed with the way BN handled this.  Sure, they didn't expressly SAY they embraced sideloading, but they sure KNEW that it was one of the very reasons many were buying it - for the freedom it allowed over other options like the Kindle Fire.  This, in a way, amounts to a bait and switch - BN waited until the majority of buyers had done their shopping, many having bought the NT based on reviews that touted the NT's openness and flexibility,  then dumped this update just a day or two before Christmas - too fast to return the gifts.  They're hoping most won't return them, and many won't. They'll just be disappointed owners.  

 

BN thinks the Nook can be the iPad and have a closed ecosystem, but the problem here is that the Nook ecosystem is, aside from reading materials, terrible.  Even on day 1 of the iPad launch, there were more and better iPad apps available than what the Nook Tablet has available right now.  With changes like we saw this week, I don't see the app store getting a whole lot better.  This isn't a sign of a thriving marketplace like Apple's app store, it's a fearful reaction against invisible threats - I know I can definitely say I didn't download a single app from Amazon's app store that was available on the Nook store.  I only downloaded what BN doesn't feel a need to stock their app store with.  Instead of taking this as a sign, they knee-jerk react and wall off the garden - we can only have their flowers, but unfortunately most of their flowers are ugly flowers off of unwanted weeds.  What's my option?  Roll back to 1.4 and root or turn it back and get something worthy.  I don't know that I feel like fighting BN's updates so I will likely just return it, and BN permanently misses out on ALL of my money rather than only that for which they don't feel like including in their app store.

Distinguished Correspondent
AdamOutler
Posts: 70
Registered: ‎12-20-2011

Re: developer commitment at last, complete with deadline


roustabout wrote:

Adam paints his face blue, hikes up his kilt and before screaming "freedom" says

 

"If there is no announcment of reenableing sideloading within 2 weeks, I will release my guide on how to turn the Nook Tablet into a Dedicated Netflix PVR"  

 

Cool.  A commitment to actual development on the nook tablet. And part of it is within the scope of development Adam outlines on his dev page (http://code.google.com/u/104711040110222472212/)  

 


I can assure you it will only be enough to make Netflix rethink their certification process.  Netflix has certified M-Shield, and that was passed to Barnes&Nobel.. however they've left gaps in thier programming and I intend to exploit that. Not necessarily development as much as exploitation.

Now that it's open, I think I like this Nook Tablet.
Wordsmith
moose_tracker
Posts: 386
Registered: ‎12-10-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

How about this for misguided sales..

Front page for selling the 3 primary Nooks (Simple, NC, NT) First line promoting the NT Reads..

  • Everything NOOK Color has PLUS

First off Everything Nook Color has was always incorrect because it did not have a bootable SD Card.. AND (at least when we were making our purchases) the NC always allowed sideloading of apps..

 

For people to state that somewhere in some statement B&N made that they would close this, and we were suppose to have read this statement and know this was to happen.. When making a decision we talk to people who have them, read the reviews, look at the B&N promotional pages on it, talk to the sales people about it.. etc..  (at least I did..) I did not read some buisness white paper the company made to it's stock holders or wherever you saw this.. NO WHERE in any of that did B&N put on their promotional page that sideloading of 3rd party apps would not be allowed, nor did the salesperson talk to me about side loading and add (but the sideloading of apps will be discontinued as that was a mistake..)

 

I think I read once about a change might be made to stop people from rooting, but that was only one thing I read over countless things I used to research the device.. But, it only pointed sewing up the ability to root (possibly)..

 

 
 
 
 
Distinguished Bibliophile
roustabout
Posts: 3,609
Registered: ‎03-31-2011
0 Kudos

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

The NC has never allowed app side loading. To get amazon or Google's market has always required rooting. Boot from SD card has always been possible but has never been a BN marketing point.
"no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution.
Frequent Contributor
ceeotters
Posts: 45
Registered: ‎08-01-2010

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

I guess I'm just not that sensitive.  And defiinitely not techno-savvy.  I'm fine with the apps BN has, even though they cost more than Amazon and charge tax.  I'm not disgrunted or unhappy with my purchase.  I've already watched way more movies/tv shows than I anticipated.  But I will be buying an extra mini card from Amazon.  BN has a 16G for 22.95; Amazon - 10.49.  BN has a 32G for 68.95; Amazon - 31.79.

flyingtoastr
Posts: 3,011
Topics: 55
Kudos: 2,923
Registered: ‎11-11-2009

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

eThugs throwing temper tantrums are so cute.

 

"If you don't give me my way I'll hold my breath!!!"

 

lol

New User
Crazy-KD
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎12-26-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken

The Kindle Fire was never even considered by me when I was making my recent purchasing decision.  With only 8G of memory and no ability to expand the memory it was DOA.   When I was considering my NT purchase I was also looking at 10" android tablets knowing that the new Tegra 3 chips are coming out and the older tablets will dramatically drop in price.  The Asus Transformer was recently priced below $300 when I purchased my NT. 

 

The NT is going for a more savy consumer than the KF and locking down the ecosystem will simply push them away.  I purchased a NT and Simple Touch this holiday season along with planning on purchasing a second NT for our household.   I also helped sell several NTs to other people explaining the advantages of the NT.  I think it was a poor business decision to push 1.4.1 out a couple days before Christmas and I'm definitely not buying the second NT.

 

Yes you can say I'm taking my marbles and going home, but it is my money.  Instead of me using the NT as a reader (with purchases from B&N) plus apps, I'm being forced further away from B&N by this move. 

Distinguished Correspondent
AdamOutler
Posts: 70
Registered: ‎12-20-2011

Re: Sticky: Side-Loading is broken


flyingtoastr wrote:

eThugs throwing temper tantrums are so cute.

 

"If you don't give me my way I'll hold my breath!!!"

 

lol



Generally your attitude is disrespectful and counterproductive.  I'd assume you work for Barnes and Noble as you take the side of appreciating loss of liberty.

Now that it's open, I think I like this Nook Tablet.