26 Replies Latest reply on Jun 9, 2013 8:02 PM by Mercury_Glitch

    Hard/soft cover books you already own.

      Does anyone know why you are not allowed to download soft/hard cover books you already own in e-book format for free?  Why should we have to pay twice for books we love and would like to have available whenever we want?  I think its a little unfair.

        • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
          roustabout

          Rather than downloading them, you're free to image them yourself -

           

          http://www.diybookscanner.org/

           

          as to why you can't download them?  It's not completely unlike owning a hardback and not getting the paperback for free - it's a different edition. 

           

          It's not completely analogous, either - if you have the paper book, you can sell it used.  There's really no way to sell on an ebook once you've read it, and I think there really ought to be.  Unfortunately, at least for now, the ebook market is being treated as if it were essentially a software licensing market, and in the US, you can't resell software you've bought. 

          • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
            RHWright

            natalia623 wrote:

            Does anyone know why you are not allowed to download soft/hard cover books you already own in e-book format for free?  Why should we have to pay twice for books we love and would like to have available whenever we want?  I think its a little unfair.


            I should know better than to be baited like this, but what the hell...

             

            You own a single copy of the book. Not the right to an infinite supply of copies. I own copies of various musical recordings on LP, cassette, or CD. Does that entitle me to a free download in a new audio format? I own certain books as hardcovers. Does that entitle me to a free paperback copy, too? Or that fancy anniversary edition copy when it comes out?

             

            Think it's unfair? Well, the nicest thing I can say is put your thinking cap on again and redo the math. Cuz you got the answer wrong.

              • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                Byteguy

                And, when you were a kid and bought that vinyl album from the Beatles you didn't get a free version on cassette later, and then a free 8-track, and then a free CD, and then a free iTunes download.

                • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                  keriflur

                  RHWright wrote:

                  You own a single copy of the book. Not the right to an infinite supply of copies. I own copies of various musical recordings on LP, cassette, or CD. Does that entitle me to a free download in a new audio format? I own certain books as hardcovers. Does that entitle me to a free paperback copy, too? Or that fancy anniversary edition copy when it comes out?


                  I like this idea.  I have a bible, and by this logic I'm owed a copy of the Gutenberg Bible.  Free.  Come on, Vatican, hand it over.  I've know you've got two of them down in those oxygen-free stacks you have underground that I saw in that Dan Brown movie.  One of those copies is mine.

                   

                  • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                    gb18

                    RHWright wrote:

                    natalia623 wrote:

                    Does anyone know why you are not allowed to download soft/hard cover books you already own in e-book format for free?  Why should we have to pay twice for books we love and would like to have available whenever we want?  I think its a little unfair.


                    I should know better than to be baited like this, but what the hell...

                     

                    You own a single copy of the book. Not the right to an infinite supply of copies. I own copies of various musical recordings on LP, cassette, or CD. Does that entitle me to a free download in a new audio format? I own certain books as hardcovers. Does that entitle me to a free paperback copy, too? Or that fancy anniversary edition copy when it comes out?

                     

                    Think it's unfair? Well, the nicest thing I can say is put your thinking cap on again and redo the math. Cuz you got the answer wrong.


                    Uh, no you don't.  You only have a license to read it.  Try to sell it or give it away........

                      • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                        Nallia

                        gb18 wrote:

                        RHWright wrote:

                        natalia623 wrote:

                        Does anyone know why you are not allowed to download soft/hard cover books you already own in e-book format for free?  Why should we have to pay twice for books we love and would like to have available whenever we want?  I think its a little unfair.


                        I should know better than to be baited like this, but what the hell...

                         

                        You own a single copy of the book. Not the right to an infinite supply of copies. I own copies of various musical recordings on LP, cassette, or CD. Does that entitle me to a free download in a new audio format? I own certain books as hardcovers. Does that entitle me to a free paperback copy, too? Or that fancy anniversary edition copy when it comes out?

                         

                        Think it's unfair? Well, the nicest thing I can say is put your thinking cap on again and redo the math. Cuz you got the answer wrong.


                        Uh, no you don't.  You only have a license to read it.  Try to sell it or give it away........


                        The "single copy" being referenced here is a hardcopy, not an ebook.
                    • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                      petesnook
                      Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.
                        • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                          msmoonlite

                          But


                          petesnook wrote:
                          Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                          But you point out a PAID subscription to a periodical which by nature comes out more frequently with a different objective when it comes to readers.

                           

                          Are you saying OP should pay extra to have unfettered access?

                           

                          Its akin to saying if I bought this Eagles album in 1977 now that the technology has changed I should be able to get as many digital downloads as I want since I paid 6 dollars for it thirty plus ago.

                          • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                            bklvr896

                            petesnook wrote:
                            Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                            The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.

                              • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                keriflur

                                bklvr896 wrote:

                                petesnook wrote:
                                Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                                The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.


                                Strangely, I have the habit of keeping the receipt of every physical book I buy in-store.  I put them inside the cover of the book (or one of the books in the purchase) and use them as bookmarks or just as reminders of when/where I was when I bought it.  For my online purchases, they're all linked to my various accounts, so I can actually prove that I bought almost every book I own, even the used books (though if anyone ever put this policy in place, I'm sure it would only apply to first sales).

                                 

                                Thing is, I don't mind paying separately for the ebook, if I feel the need to have both.

                                • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.

                                  bklvr896 wrote:

                                  petesnook wrote:
                                  Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                                  The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.


                                  The OP isn't asking about anything.  The OP "asked" and hasn't shown up since.  Meanwhile the discussion has continued.

                                    • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                      msmoonlite

                                      AlanNJ wrote:

                                      bklvr896 wrote:

                                      petesnook wrote:
                                      Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                                      The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.


                                      The OP isn't asking about anything.  The OP "asked" and hasn't shown up since.  Meanwhile the discussion has continued.



                                      So true, Alan!!!

                                      • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                        Nallia

                                        AlanNJ wrote:

                                        bklvr896 wrote:

                                        petesnook wrote:
                                        Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                                        The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.


                                        The OP isn't asking about anything.  The OP "asked" and hasn't shown up since.  Meanwhile the discussion has continued.


                                        Don't cloud the issue with facts! Why do you want to take away my manufactured outrage? :smileytongue:
                                          • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.

                                            Nallia wrote:

                                            AlanNJ wrote:

                                            bklvr896 wrote:

                                            petesnook wrote:
                                            Keep in mind that a number of newspapers and magazines allow free e-editions if you have a paid print subscription, so I don't think the OP's question is entirely unfounded or a sense of unbounded entitlement.

                                            The OP is asking about books he/she already owns.  I think this would be great if I could buy a HC of a book and get the eBook for a little more, but for books I already own?  First, how would anyone know if I really purchased a copy of the eBook?  What if I had a paper copy and downloaded the eBook then gave a friend the paper copy and they downloaded the eBook?  For books you already own it's going to be pretty difficult to confirm that you actually own a copy of the book and that you paid for it.


                                            The OP isn't asking about anything.  The OP "asked" and hasn't shown up since.  Meanwhile the discussion has continued.


                                            Don't cloud the issue with facts! Why do you want to take away my manufactured outrage? :smileytongue:

                                            Now now Nallia... There's a time and a place for outrage.  Getting upset about a single posting from a poster who only posted that post just isn't the place... :smileywink:  Stay calm and mellow like I always am!  :smileytongue:

                                    • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.

                                      I think a few things need cleared-up here:

                                       

                                      This is a very feasible question most open-minded people may ask (these days.) Although it is a concept which has been passed-down to us from internet social media and entertainment. A majority (almost all) gaming, social, and entertainment media providers allow digital downloads of registered content. In effect, go buy the newest edition of Bug Zappers 3D, register it on BugGames.whtevr, and download any content covered by the license or registered proof of purchase (including the item you purchased itself.)

                                       

                                      The digital download rights of Nook purchases are outstanding, as it limits the content to be downloaded to two sources. This should be, in turn, mirrored to all registered hardcopy purchases (since they are recorded in your account history and libraries.)

                                       

                                      Another thing to look at is movies, in particular. Most producers allow the download of movies that have been purchased in DVD, Blu-Ray, or whatever form. Others only allow this IF the special edition of the movie have been purchased (ie. combo, extended, and director's cut editions.)

                                       

                                      Music is also the same way, as prior to purchase investigation may be required. Pick-up a CD, look at the fine print, and verify if you are allowed to download content from the label producer's site upon purchase. Most allow this, but not all (so don't use this medium as a staple.) And yes, the newest release of the Beatles can be downloaded if you purchase the hardcopy (but not the original stuff.)

                                       

                                      As of yet, most people are not on the same page with this topic. Books (hardcopy) may have a slight mark-up if they include the download license to your purchase. Perhaps this is something they really need to look into if they wish to get the ball rolling in the E-Reader market? At the moment, Nook is much better than Kindle (imo,) but it'll take one gimmick when Amazon starts to put the pressure on. This may be it, but don't get your hopes up just yet. :/

                                        • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                          keriflur

                                          The keyword here is "producer".  B&N is not the producer of the content, the publishers are.  The choice of whether or not to offer this is theirs, and right now they're making more money by charging for all the various formats separately, so there's not much incentive for them to bundle.  Also, they are facing a potentially problematic situation with Amazon right now, with Amazon having the ability to, in the publisher's  minds, devalue the product by selling at a loss.

                                           

                                          The industry is in flux right now, and while it would be great for consumers if the publishers decided to offer ebook editions bundled with HCs or PBs, I suspect it will be a while before we see it happening.

                                            • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.

                                              Very good, thanks for reiterating that fact. Resellers and OEMs are not the producers (publishers, in this context.) Most retailers eat the cost when it comes to bundling, look at Best Buy, Sears, Sam's Club, and let's not forget Hasting's (yes, they ate a little too much.) The king of bundling, Babbage's, could never overlook a good opportunity. Today, many competitor's use the techniques of this dinosaur to try to upsurp it's newly named legacy, Gamestop. To get to the point, if you want to make a sale you're going to have to eat a little of the cost. The fallback to these resellers, only the original purchaser has the ability to download registered content. Buy a book from Amazon for $14, or buy a book from B&N for $14 and get a limit of two downloads from two sources? Hardcovers are always a push, as most have the tenacity to wait for the paperback. Slap the 'ol download deal on a hardcover, they might actually sell. The other way around is a crazy concept though, buying a digital download and expecting the physical copy in return. That is an insane concept, but you are paying for virtually nothing in the first place. XD

                                                • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                  kamas716

                                                  CobaltCricket wrote:

                                                   Buy a book from Amazon for $14, or buy a book from B&N for $14 and get a limit of two downloads from two sources? 


                                                  This is the second post you've made about a limit of two downloads from B&N.  I'm not understanding what you are referring to here.  I've downloaded all of my B&N eBooks more than twice.  Currently, I have them downloaded to an NST, NT, NookforPC on three different laptops and also NookStudy on one laptop.  I've archived and unarchived some eBooks more than twice.  From whence does this two download limit arise?

                                                    • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                      MacMcK1957
                                                      I was wondering the same thing. I have the same books on an N1E, and NST, Nook for iPad, and Nook for PC on both a desktop and a laptop.
                                                      • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                        Mercury_Glitch

                                                        kamas716 wrote:

                                                        CobaltCricket wrote:

                                                         Buy a book from Amazon for $14, or buy a book from B&N for $14 and get a limit of two downloads from two sources? 


                                                        This is the second post you've made about a limit of two downloads from B&N.  I'm not understanding what you are referring to here.  I've downloaded all of my B&N eBooks more than twice.  Currently, I have them downloaded to an NST, NT, NookforPC on three different laptops and also NookStudy on one laptop.  I've archived and unarchived some eBooks more than twice.  From whence does this two download limit arise?


                                                         

                                                        I believe they're suggesting a new model of selling, if you purchase a physical book you're given the ability to download the ebook version twice. 

                                                         

                                                        As to why the limit is placed on the download since if you've downloaded it to your computer you can endlessly replicate it, I don't know. 

                                                         

                                                        Keri posted awhile back about how DVD sales have changed, with most current DVDs offering a digital download as part of the purchase.  I think a model based around that premise is really the only one that has a hope of pleasing all those concerned with the issue.  Publishers, and presumably the author, get money from the sale, retailers get the sale, and consumers get the book and ebook.  As to how much extra cost would be tacked on I'm not sure on.  Perhaps 25% of the ebook cost. 

                                                         

                                                         

                                                          • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                            keriflur

                                                            CobaltCricket - 

                                                             

                                                            if I'm understanding you correctly in your last post, you seem to be suggesting that B&N choose to bundle by eating some of the cost of the ebook, and including it for free with the sale of the hardcover.  This is not a realistic proposition in the current market.

                                                             

                                                            Lets take a $25 hardcover as an example.  B&N pays 50% of the cover cost to buy the book, $12.50, and will likely price the hardcover at 40% off the cover price, $15, same as Amazon.  This gives them $2.50 to cover all the costs of the sale and make a tiny bit of profit.  The ebook will likely have a cover price of $14 (though I've been seeing a lot more in the 15+ range lately), and when the ebook is sold, B&N will have to pay the publisher 70%, $9.80.  If B&N bundles the ebook in with the hardcover, then they are selling at a loss of $7.30 plus the cost of the sale.  This is not a realistic proposition for Amazon, who likes loss leaders, let alone for B&N. Given the known terms of the recent settlements, it's questionable whether taking that kind of a loss would be a breach of contract and may result in a lawsuit.

                                                            • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                              kamas716

                                                              Mercury_Glitch wrote:

                                                               

                                                              I believe they're suggesting a new model of selling, if you purchase a physical book you're given the ability to download the ebook version twice. 

                                                               

                                                               


                                                              I can see how you could get that impression from their second reference, but in the first reference (The digital download rights of Nook purchases are outstanding, as it limits the content to be downloaded to two sources. This should be, in turn, mirrored to all registered hardcopy purchases (since they are recorded in your account history and libraries.) it seems more like they believe the two download limit is already in effect.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong or they just aren't very clear in their phrasing.

                                                                • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                                  Mercury_Glitch

                                                                  kamas716 wrote:

                                                                  Mercury_Glitch wrote:

                                                                   

                                                                  I believe they're suggesting a new model of selling, if you purchase a physical book you're given the ability to download the ebook version twice. 

                                                                   

                                                                   


                                                                  I can see how you could get that impression from their second reference, but in the first reference (The digital download rights of Nook purchases are outstanding, as it limits the content to be downloaded to two sources. This should be, in turn, mirrored to all registered hardcopy purchases (since they are recorded in your account history and libraries.) it seems more like they believe the two download limit is already in effect.  Maybe I'm reading it wrong or they just aren't very clear in their phrasing.


                                                                  I think you may be right.  This is the problem when people try and speak in legalese.  It's not a language that lends itself to clarity in the best of hands.  I find it's better by far to use simple terms that clearly state what you mean.

                                                                   

                                                                   

                                                            • Re: Hard/soft cover books you already own.
                                                              bklvr896

                                                              CobaltCricket wrote:

                                                              Very good, thanks for reiterating that fact. Resellers and OEMs are not the producers (publishers, in this context.) Most retailers eat the cost when it comes to bundling, look at Best Buy, Sears, Sam's Club, and let's not forget Hasting's (yes, they ate a little too much.) The king of bundling, Babbage's, could never overlook a good opportunity. Today, many competitor's use the techniques of this dinosaur to try to upsurp it's newly named legacy, Gamestop. To get to the point, if you want to make a sale you're going to have to eat a little of the cost. The fallback to these resellers, only the original purchaser has the ability to download registered content. Buy a book from Amazon for $14, or buy a book from B&N for $14 and get a limit of two downloads from two sources? Hardcovers are always a push, as most have the tenacity to wait for the paperback. Slap the 'ol download deal on a hardcover, they might actually sell. The other way around is a crazy concept though, buying a digital download and expecting the physical copy in return. That is an insane concept, but you are paying for virtually nothing in the first place. XD


                                                              I was going to ask about your two download statement but others beat me to it.

                                                               

                                                              As far as your statement eat a little cost, it would be more than a little cost, probably most of the profit on the HC as they would have to pay the publisher for the digital download, about 70% of the retail price.  BN certainly doesn't have that type of available capital right now.  If it was a viable idea, Amazon probably would have tried it by now in their quest to put others out of business since  they seem not to be adverse to losing money.