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vivico1
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7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP

Hey, I was looking at messages today and saw 7 new ones on Context and background:... I was excited that maybe some new post were here finally but I have gone through them both linear, each one and thread page by page and i dont see any new ones and after going through that section both ways, I am still showing 7 new posts. Anyone else having this problem? I havent before. And I dont know where on this new format to ask for tech support. I clicked on help above and it was just FAQ. Soooo, who posted on that thread today and what? LOL. I can not see them, and I can not get that 7 to go away. I did see two other posts elsewhere and read them and they cleared out,but not these. Whats up anyone got any idea??? help!
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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vivico1
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP/ helloooooo

Hey guys, I am still seeing 7 new posts listed under context and background where there is none. No one has offered any ideas or suggestions of how i can get to someone at BN to find out and I havent seen any other posts all day on anything. I do see that people are looking tho, so please, would one of you at least send a reply on this saying, I dont know or something, just so I can see if it shows as a post that i can see and clear?? please?? TYIA
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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Choisya
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? Posts removed?

[ Edited ]
Vivico: The posts I see are from Fanuzzir, myself and Danielle. Mine were just in response to the ones which had specifically replied to me. There are none from any other users. The extra posts you saw may have been removed by the Administrators because they were abusive or against the User Guidelines (if you remember this was done earlier). Admin seem to remove posts on these boards without saying that they have done so - the old BNU people gave a reminder about 'User Guidelines', which I think is better.

I find it particularly strange that we had two students on the board earlier who seemed very interested in the political content but they have not posted since the beginning of the discussion. I also find it remarkable that some of the political posts have had around 300 'viewers' yet only 4 of those have posted! Would that only another, say, 6, had the courage of their convictions and taken issue with us - what a good discussion we could have had! As Herbert Clark Hoover said 'Honest differences of views and honest debate are not disunity, they are vital processes of policy making among free men.'




vivico1 wrote:
Hey, I was looking at messages today and saw 7 new ones on Context and background:... I was excited that maybe some new post were here finally but I have gone through them both linear, each one and thread page by page and i dont see any new ones and after going through that section both ways, I am still showing 7 new posts. Anyone else having this problem? I havent before. And I dont know where on this new format to ask for tech support. I clicked on help above and it was just FAQ. Soooo, who posted on that thread today and what? LOL. I can not see them, and I can not get that 7 to go away. I did see two other posts elsewhere and read them and they cleared out,but not these. Whats up anyone got any idea??? help!

Message Edited by Choisya on 01-19-200707:39 AM

Message Edited by Choisya on 01-19-200707:54 AM

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vivico1
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? Posts removed?

Yeah I was hoping it was others posting, got excited! lol. I do remember when some were removed before but when they were, they did not show in the listing by the subject as new ones. I still have that today and I sent an email to the main B&N help because I couldnt find a place for technical help questions for the book clubs and have not heard back anything yet.
If you three posted, I saw one but i guess i missed the other two. I dont think I saw one from Fanuzzir yesterday, so may be missing that one. Its a bummer to have 7 listed that may not be there at all and then have some that I may not see at all :smileysad: .



Choisya wrote:
The posts I see are from Fanuzzir, myself and Danielle. Mine were just in response to the ones which had specifically replied to me. There are none from any other users. The extra posts you saw may have been removed by the Administrators because they were abusive or against the User Guidelines (if you remember this was done earlier). Admin seem to remove posts on these boards without saying that they have done so - the old BNU people gave a reminder about 'User Guidelines', which I think is better.

I find it particularly strange that we had two students on the board earlier who seemed very interested in the political content but they have not posted since the beginning of the discussion. I also find it remarkable that some of the political posts have had around 300 'viewers' yet only 4 of those have posted! Would that only another, say, 6, had the courage of their convictions and taken issue with us - what a good discussion we could have had! As Herbert Clark Hoover said 'Honest differences of views and honest debate are not disunity, they are vital processes of policy making among free men.'
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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chadadanielleKR
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP/ helloooooo



vivico1 wrote:
Hey guys, I am still seeing 7 new posts listed under context and background where there is none. No one has offered any ideas or suggestions of how i can get to someone at BN to find out and I haven't seen any other posts all day on anything. I do see that people are looking tho, so please, would one of you at least send a reply on this saying, I dont know or something, just so I can see if it shows as a post that i can see and clear?? please?? TYIA



So do I... see 7 new posts under the heading: SUBSCRIPTION, but nowhere else...
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vivico1
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP/ helloooooo


chadadanielleKR wrote:


vivico1 wrote:
Hey guys, I am still seeing 7 new posts listed under context and background where there is none. No one has offered any ideas or suggestions of how i can get to someone at BN to find out and I haven't seen any other posts all day on anything. I do see that people are looking tho, so please, would one of you at least send a reply on this saying, I dont know or something, just so I can see if it shows as a post that i can see and clear?? please?? TYIA



So do I... see 7 new posts under the heading: SUBSCRIPTION, but nowhere else...


This is really weird. They must be having trouble with the system then. OK thanks, at least its not our computers. And the 7 will come and go,one time yes, the next no. Thanks for answering :smileyhappy:
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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Choisya
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Re: Help & Information

Vivico: If you scroll down through all the book clubs you will se a Help & Information section. You can ask technical questions there.
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vivico1
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Re: Help & Information


Choisya wrote:
Vivico: If you scroll down through all the book clubs you will se a Help & Information section. You can ask technical questions there.


Thanks Choisya.
I see where you mean now. I had tried the help at the top and the very top. The 7 is gone this evening, so i'll wait and see if its fixed. I did see your message too, so if its been the only one since maybe morning here, then I guess its working ok. :smileywink:
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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fanuzzir
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Re: Help & Information

I'm communicating this problem to Bill, the editor of these pages. Maybe he has a server database that can provide an independent list of hits. Let's not get too suspicious yet.
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Kourt
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP/ helloooooo

I see them too. I am also see 2 in Harry Potter. What is going on? Help!!!!
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fanuzzir
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Re: 7 new posts on Context and background??? HELP/ helloooooo

Another mystery. Under Linear Format, New Replies there will be 0 new messages listed, but if I look at the last posted column on the right, I see that there are; they just don't carry the "NEW" designation with the actual post. So I can never be absolutely sure until I go to the "last post" column.
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CrystalVan
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Re: Historical note and a 13 year old's perspective

I am new to the book club experience as of today. My belated contribution is a historical note based upon the work my son did for the Illinois State History Fair two years ago when he was attending 8th grade. This paper received a Superior at the both the regional and state competitions. His research focused upon the impact of the Illinois and Michigan canal, built by the labor of mostly Irish immigrants. Through subsequent generations, those families ended up working in the Chicago stockyards and other industries, made possible by the building of the canal. Paul even quoted Sinclair in his paper. According to Paul's research, 1000 men, out of 1500 men, died in just the first year in building the canal due to disease and unsafe working conditions. Immigrants and their descendents boosted the population of Chicago to over 29,000 by 1850 and to 3.3 million by 1930. His hypothesis tied the canal and immigration to political coalition building and the patronage system and the subsequent Chicago political machine leading to the rise of Mayor Daley. A weighty topic for a 13-year-old to dive into. I haven't read The Jungle in 30 years, but I'm inspired to re-read it. I thought you might find my son's insights interesting. Thank you for allowing this indulgence. I was very proud of his efforts.

Here are two excerpts from his award-winning paper. I apologize that the sources are not showing up properly because I cut and paste the sections from his paper. He did credit his sources properly in the paper, and they are included below without the reference numbers attached to the specific sentences.

"Once the Irish made Chicago their home, they began working in the many industries that the canal brought. Soon, they rose from being “shanty” Irish to the working class. The Irish were very social people, willing to help out a friend of a friend; so many Irish that rose to high statures in these industries gave jobs to their friends, their friend’s friends, their brother, their cousins their cousin’s friends, and so on. This is what we call a patronage system. This was a major advantage in the Irish’s rise to power. Many Irish went into law enforcement, and by 1865, one third of Chicago’s police force was Irish or of Irish decent. By 1900, the Irish had about six times as many people as the second largest ethnic group. Many people say the alcohol prohibition in America greatly angered the Irish because of their lasting tradition of pub drinking. Pub drinking was their version of parties and celebrations, a long standing cultural tradition. People think that this was the start of the Irish’s rise to political power, so they could change the law.
The Irish had many advantages in their political struggle. One, they were very familiar with English government. They also had the most votes from the Irish communities, and they had no common enemies amongst fellow immigrants who lived in Chicago. “A German won’t vote for a Pole, a Pole wont vote for a German, a Lithuanian won’t vote for either of them, but all three will vote for an Irish.”- In 1869, the Irish held fifteen out of forty seats in the Chicago City Council. The Irish were gaining power fast, and some say that they had too much power. The Irish became intensely political, and when Chicago became a big-city, the Irish practically invented big-city politics..."

"...More and more immigrants moved into Chicago, but not only Irish, but Germans, Poles, and other Europeans. Since many the many ethnicities of Chicago were driving the English people into the small suburbs, Chicago began to look fragmented, split into dozens of ethnicities, divided by language, culture, and even hatred. A man named Anton Cermak saw the benefit of bringing all the different groups into one ethnic coalition, to manage conflict between them and to keep Chicago from falling apart. Cermak used anti-alcohol prohibition tactics to gain favor of the people, and then he convinced them to unite. Cermak was also backed by big liquor companies, who provided him with votes and money for his upcoming election as mayor. Cermak began a campaign against the Republican mayor of Chicago, Mayor Thompson, who’s legacy was using a citywide patronage system to obtain votes (vote for me, and I’ll get you a job). Cermak won the position in 1935, and began putting the democratic political machine into place."

Sources for the above paragraphs included:
Cohen, Adam and Elizabeth Taylor; “ American Pharaoh”; Little, Brown and Company and Back Bay Books, May 2001, Chapters 1-5
Miller, Donald L.; “City of the Century”; Simond Schuster; 1996
Cohen, Adam and Elizabeth Taylor; “ American Pharaoh”; Little, Brown and Company and Back Bay Books, May 2001, Chapters 1-5
Crystal V.
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vivico1
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Re: Historical note and a 13 year old's perspective

Hey Crystal,
Thanks for the insight about the canal aspect to all this. See I didnt know anything about that either. Sometimes i wonder if when some countries think Americans dont know what is going on in there own country or their own history, they are right.But I wonder too, if some of that is because we are such a big country and with so many different states with their own governing bodies too. After all, when I was in high school, you had state history, and world history and American History only had enough time that it was always about Columbus,1776 and the civil war and thats it. There is just so much to take in that if kids dont do some special activities like yours, then its more likely to be delegated to college classes to really get into these types of issues. And there, you may not have time or the college hours available to get into such discussions if it is not in your field. I know more about native american issues and Elizabeth the 1st than any of the historical SOCIAL issues of of early 1900s America lol.
Vivian
~Those who do not read are no better off than those who can not.~ Chinese proverb
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zman
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Re: Historical note and a 13 year old's perspective

That's quite an essay for an 8th grader, Crystal. I can see why your son won the award - it's certainly far more sophisticated than anything I could have written in 8th grade!

As for the other salient points in this thread, I for one can't imagine having a discussion about "The Jungle" without examining its political ramifications, both past and present. Unfortunately, discussions about politics tend to get heated. I belong to several other forums (which have nothing to do with politics), and whenever political debates ensue, they inevitably devolve into personal attacks between several posters, which just creates a climate of bad blood. I can certainly understand lurkers wanting to stay out of the fray thereby avoiding the fate of so many innocent bystanders.

Many people also have the fear of revealing too much of themselves on an internet discussion, and with good reason. We have to remember that we are not simply having a discussion amongst ourselves - it is a discussion that can be viewed and interpreted by potentially millions of viewers, and as such, it is every bit as exposed to the public at large as if we were on prime time television.

That being said, I think we CAN have intelligent political discussions if the literature in question warrants it. My rule of thumb is simply to debate ideas, and never to question the veracity or honesty of the person presenting them.

Incidentally, being a newbie myself here, what happens when the discussion of Sinclair officially ends? Does this entire forum get deleted to make room for a new one?
_______________________________________________

Overheard in the Student Union at Brandeis University:
"Man, if I actually had to talk to Socrates, I'd be pissed."
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fanuzzir
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Re: Historical note and a 13 year old's perspective

Zman, this board will stay alive for a good long time, but eventually I believe that BN will "archive" it. That is just because with four or five boards, the American classics discussion will just get too crowded and complicated. Please see the other discussions that are still ongoing and will be starting up soon, namely Hemingway. And thank you for your observations about politics and literature. You'll see an extensive discussion of this under the "political contexts" thread.
Bob
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