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Bee_Ruby
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Registered: ‎11-12-2007
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Dating in the trenches

Hi - would love some feedback on a column I'm writing on single 30 something life:

In my twenties, I religiously followed a detailed and slightly ruthless checklist of qualities I insisted were Not-Negotiable in any man I dated. A couple of the items were reasonable enough – lack of obvious violent tendency, didn’t call his mother “mummy”, uninvolved (unless it was actually with me). But the list was probably much longer then strictly necessary and a couple of potentially great men were barricaded from my door by virtue of some or other minor infringement of The List. I remember one poor sod was given the boot for wearing a white mesh tie (although in my defence it was already the 90’s) and someone else for his complete inability to get a tan. Ok - I was shallow, but I was buoyed on by the flippancy of youth and a lot less cellulite.

Fortunately, I got a little older and a little wiser and by the time I turned 30, I was happily involved with a man who was far from perfect but who made me laugh all the time and never ever told me my ass looked fat. After we broke up, I found myself once again in the dating trenches and wondering just how willing single women in their 30’s were to negotiate their non-negotiables in a town where long term meant making it to breakfast.

Sure, compromise is necessary…but just how much negotiating are we prepared to do to find love. Does our list of absolute, unquestionably essential deal breakers get whittled down by all the terrible dates, disappointing break ups and long stretches at an unringing phone until all we are left with is one tiny item such as…”must wash regularly” (and I have even been prepared to overlook that one for a particularly gorgeous musician).

One friend of mine who swore off unavailable men for life is dating a man so remote that he finds his cat needy. They have been dating for a year and they still haven’t seen the flip side of a fried egg. And so my beautiful, funny and charming friend has negotiated herself all the way down to dating an emotional tree stump. She keeps telling me that he is very intelligent.

And on the other side, have others become so daunted at the prospect of repeating similar mistakes that they have become so rigidly not- negotiable that they wouldn’t get involved with Brad Pitt if he wore the wrong colour socks.

I guess its just about finding the middle ground. I have tried to be more open to dating men that don’t fit my ordinary perception of what is right for me and less open to getting involved with someone who, well, just happens to be a mammal. But surprisingly, it is not that easy to know the difference. I recently invited a man that I met through an acquaintance to my house for dinner. He arrived with a piece of toilet paper stuck to his forehead and called me “nunu” throughout the entire evening. The flexible (or just plain desperate) part of me thought he was interesting, if a little eccentric, and that maybe I should sleep with him. The vigilant part of me thought that I should scream loudly and then call the police.
ABI
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ABI
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Re: Dating in the trenches

I like it. Made me laugh - I realize that is a horrible thing to admit as I'm not in my thirties by any means. yet. **shudders** But either way, humor is a very gripping component in a column. And I repeat myself, it was a very enjoyable read, I liked it. :smileyhappy:
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
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crAZRick
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Registered: ‎01-27-2007
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Re: Dating in the trenches

HA! I love it!

FYI, I'm writing 'The Book' on how much dating in your 30s sucks, if you need more ammo for your column...

:smileyvery-happy:

hurry! time's fast running out on my 30s!
I no longer regret that I have no quote, quip or anecdote to share with my countrymen... how about all y'all?
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Bee_Ruby
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Registered: ‎11-12-2007
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Dam...I have enough ammo to write an encyclopedia ...never mind a book. And I'm only 5 years into my thirties. But I will definitely remember where to find some extra artillery. And from a mans perspective too..hmmm
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mrsronaldweasley
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Re: Dating in the trenches

5 stars!!!

I find it disgusting that men do not feel the need to clean up their acts and so most women suffer by compromising their standards and when they complain abouto it, they call women names. They even say you can never afford a woman.
Read it, liked it. Can we run an online column about this topic right now? I swear I have much to contribute that probably add to your books, essays, research. And im good at giving advice or im just in dire need to vent my feelings and share it to every girlfriend out there. I consider myself 80% feminist. I don’t hate men, but you know what I mean.

Post some more!

Silly question, you brittish?
I bet a lot of women are wanting to contribute to this topic. Especially aaabbbbbbb---- :smileysurprised:
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
ABI
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ABI
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Re: Dating in the trenches

and VHAT exactly is that supposed to mean??? ***hands on hips, resembling mrsweasley****

miss potato muncher eez not von to talk!

i am not even twenty yet! someone shall be 'over ze hill' before moi at any cost!

Ahh..yes, you're right though. Women have loads to say on the topic of men. And will always...We should not have to change our ways for them. Let us even the scale and accept only the best. See what the over thirty men resort to when they realize they have been blind to their own aging and have wasted more than one good chance!
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
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mrsronaldweasley
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Re: Dating in the trenches

**hands on hips , eyebrow raised, while belly dancing, saying zis matter of factly

I shall make it clear that as a lady of this planet, I do not think you have to be an adult to experience these kind of things. Women have different stories that a woman can understand. Know what I mean? But if not you’ll know about it.
(okay we’re stealing her thunder ab)

ruby! We like your work!! Post some more! We can get to excited here if you don’t start posting replies!! :smileysurprised: haha. =)


its so cool. If one needs resources, they’re all online. Ehem. That’s me. The ultimate interview worthy person ovah here. lol
unlike nailmuncher here
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
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Bee_Ruby
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Hi there,
Yes please!!! - share your stories too, I'm way out here on a limb dating in Cape Town where there are 6 women for every man (a pot for every lid?). Please share your experiences too..its always fantastic to hear women's stories from across the sea. And, I'd love to hear from the men too.
Bee
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mrsronaldweasley
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Hey girls, and boys. Hi ruby

Here’s a thought. Men always like to be the first. Women. They care about being the last.

I have a friend who has bad luck with men. She’s pretty. She has a good family and upbringing. But for some reason she got stuck with a guy who does nothing but hurt her emotionally. He tells her he loves her then he leaves her, and he comes back again.
So she kind of moved on now… however, it seems like she’s starting to treat every man she means as dating material , boyfriend material, long term relationship material.
I always tell her, she has to know her worth.

Im currently in a relationship right now. But ill talk about that in the future.
I’ll talk about the men I used to date.
So this is my first. When we broke up I acted like nothing happened. So what he did was he dated one of my friends. The thing is he was the kind of man who wanted to get a reaction out of you. And if he cant do it by flipping the guilt card, he turns nasty and does something like that. Anyway he and the girl didn’t last. I mean what did she expect, the guy was a jerk.
It sucks.

Another thought. Some think they have to try everything at least once. I think that’s cool, but sometimes, you simply need to use your common sense, and not necessarily have to try everything to know what that something is like.


Any thoughts?
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
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crAZRick
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Maybe I really am unlike most other guys then, because for me, my women come first (and often second... and third, if I have the time and energy...) of course, I have had only limited experience with the ladies, so there is a certain irony.

I had my first date (which led to mm first kiss) when I was 17 (20 years ago -sigh-)
I was joining the Army out of high school, so I think the girl thought I was going to war and might die, so took some pity for one night. She was a cheerleader, I was a tweener; in middle school, the days before the high-school cliques (jocks, nerds, brains, freaks...) I was friends with all those who became 'Jocks', though I became something of a brain/nerd/freak, which left me in the rather unique position of having some taste of both worlds, seeing things from all sides; I could get invited to all the jock-parties, if I pressed the right buttons, and had natural intelligence and wit enough to do well on tests and compete with the brains... sounds like a golden ticket, don't it? but, instead, it made me as an outsider to all cliques; jerk-of-all-trades, master of none.

I had my first sexual experience about 10 years later, no 'action' on that date with the cheerleader, and never had a second date to turn up the heat, so confirmed that I was a geek with a few friends in high places... I was content with that standing thru my year away at college. My Army time was merely National Guard duty, so not so gritty and gripping and deadly or dangerous as active duty overseas... and, luckily enough, the USA was between wars during my 8 years in the Guard, and it was only the Minnesota Guard (we were assigned to protect Alaska from Russian insurgents, so ya, not a lot of combat did I see...) so my Army training was as useful as all the Math and Science I was forced to suffer while I chased my dream of becoming a Great-American-Author...

The woman I first shared my whole self with, mind, heart, body and soul, she turned out to be unhappily married, just looking for lust in all the right places, and she stumbled onto me, we fell into bed together, and I did the deed. To be honest, 'doing the deed' for me distilled itself down to seeing, touching tasting soft, supple breast, and lots of kissing and sweating, but, the actual 'deed' was, sadly, incomplete (at least for my part... although, for a few minutes, I began to think that doggie-style had something to do with the woman humping the man's leg, which seemed to work for her??)

To my credit, it was my first first time seeing/touching/tasting live naked boob, nervous energy, it had been a long drive in near-blizzard conditions, and I had opted to wear my form-flattering 'party-jeans' for the 90-minute trip... cold, tight wetness does nothing for a man's form when it comes time to enjoy the hot, tight wetness which soon developed between she and I...

any way, once the genie was out of that particular bottle, it was a hell-of-a-time, and, soon after I never saw her again, I 'became a man' myself, finally, with a nameless, faceless, desperate soul... then another... and another... one-night stands (but never one-shot wonder, all my gals had multiple good times while on my watch, even if I don't remember names and faces...)

about a year later, I ended up marrying the desperate soul who stayed in my heart, mind and soul-- and ravaged my body-- for an extended period of time. We met May 19, 1997 and were married May 19, 1998, because that's just how I roll.

I'd like to end by saying: And We Lived Happily Ever After...

but, that just aint how my fairy tale goes.
I no longer regret that I have no quote, quip or anecdote to share with my countrymen... how about all y'all?
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mrsronaldweasley
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Re: Dating in the trenches

You’re funny rick. :smileysurprised: and I can’t believe you just posted that.
Anyway what do you think of the modern day woman?
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
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APenForYourThoughts
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Re: Dating in the trenches

I especially loved your last paragraph, ruby!!! Quite hysterical. :smileyhappy:
Can't really contribute much on this topic from my own experiences, largely due to the fact that I have no experiences in this arena... But I'll certainly recount them here if I ever gain any. :smileyhappy:
Nice column, though, ruby. Keep it up!!
"A book must be the axe for the frozen sea inside us." --Kafka
ABI
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ABI
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Wired dating . . . you know, I don't really have anything at the moment.

However I was recently alerted that my cousin was "run over by her boyfriend." Sounds awful, but I guess they were both really drunk, and she just jumped out in the middle of the road. She's actually still dating the guy. And apparently he's nice. Though my aunt this summer, somewhat drunk, made this awful remark that he - "Has to marry her! You ran over her leg!" Lol. If that didn't scare him off, nothing will. :smileywink:
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
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crAZRick
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Re: Dating in the trenches



mrsronaldweasley wrote:
You’re funny rick. :smileysurprised: and I can’t believe you just posted that.
Anyway what do you think of the modern day woman?




you just want to hear the rest of my sad sorry fairy tale, huh??

I can tell you one thing I have learned: Forever is really just 7 months! not so long, after all, is it??

my last/most-modern-day woman was a tweaker (meth-addict) and a drug-dealer, so, my experiences with 'modern-day' women are still, sadly, lacking and not much I am proud of. I do know I would be a great lover, husband, and father, if a woman would give me 9 months or a year to figure out all her many much multiple female psychoses...

...especially given the many, much multiples I GIVE HER!!!! -grrrr-

ok, so here goes, The Rest of the Story:


7 months into my marriage, my wife, love-of-my-life, and I are enjoying New Years dinner together. I had proposed on New Years Eve the year before, so it was sorta special... and what a special occasion it turned out to be, our anniversary!!

She told me she found a lump in her left breast, and that we were getting divorced so she could die in peace, alone... YAY! happy anniversary, dear! I argued, but she had already filed the paperwork, and begged me to just accept the facts, sign off on her, and let her rest in peace...

silly me, I actually took it to heart all that 'death do us part' mumbo-jumbo in the standard wedding vows. So, I didn't sign, and we 'fought it out' in court. A laughable metaphor in this case; the 'fight' consisted of me and her standing tall before The Man, he asked her if she thought the marriage was irretrievably broken, she said YES, he asked me, I said MOST DEFINITELY NOT!... after 15 minutes of pointless legalese babble from behind the bench (without even a Wopner-style pause for the cause) the divorce was granted.

She was remarried 7 months later, to a nurse she worked with, who could help ease her pains while she died, I guessed... 7 months after that...

...wait for it...





... she divorced him too!

(what? you thought she would succumb to the dread cancer?... that would be too easy now, wouldn't it??) Here's another big ol' bite to chew on:

she divorced him because she woke up one day and decided she still truly madly deeply loved me, and that we deserved a second chance!! But, first, that she deserved a second chance at life, so she fought the cancer, got treatment, and beat it!! YAY!!
(actually, that had been her SECOND battle with cancer, but the first involving me, so if you want more details on all that drama, you'll have to find out from her...)

so, she had an affair with me while she divorced her nurse. And, 7 months later...


...wait for it...




Cancer came back, this time in her stomach. The first time she had cancer, it was cervical, required a hysterctomy to 'cure'... that 2nd time (my first time as a sympathetic/simply-pathetic cancer 'victim/survivor') was breast cancer. They say if you survive 5 years cancer-free after a bout of surgury and treatments, you can consider yourself effectively 'cured'... she had made it 4 years, 10 months and some odd days... ya, God has a wicked sense of humor, I guess.

so, after having cancer eat away at everything that 'made her a woman' it set in her guts, and kept on eating her from the inside-out. Of course, you all can guess what happened when Cancer came back into our lives...

at least we weren't married this time when she ran away to die alone...

so, met in May, our first New Years together, I asked her to marry me, married in May; our 2nd New Years together she told me we were divorcing, divorce was scheduled for May but pushed back because apparently that was a good year/time-of-year for everyone in Arizona to get divorced, and the courts were backed-up; we were divorced by our 3rd New Years, had our affair next May, and she ran away with her Cancer by our 4th New Year...

so, about every 7 months there for 4 years running, I had a blast of Forever in my face!


just to let you know, she is still alive-if-not-so-well, struggling almost 10 years now with the cancer fight... just my luck to lose a woman twice to die from Cancer, and then, she just don't have the decency to die!!!


but, ya, I'm a lot of fun at parties!

WOO!

(there's still about a 6-year gap from where this chapter ends and Current Day, and filled with single-mom-strippers, tweakers, drug-dealers, and some amazing kids who've lived thru worse than I could ever imagine...)

but, this should be enough for now, I guess.
I no longer regret that I have no quote, quip or anecdote to share with my countrymen... how about all y'all?
ABI
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ABI
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Re: Dating in the trenches

and are you okay there rick...? presently?

mrsronald is not particularly apt at taking hints. . .
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
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mrsronaldweasley
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Re: Dating in the trenches



ABI wrote:
and are you okay there rick...? presently?

mrsronald is not particularly apt at taking hints. . .





**splutters! Spurt! Thanks a lot abi! I was merely reading his post with sincere interest! And his first post was funny! He didn’t even mention anything about being divorced and cancer. Rick I don’t mean any offense, or anything negative okay? (eye twitching, looking sideways at abi)

very sensitive person over here.


Okay, this topic is so broad I don’t know where to start. I have a lot of questions.
To correct my first post, what I said was ‘there are things that only another woman will understand’.

I have dated men who just don’t know where to start.
Dated men who are so slow, if they weren’t any slower they’d be going backwards.
Dated men who are more vain than I am (didn’t think that was possible, but yeah)
Dated men who’s like my dad
Dated men who are still and probably forever going to be-boys.
Dated men who treated me right.
Dated men who don’t know what they want.

Most momen know what men want.
Do men know what women really want?
o’~aNd I'm So Sad, LikE a GoOd BooK, I caN't PuT tHis Day BacK~’o
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crAZRick
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Re: Dating in the trenches



ABI wrote:
and are you okay there rick...? presently?




hey, I'm still alive, breathing in-and-out, no physical discomfort to speak of, if that's what you mean...

well-being is subjective, I think, and dependent on a variety of factors and variables that change almost-daily-- if not hourly. Certain movies, TV shows, commercials, songs, or eve simple phrases overheard in conversations, get to me and sometimes it takes a little while for me to recall what significance those things once had. And, certain dates throughout the year; though again, I don't obsessively track and remember each important historical date, but when I think about why I'm in some particular mood, I can usually trace it back to a date or song or something relevent to some of those unhappy events in my life...

but, in general, I'm not miserable.

not dating...


ever...


ever again...
(but, don't we all say that at some time or another?... if not, you will...)


ya, I'm good. I know my limits; I know nothing in life will wreck me worse than the divorce/affair/cancer debacle, so really, nothing more to fear from diving into-- and getting kicked out of-- further future relationships with women.

as hopeless and pointless as it seems right now, to get involved in that way again, when the time comes, the heart wants what the heart wants, and I welcome it every time...

..even though I know it's bound to end badly.

'Everything ends badly, otherwise it wouldn't end.' Lloyd Dobler, Say Anything


no worries mrsron... if I didn't see some entertainment/informational value in the drivel I post, I simply wouldn't post. Rather, I'd gouge my eyes out with a plastic spork...

so, ya, posting mindless, fun, heartfelt drivel, ripped-from-the-headlines-of-my-life is therapeutic. But, I think this strays off-topic.

in general, women are awesome; just my bad luck to find all the complicated situations.
I no longer regret that I have no quote, quip or anecdote to share with my countrymen... how about all y'all?
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crAZRick
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Re: Dating in the trenches



mrsronaldweasley wrote:
>Most momen know what men want.
Do men know what women really want?




in my experience, most women want 1 of 3 things from men, or in general:

1) endless amounts of 'more of the same' from their man, whether or not the man had intended his actions or gift at that time to be a wondrous one-shot surprise. Give them an inch (or 8.5 inches...), they want to be the ruler! Men can't do anything Nice for women without having it become an expectation, which only leads to more trouble when what we perceived as a random one-shot wonder is not repeated endlessly. Then-- if by some further miracle we do manage more of the same regularity-- suddenly, inexplicably, 'more of the same' becomes dilluted to simply 'MORE'... more, more, more... no longer necessarily the same wonderful stuff we have been providing, just MORE, random, fun, exciting, and most-likely expensive stuff... impossible to please...

and/or

2) and worse, is when/if the 'more' that women want must come in the form of 'more men' to please/satisfy her every whim and need. Not that her man is not doing his level best to provide her with everything her heart desires (and MORE) just that More is never enough, from that one man.. so, while he tries to please her, regardless whether he succeeds or fails in his efforts, some sick twisted chemical imbalance in her brain compels her to seek MORE elsewhere!!

and/or

3) failing those 2 (or, God forbid, in tandem with either or both of those 2) women either go into every relationship or slowly twisted their will and longing throughout the course of the relationship wanting EXACTLY OPPOSITE of whatever it is they are currently receiving from the relationship. So, not only may they want more, but no longer more of the same, instead, more of the exact opposite!! which only serves to infuriate and distance them from their provider/supporter Man the more he gives, the more of something completely opposite she wants!! It's Lose/Lose/Lose for us men!!! I call these women Latent Lesbians (not that there's anything wrong with that!) and they should just Quit Men altogether; save us all the trouble!!! PLEASE!!

The kicker is, these particular chemical imbalances in the female brain can happen AT ANY TIME, at random, or according to some celestial calendar or secret societal schedule, leaving Men completely unprepared and unable to stay-ahead of the game...

IMPOSSIBLE!!!

-ARGH!!-
I no longer regret that I have no quote, quip or anecdote to share with my countrymen... how about all y'all?
ABI
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ABI
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Re: Dating in the trenches

yeah..sorry, mrsronald, had to put that in. :smileyhappy:

hmm...we women are more complex than just random attitudes! or actually...perhaps slightly less complex than you think, and MAYBE our actions are just consequences of yours! ....and I don't think men realize how many times they fall into rick's above categories.

glad that you're not utterly ripped from limb to limb, rick . . . or at least, you can hide it.
"There is nothing easier than self-deceit."
"Bombing for peace is like f***ing for virginity"
"There is no such thing as death, only the absence of life."
"There is no end, unless you let it."
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macross
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Re: Dating in the trenches

Oh rick, you are so wrong, By the way im a guy. If you only sat down and actually listened to a woman, you would notice its not really that difficult. It does not take taht much than a little effort on your part. But puting it into categories is a no no. All woman are unique. Just have to spend more than 20 minutes staring at thier chest or other attribute that you find to your liking.
On a wing and a prayer.