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ConnieAnnKirk
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Registered: ‎06-14-2007
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OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

Come into "The Boar's Head" for off-topic conversation with other Shakespeare Book Club members!  Going away for awhile and won't be around the boards?  Let us know what you're up to.  See something going on that might be of interest to your fellow club members?  Let us know.  Not sure whether a topic warrants its own thread on the main board but would like to talk about it anyway?  Suggest it here, and we'll let you know or we'll keep discussing it right here. 

 

[Note:  "The Boar's Head" was one of the theaters in London (formerly an inn-yard) where Shakespeare's plays were performed.  He was also said to have frequented this and other taverns, such as The Mermaid, for refreshment, conversation, and meeting up with other writers.  Contributions of further information about The Boar's Head from members is always welcome!].

 

EnJOY!

 

~ConnieK 

~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
Distinguished Wordsmith
Everyman
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

I have to admit that I go overboard on buying versions of S's plays.  Initially, when I didn't have much money, I bought gradually the seven Everyman volumes so I had a complete set of the plays.  Then at some point somebody had the Yale one-volume Shakespeare on sale, so I bought that.  (I also have the all plays in two volumes in the Brittanica Great Books of the Western World series, but without any notes.)

 

Somewhere along the way I picked up the Bevington Complete Works which sits on my desk so I can look things up instantly without having to go over to the bookshelves.  (Also on my desk are a dictionary, the Oxford Book of English Verse (Quiller-Couch edition), and the complete Gilbert and Sullivan, which are the volumes I need to have to hand every hour of every day.)

 

But for comfortable reading, and for more comprehensive treatments of the plays, I also have one (or more) single play editions of almost all the plays.  I've been trying, and am still trying, to decide which publisher's editions I like best.  Early on I was getting mostly the Pelican editions.  Then I started getting the Arden editions, but they really have too much information and aren't as convenient for reading in bed or on a ferry.  I have at various times gotten plays in Signet, New Cambridge, World's Classics, Folger, Everyman, Penguin, and Bantam editions, and for Julius Caesar, since I didn't already have a one-volume edition of it, have ordered the Kitteridge edition to try out. 

 

But I've never found any series which I liked best.  They all seem to handle the notes a but differently.  Some have quite extensive notes on context as well as just meaning of unfamiliar words, while others just have minimal definitions.  Some have the notes as footnotes marked by line number but with no reference in the body of the text so you have to keep looking down to see whether this word or phrase is noted, some have regular line numbering every five lines but also add in line numbers for the lines that have footnotes so you know to go down and look (when there's a note for a line that would otherwise be marked anyhow, the line number is in a different font), some have a little mark by each word or phrase that has a footnote.  The Everyman has the text on the right page and the notes on the facing left page.  I still haven't settled on any one series that I think has both the best notes and the must unobtrusive but useful system for finding the appropriate notes.  

 

I admit that I go overboard, and every time I order a new edition I try to talk myself out of it because I definitely don't need another copy of any of the plays, but I usually buy them anyhow.  Just no self-control.  

 

Am I alone in this, or are there other people who will admit to this vice?

 

What editions do other people here find most useful, and why?

_______________
I think, therefore I drive people nuts.
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TiggerBear
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

A off side question, why is it I find Shakespeare much easier to read and enjoy out of a play book than regular text? Is the presentation, or something else?
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Krista
Posts: 42
Registered: ‎10-25-2006
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Re: TO (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

Hi there

 

Shakespeare plays aren't something I normally would pick up and read.  I thought I would give it a try.  I purchased the B&N edition and find that I like the way the play is presented.  The reason I like this edition is because it gives a good overview of context and that's important to me.  Editions aren't my vice but the "for further reading" is.  It never stops for me :smileywink:

 

As for my desk - I have a lot of junk on it and bills somewhere in there.  It's that time of month so I have to go digging. :smileysurprised:


Everyman wrote:

I have to admit that I go overboard on buying versions of S's plays.  Initially, when I didn't have much money, I bought gradually the seven Everyman volumes so I had a complete set of the plays.  Then at some point somebody had the Yale one-volume Shakespeare on sale, so I bought that.  (I also have the all plays in two volumes in the Brittanica Great Books of the Western World series, but without any notes.)

 

Somewhere along the way I picked up the Bevington Complete Works which sits on my desk so I can look things up instantly without having to go over to the bookshelves.  (Also on my desk are a dictionary, the Oxford Book of English Verse (Quiller-Couch edition), and the complete Gilbert and Sullivan, which are the volumes I need to have to hand every hour of every day.)

 

But for comfortable reading, and for more comprehensive treatments of the plays, I also have one (or more) single play editions of almost all the plays.  I've been trying, and am still trying, to decide which publisher's editions I like best.  Early on I was getting mostly the Pelican editions.  Then I started getting the Arden editions, but they really have too much information and aren't as convenient for reading in bed or on a ferry.  I have at various times gotten plays in Signet, New Cambridge, World's Classics, Folger, Everyman, Penguin, and Bantam editions, and for Julius Caesar, since I didn't already have a one-volume edition of it, have ordered the Kitteridge edition to try out. 

 

But I've never found any series which I liked best.  They all seem to handle the notes a but differently.  Some have quite extensive notes on context as well as just meaning of unfamiliar words, while others just have minimal definitions.  Some have the notes as footnotes marked by line number but with no reference in the body of the text so you have to keep looking down to see whether this word or phrase is noted, some have regular line numbering every five lines but also add in line numbers for the lines that have footnotes so you know to go down and look (when there's a note for a line that would otherwise be marked anyhow, the line number is in a different font), some have a little mark by each word or phrase that has a footnote.  The Everyman has the text on the right page and the notes on the facing left page.  I still haven't settled on any one series that I think has both the best notes and the must unobtrusive but useful system for finding the appropriate notes.  

 

I admit that I go overboard, and every time I order a new edition I try to talk myself out of it because I definitely don't need another copy of any of the plays, but I usually buy them anyhow.  Just no self-control.  

 

Am I alone in this, or are there other people who will admit to this vice?

 

What editions do other people here find most useful, and why?


 

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Choisya
Posts: 10,782
Registered: ‎10-26-2006
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: A Shakespearean Pub Crawl?

Hi Connie!##  Here is a old print of The Boar's Head Tavern in Eastcheap so that you know just where you would have been drawing your pint of ale:smileyhappy:. (The Mermaid Tavern burned down in the Great Fire of London in 1666:smileysad:)

 

The Boar's Head was referred to in Henry IV Act 2:3:3. (Apple-johns are withered apples, probably from the last season, not fresh ones.)  Mentioned in Henry IV Part I too but I liked the Part 2 reference better:smileyhappy:.  Boswell mentioned in his Life of Johnson too but alas! that tavern is no more:smileysad:

 

It also featured in Washington Irving's The Sketchbook of Geoffrey Crayon (published 1819-20) where Geoffrey describes the tavern thus:-

 

'Let it suffice to say, that I at length arrived in merry Eastcheap, that ancient region of wit and wassail, where the very names of the streets relished of good cheer, as Pudding Lane bears testimony even at the present day. For Eastcheap, says old Stow, "was always famous for its convivial doings. The cookes cried hot ribbes of beef roasted, pies well baked, and other victuals: there was clattering of pewter pots, harpe, pipe, and sawtrie." Alas! how sadly is the scene changed since the roaring days of Falstaff and old Stow! The madcap roisterer has given place to the plodding tradesman; the clattering of pots and the sound of "harpe and sawtrie," to the din of carts and the accurst dinging of the dustman's bell; and no song is heard, save, haply, the strain of some syren from Billingsgate, chanting the eulogy of deceased mackerel.

 

I sought, in vain, for the ancient abode of Dame Quickly. The only relict of it is a boar's head, carved in relief in stone, which formerly served as the sign, but at present is built into the parting line of two houses which stand on the site of the renowned old tavern.'

 

 

A popular pub that is still open today and which Shakespeare probably used is The George Inn in Southwark, which is near to Globe Theatre which was, in turn,  built on the site of Shakespeare's old Globe Theatre. We could have a pint and then go to see their Midsummer Night's Dream

 

 

 

 


ConnieK wrote:

Come into "The Boar's Head" for off-topic conversation with other Shakespeare Book Club members!  Going away for awhile and won't be around the boards?  Let us know what you're up to.  See something going on that might be of interest to your fellow club members?  Let us know.  Not sure whether a topic warrants its own thread on the main board but would like to talk about it anyway?  Suggest it here, and we'll let you know or we'll keep discussing it right here. 

 

[Note:  "The Boar's Head" was one of the theaters in London (formerly an inn-yard) where Shakespeare's plays were performed.  He was also said to have frequented this and other taverns, such as The Mermaid, for refreshment, conversation, and meeting up with other writers.  Contributions of further information about The Boar's Head from members is always welcome!].

 

EnJOY!

 

~ConnieK 


 

Author
ConnieAnnKirk
Posts: 5,472
Registered: ‎06-14-2007
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: A Shakespearean Pub Crawl?

I knew I could count on you for research, Choisya!  These are terrific--thanks!  Yes; I certainly do aim someday to get to The Globe in London.  What a treat that would be!

 

~ConnieK

 


Choisya wrote:

Hi Connie!##  Here is a old print of The Boar's Head Tavern in Eastcheap so that you know just where you would have been drawing your pint of ale:smileyhappy:. (The Mermaid Tavern burned down in the Great Fire of London in 1666:smileysad:)

 

The Boar's Head was referred to in Henry IV Act 2:3:3. (Apple-johns are withered apples, probably from the last season, not fresh ones.)  Mentioned in Henry IV Part I too but I liked the Part 2 reference better:smileyhappy:.  Boswell mentioned in his Life of Johnson too but alas! that tavern is no more:smileysad:

 

It also featured in Washington Irving's The Sketchbook of Geoffrey Crayon (published 1819-20) where Geoffrey describes the tavern thus:-

 

'Let it suffice to say, that I at length arrived in merry Eastcheap, that ancient region of wit and wassail, where the very names of the streets relished of good cheer, as Pudding Lane bears testimony even at the present day. For Eastcheap, says old Stow, "was always famous for its convivial doings. The cookes cried hot ribbes of beef roasted, pies well baked, and other victuals: there was clattering of pewter pots, harpe, pipe, and sawtrie." Alas! how sadly is the scene changed since the roaring days of Falstaff and old Stow! The madcap roisterer has given place to the plodding tradesman; the clattering of pots and the sound of "harpe and sawtrie," to the din of carts and the accurst dinging of the dustman's bell; and no song is heard, save, haply, the strain of some syren from Billingsgate, chanting the eulogy of deceased mackerel.

 

I sought, in vain, for the ancient abode of Dame Quickly. The only relict of it is a boar's head, carved in relief in stone, which formerly served as the sign, but at present is built into the parting line of two houses which stand on the site of the renowned old tavern.'

 

 

A popular pub that is still open today and which Shakespeare probably used is The George Inn in Southwark, which is near to Globe Theatre which was, in turn,  built on the site of Shakespeare's old Globe Theatre. We could have a pint and then go to see their Midsummer Night's Dream

 

 

 

 

~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
Inspired Contributor
Choisya
Posts: 10,782
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: A Shakespearean Pub Crawl?

Let me know when you get here Connie and I'll meet you there!:smileyhappy:

 


ConnieK wrote:

I knew I could count on you for research, Choisya!  These are terrific--thanks!  Yes; I certainly do aim someday to get to The Globe in London.  What a treat that would be!

 

~ConnieK

 


Choisya wrote:

Hi Connie!##  Here is a old print of The Boar's Head Tavern in Eastcheap so that you know just where you would have been drawing your pint of ale:smileyhappy:. (The Mermaid Tavern burned down in the Great Fire of London in 1666:smileysad:)

 

The Boar's Head was referred to in Henry IV Act 2:3:3. (Apple-johns are withered apples, probably from the last season, not fresh ones.)  Mentioned in Henry IV Part I too but I liked the Part 2 reference better:smileyhappy:.  Boswell mentioned in his Life of Johnson too but alas! that tavern is no more:smileysad:

 

It also featured in Washington Irving's The Sketchbook of Geoffrey Crayon (published 1819-20) where Geoffrey describes the tavern thus:-

 

'Let it suffice to say, that I at length arrived in merry Eastcheap, that ancient region of wit and wassail, where the very names of the streets relished of good cheer, as Pudding Lane bears testimony even at the present day. For Eastcheap, says old Stow, "was always famous for its convivial doings. The cookes cried hot ribbes of beef roasted, pies well baked, and other victuals: there was clattering of pewter pots, harpe, pipe, and sawtrie." Alas! how sadly is the scene changed since the roaring days of Falstaff and old Stow! The madcap roisterer has given place to the plodding tradesman; the clattering of pots and the sound of "harpe and sawtrie," to the din of carts and the accurst dinging of the dustman's bell; and no song is heard, save, haply, the strain of some syren from Billingsgate, chanting the eulogy of deceased mackerel.

 

I sought, in vain, for the ancient abode of Dame Quickly. The only relict of it is a boar's head, carved in relief in stone, which formerly served as the sign, but at present is built into the parting line of two houses which stand on the site of the renowned old tavern.'

 

 

A popular pub that is still open today and which Shakespeare probably used is The George Inn in Southwark, which is near to Globe Theatre which was, in turn,  built on the site of Shakespeare's old Globe Theatre. We could have a pint and then go to see their Midsummer Night's Dream

 

 

 

 


 

Author
ConnieAnnKirk
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Registered: ‎06-14-2007
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: A Shakespearean Pub Crawl?

Now that would be terrific!  :smileyhappy:

 

~ConnieK

 

 


Choisya wrote:

Let me know when you get here Connie and I'll meet you there!:smileyhappy:

 


ConnieK wrote:

I knew I could count on you for research, Choisya!  These are terrific--thanks!  Yes; I certainly do aim someday to get to The Globe in London.  What a treat that would be!

 

~ConnieK

 

 

~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
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Choisya
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Shakespeare's Wife

I thought folks might ike to read this review of rather a controversial book by the feminist Germaine Greer about Shakespeare's Wife, Anne Hathaway.

 

And here is a vidcast of her talking about it.

 

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Bolognaking
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Shakespeare's Wife


Choisya wrote:

I thought folks might ike to read this review of rather a controversial book by the feminist Germaine Greer about Shakespeare's Wife, Anne Hathaway.

 

And here is a vidcast of her talking about it.

 


 

Did you read the booki, Choisya?  If you haven't, I recommend it.  Greer is scholarly and common sense about things.  Why did Anne only get the second-best bed?  According to Greer, because the first-best one was part of the enormous price paid to secure Dr. Hall as a husband for Susanna.

 

It's a great read.

"We're actors - we're the opposite of people" - Tom Stoppard
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Everyman
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

Anybody have time to read this book on Caesar and summarize pertinent parts of it for us during the next month? 
_______________
I think, therefore I drive people nuts.
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Choisya
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Shakespeare's Wife

No I haven't read it B but I am a fan of Greer and feel sure she will make a good case. 

 


Bolognaking wrote:

Choisya wrote:

I thought folks might ike to read this review of rather a controversial book by the feminist Germaine Greer about Shakespeare's Wife, Anne Hathaway.

 

And here is a vidcast of her talking about it.

 


 

Did you read the booki, Choisya?  If you haven't, I recommend it.  Greer is scholarly and common sense about things.  Why did Anne only get the second-best bed?  According to Greer, because the first-best one was part of the enormous price paid to secure Dr. Hall as a husband for Susanna.

 

It's a great read.


 

Author
ConnieAnnKirk
Posts: 5,472
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

It would be an interesting supplement, Everyman.  Here is the BN.com link to Caesar: A Life in Western Culture

 

~ConnieK

 

 


Everyman wrote:
Anybody have time to read this book on Caesar and summarize pertinent parts of it for us during the next month? 

 

 
~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
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Peppermill
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

This may be yesterday's news to this cadre of Shakespeare aficionados, but thought I would swing by the Boar's Head for a drop and to leave behind this playbill (review) of the Cymbeline, playing through Saturday at Boscobel in Garrison, NY.

 

Pepper

"Seize the moments of happiness, love and be loved! That is the only reality in the world, all else is folly. It is the one thing we are interested in here." -- Leo Tolstoy
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Choisya
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

Thanks P, great review.  How I wish I could jet over and see it with you!:smileyhappy:.

 


Peppermill wrote:

This may be yesterday's news to this cadre of Shakespeare aficionados, but thought I would swing by the Boar's Head for a drop and to leave behind this playbill (review) of the Cymbeline, playing through Saturday at Boscobel in Garrison, NY.

 

Pepper


 

Author
ConnieAnnKirk
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: "The Boar's Head Tavern"

Thanks, Pepper!  And you're welcome to swing by the Boar's Head any time!  :smileyhappy:

 

~ConnieK

 

 


Peppermill wrote:

This may be yesterday's news to this cadre of Shakespeare aficionados, but thought I would swing by the Boar's Head for a drop and to leave behind this playbill (review) of the Cymbeline, playing through Saturday at Boscobel in Garrison, NY.

 

Pepper


 

~ConnieAnnKirk




[CAK's books , website.]
Inspired Contributor
Choisya
Posts: 10,782
Registered: ‎10-26-2006
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: 'English Delight'

[ Edited ]

Whilst you are downing a pint or two and pondering on Shakespeare's language, you might like to listen to this new 3-part series on our common heritage - the English language.

 

Cheers!

 

(And leave those great big American cars behind - no drinking and driving!:smileysurprised::smileyhappy:)

Message Edited by Choisya on 08-27-2008 07:22 AM
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Choisya
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Groundlings'

I found this good website about the Globe London with excellent pics and a lovely description of the groundlings in S's day.  I think we have already thrown an orange or two but am pleased that I can't smell you all:smileysurprised: 
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Timbuktu1
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Re: OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Groundlings'

Thanks so much!  Next best thing to being there.
RTA
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RTA
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OT (Off-Topic) Chatroom: Exploring non-traditional productions

In the thread “Stagings and Interpretations,” I had suggested those of us arguing for, or against, non-traditional interpretations of Shakespeare work actually view such a piece to flesh out our positions.  I’m wondering if there is any interest in this exercise.  And, if so, which piece people would want to watch? 

 

I think basic prerequisites for selections could be: (1) it is available on film; (2) it, for the most part, preserves the original dialogue (as nobody is championing pieces that significantly change dialogue); and (3) it is decidedly a non-traditional production.  If there are other qualifications for selections that I missed, let me know.

 

So far, three films have been offered that, as far as I know, fill the aforementioned conditions: the 1995 Richard III, with Sir Ian McKellen; the 1999 MND, with Kevin Kline; and the 1990 Titus, with Anthony Hopkins.  If there are other suggestions, or those that I missed, please let me know.  If you are interested in participating in the exercise with one of the films already suggested, please let me know that.

 

I do hope there is interest.  I am very curious to learn, more specifically, where members’ preferences lie with a non-traditional production. 
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