11 Replies Latest reply on Jan 1, 2012 4:27 PM by OHCholla

    Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors

    DeanGibson

      There are now at least three different rooting solutions on the XDA-devs forums:

      1. Indirect's, which roots 1.4.0 and then blocks B&N OTA updates.  I think the B&N shop is still enabled.
      2. Mine, which (in effect) roots 1.4.1 but does not block the B&N shop or OTA updates (but there is a sideloadable app to disable/enable OTA updates!).
      3. cfoesch's, which roots 1.4.0 and then strips out as much B&N content as possible (in effect blocking the B&N shop and OTA updates), to give a more CM7-like appearance.


      The net result is that users have at least three rooting options, plus some "non-root sideloading" solutions (some block OTA updates) as well.  What does this mean for B&N:

      1. If their goal was to prevent the sale of NTs for rooting purposes, they have failed.
      2. If their goal was to prevent NT owners from installing non-B&N apps, they have failed.
      3. If their goal was to protect NetFlix, then they may or may not have succeeded (future B&N updates will tell).  Most rooters appear to have ZERO interest in NetFlix on the NT.  Personally, I didn't buy an HDTV in order to watch semi-HD content (hand-holding a 7" screen) with mediocre so-called "stereo" sound: http://www.photoever.com/Studios.html  For the cost of an NT, there are a number of nice HDTVs available with good-sized screens and good audio (some have NetFlix built in).


      I understand the reluctance of some (especially non-technically inclined) to root.  However, once rooted, finding and installing apps is much easier with the Android Market, and updating apps is a breeze (or even automatic, if you select that option — I don't).

      Note: Please don't turn this thread into another "Occupy B&N" black hole thread;  there are already plenty of those.  While I have my opinions on the subject (already duly stated), I find pragmatic discussions more practical.

        • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
          moose_tracker

          Thanks Dean..  I have already returned mine and know that if I repurchased it, the new ones that come with 1.4.1 already loaded are not hackable.. (And since it is now known that "feature" is no longer available I am fine with the fact those newly sold (not past sold) cannot be rooted or sideloaded.)

           

          I had no intent to root mine, just sideload maybe one or two good apps.. But, had I kept it, I would probably by now have come to the determination of rooting it. Simply because of the fact that B&N seeing the fact they have ticked off their customers doesn't even concern them enough to make a comment, showing their lack of respect for their customers, which in turn means I now have the same lack of respect for them..

           

          Whoever has a Tablet that had 1.4.0 originally on it, and wanted side-rooting, I encourage you to look at rooting.. I would imagine the developers on the xda forum understand that some trying the root will not be so technically advanced, and will take the patience to help you out, if you need to get some clarification to the directions given.

            • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
              roustabout

              " the new ones that come with 1.4.1 already loaded are not hackable.."

               

              Is this true?  My impression is that you can buy one of those, install 1.4.0 from an SD card via Adam's method (for the time being, at least) and then root the device.   

               

              I think they'll need at least one more OTA update to block people from loading 1.4.0.  

               

              Also, did anyone else catch the coverage this week of the utility which HTC now makes available for a big swathe of its devices?  The utility unlocks the bootloader and essentially voids the warranty (they leave themselves a bit of wiggle room to cover some failures if they're convinced that it wasn't rooting that made the trouble.)

               

              http://www.dailytech.com/HTC+Begrudgingly+Allows+Bootloader+Unlocking/article23633.htm 

              • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
                DeanGibson

                moose_tracker wrote:

                ... the new ones that come with 1.4.1 already loaded are not hackable.



                I'm not sure what you mean by "hackable".  If you are referring to being able to sideload, that's partly true.

                 

                If you are referring to being able to be rooted, there is currently no evidence of that (except for one poster on the XDA-devs forum that can't get the downgrade to 1.4.0 to work, and wonders if his SDcard is broken because it "won't boot" on the NT).

                 

                On the NC, a factory reset always took you back to the version that was installed on the NC at the time of manufacture (unless you took it in to a B&N store to be repartitioned).  On the NT, it appears (from my experience) that once you upgrade your NT to 1.4.1, that newer version becomes the "factory reset" version.  However, that doesn't currently prevent anyone from going back to 1.4.0.

                 

                Now, it may be true that actual factory-new 1.4.1 models won't be able to revert to 1.4.0.  However, there's no real evidence of that, and the available evidence suggests otherwise.

                 

                In short, we will have to see.

                 

                  • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
                    moose_tracker

                    Dean Wrote : 

                    Now, it may be true that actual factory-new 1.4.1 models won't be able to revert to 1.4.0.  However, there's no real evidence of that, and the available evidence suggests otherwise.

                     

                     

                    That was what I was refering to.. I hear that if you bought one now they are already preloaded with 1.4.1.. So if you have a 1.4.0 that will be read & processed from the SD, to help those buying 1.4.1 tablets.. Good for you.. There will be people who will be happy for that.

                     

                    Not my cuppa  mind you.. I am now more going to wait it out for the perfect device that meets all my needs, including starting out completely open..  I waited years until I thought I saw that the Nook met all my needs. Now it doesn't so it went back, and I will wait for a better device to jump in with.. With a company that is more customer oriented (hopefully)...

                • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
                  Personally, I had no intention of rooting my NT. However, I would have liked to install Citrix, and a couple other apps that aren't available on Amazon. My company's server appears to not work with the current version of Citrix, but there's no use working to fix that since I probably wouldn't be able to update the client if I needed to. That's not really why I bought the NT, though. I tend to agree with Dean and a few others, that a deal with Netflix or some other content provider has forced them into this, so complaining until they fix it(un-fix it?) will go nowhere. I just ran DVD Catalyst for the first time yesterday, and the results were fantastic. I'm actually surprised now that Netflix let BN put an sdcard slot in it. And maybe this is one reason why Netflix wanted to get out of the physical DVD rental business.
                  • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors

                    My first post here. I just wanted to say that originally I had no intention of rooting my device, but a big thank you to the folks over at XDA for all their development and then going through the effort to provide good instructions. I spent a lot of time reviewing the instructions and browsing the forums over there before I started. I have some PC experience, not vast and no previous Android experience. Overall, I'm pretty happy with my nifty 7" tablet, I have the ability to install a decent browser and e-mail app and maintain my B&N experience.

                    • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
                      OHCholla

                      As a non-techie, I gotta first say thanks for all the effort you guys have been putting into cracking the NT.  From the outside it seems like you guys have magical powers, and like Santa Claus, you're always going to find a way to get the job done.  But maybe realistically it just isn't possible.

                       

                      So is rooting the only way to go with the NT?  My fantasy world involved a NT with the capability to run the N2A card.  Realistically, is that never ever going to happen?  Not having Kindle and Overdrive apps is a deal-breaker for me, so I'm trying to decide whether to just chuck the idea of buying a NT and wait for another price drop on a refurbished Nook Color, or even go with a KF (eek!).

                       

                      The whole thing is just frustrating.  The anti-sideloaders say that the NT wasn't advertised with that ability and it was "just a bug", but given BN's tacit approval of the hacking, modding, etc. on the Nook Color, it's not at all unreasonable for a consumer to buy the NT believing there would be at least a little flexibility in customizing the NT.  Add that to the NT release where the BN honchos presented the Tablet as an improvement to "Amazon's vending machine" and it really appears that the company was presenting the Tablet as more open that it truly is.  And Netflix is now available on the NC.  So why is Netflix supposedly the reason the Tablet is locked down?  Now the Kindle Fire owners have the inferior product but they can sideload their apps, which makes it looks so much more attractive.  I suppose I should just let me money do the talking and buy something other than a Nook, but I really want BN to succeed with this, so I keep hoping something magical will happen, either some way to open up the sideloading or make it dual-bootable like the NC.  Ahh, dreams...

                        • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors

                          To respond as best as possible to your questions,

                           

                          The locked bootloader door has been opened just slightly on the NT by the sorcerers at XDA.  At this point in time you can't walk through it but you can see inside, which means it's only a matter of time.

                          Also there are a couple of methods of reverting your Tab to 1.4.0, blocking OTA updates from B&N and enabling sideloading. 

                          Even with the update to 1.4.1 any apps you have previously sideloaded will still work although you can't sideload any additional apps.  Many have avoided the update and loaded the apps they want.

                           

                          I'm very disappointed with the B&N decision making process and I've weighed my options carefully and I've decided to keep the Nook Tablet.  My reasons for doing so is as follows.

                           

                          1.  Faith.........I have faith that the devs and hackers will ultimately optimize the device irregardless of the steps B&N takes.  After all, that's what devs and hackers do and they are very good at it.  They do it for the love of the challenge and not for the paycheck.  Love trumps paychek every time, IMO.

                           

                          2.  Faith........Faith that B&N will see the light.  Right now the Nook Tab has all the features that one would want in a combo e-reader/tablet.  Lightning fast processor, unlimited storage, great viewing screen.  It's unquestionably the best 7" device on the market at it's price point.  For B&N to lock it down to just a B&N e-reader is akin to someone throwing away all the gold in their pocket because it's too heavy.  I think in the end they will rethink that decision.  In fact I'm banking on it.

                           

                          So I'm keeping mine.  Early on I enabled sideloading and loaded all the apps I wanted to make it my own special device.  I'm now in the process of rooting and disabling the OTAs for now.  Shortly, I'm convinced that I'll be able to just load CM7 with an SD as is done with the nook color and have one kick-ass tablet with great capabilities.

                          • Re: Rooting: It's too late to close the barn doors
                            moose_tracker

                            OHCholla wrote:

                            So is rooting the only way to go with the NT?  My fantasy world involved a NT with the capability to run the N2A card. 

                            _________________________________________________________________________________

                             

                            Mohawkx wrote in another thread:

                            Yes!  It will be a great year in 2012 for B&N and Nook Tablet owners.  The boys over at XDA have just now cracked the locked bootloader.  Expect to see totally open architecture loadable using just an SD card in the next few days.  B&N will sell NTs by the bushel basket once the word gets out.  You won't be able to keep them in stock.

                             

                            To which I asked if this would take rooting in order to  get the boot drive to unlock, or would it allow people to use the boot drive as they do in the NC..

                             

                            DeanGibson responded:

                            Once the bootloader is cracked, what's left on the NT (except for the NT's serial number, MAC address, and a few administrative items) will be irrelevant.

                             

                            But don't get too excited.  We aren't there quite yet.

                             

                            (its on page 4 of the thread Here's to the Nook Tablet and BN in 2012),,,

                             

                            All I can say is they are hopeful !

                             

                            I just hope if they do it, it will get B&N to rethink their position.. The majority of people sideloading a few apps to improve their experience, is much better then a majority that bypass their whole OS & ecosystem in order to add on a few apps..  Then let the small amount who will root no matter what you do, go about their buisness in a smaller percentage..